Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Anuna]

I think part of it is simply wanting to do better, cooler things with the character than what the writers/producers did with her on the show. And I have no problem with that. Heck, wanting to do that was the driving force behind the choices I made for where she ended up in my Big Bang fic. Certainly, in AUs like West Gate and Stargate!Ren, Elizabeth is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. She makes mistakes, bad stuff happens to her, so it's not all wall-to-wall Goddess of Perfection.

I find the stuff you did in your fic different.

[Scary Kitty]

I didn't see your Elizabeth as some kind of superhero though...she was still very human

Spoiler:

(I mean, superheroes don't have emotional breakdowns and bash the crap outta stuff....people do though)

imo....and I loved her in your fic!

Hah!

Spoiler:

I so wanted her to have a breakdown and just go on a ranting screaming fit. After everything she had been through, I think I'd be worried for her sanity if she didn't go on a tear.

I find the stuff you did in your fic different.

Hee! *huggles*

Spoiler:

Though given where she's at in the story now, there's plenty of potential to see Super!Lizzie kickin' ass in the future.

[drewandian]

Hah!

Spoiler:

I so wanted her to have a breakdown and just go on a ranting screaming fit. After everything she had been through, I think I'd be worried for her sanity if she didn't go on a tear.

Hee! *huggles*

Spoiler:

Though given where she's at in the story now, there's plenty of potential to see Super!Lizzie kickin' ass in the future.

Spoiler:

And I love the ranting screaming fit....
I'm working on my Sparky Advent fic right now...and Liz is being a bit cranky...I love pushing those boundaries!

[Anuna]

Hah!

Spoiler:

I so wanted her to have a breakdown and just go on a ranting screaming fit. After everything she had been through, I think I'd be worried for her sanity if she didn't go on a tear.

Hee! *huggles*

Spoiler:

Though given where she's at in the story now, there's plenty of potential to see Super!Lizzie kickin' ass in the future.

Your fic was very realistic in the regard of what happened to Elizabeth and how she could/would react. I loved that part, not everyone dares doing something like that in a fic.

[Scary Kitty]

Spoiler:

And I love the ranting screaming fit....
I'm working on my Sparky Advent fic right now...and Liz is being a bit cranky...I love pushing those boundaries!

Heheheh!

Spoiler:

I love Cranky!Lizzie! Especially when she's got John around to help her de-stress.

Your fic was very realistic in the regard of what happened to Elizabeth and how she could/would react. I loved that part, not everyone dares doing something like that in a fic.

Ahhh, isn't it fun to unload all sorts of crazy OMFG bombshells on your poor unsuspecting characters and then watch them try to deal with it. Now that's drama. *high-fives*

[Probie]

Torri is so gorgeous! I want to see Jordan in NCIS again.
The story was sad. Poor Ducky. And I add: Mark Harmon is really really really charming.
Please NCIS producers, bring back Jordan and Torry!!! Don't be like TPTB!!!

[Southern Red]

Oh please. It's like saying "Voldemort" in Harry Potter's world. Call the thing by it's name. I was born in ex Yugoslavia. That country was better in many things than the one I live in now. The "S" thing wasn't so scary as you might think, and yes, our healthcare is very good. I am familiar with US politics up to some level, but I would never tell you "you're right about this and wrong about that". That would be unfair and uncalled for. I don't live there, but you do.

If I ever write a fic like that it's going to stay at my journal and will never be published anywhere else because I had enough wank already, caused by a really innocent topic (when compared to politics). So.

Thanks for that. Everyone is a bit cranky right now in the political arena. LOL I wish everyone was as accepting and tactful as you are.

And speaking of wank, just think of the reaction if TPTB had gotten brave and had Elizabeth do things as morally dubious as John did on several occasions. Well, actually it couldn't have gotten much worse because she was blamed for the whole Michael fiasco even though Carson verbally took responsibility in canon. And just recently I read a description on another forum of John as being a psycho. So who knows how people react to things.

[Anuna]

Thanks for that. Everyone is a bit cranky right now in the political arena. LOL I wish everyone was as accepting and tactful as you are.

And speaking of wank, just think of the reaction if TPTB had gotten brave and had Elizabeth do things as morally dubious as John did on several occasions. Well, actually it couldn't have gotten much worse because she was blamed for the whole Michael fiasco even though Carson verbally took responsibility in canon. And just recently I read a description on another forum of John as being a psycho. So who knows how people react to things.

I'd ask them to define a psycho (it's the same thing as saying to jack Hodgins something is "dirt". LOL If you watch Bones, youll get my lame joke). What is, actually a psycho? A psychopat? John doesn't meet the criteria. If I ever had to diagnose him, I'd say he is seriously neurotic with lots of repressed issues related to father - son relationship (surprise!), and his abandonment fear. That's John Sheppard in a nutshell.

I was trained to be tactful

Just kidding, honey. I wish people were more tactful, you know? Most of our problems would have been solved easily.

[Anuna]

Torri is so gorgeous! I want to see Jordan in NCIS again.
The story was sad. Poor Ducky. And I add: Mark Harmon is really really really charming.
Please NCIS producers, bring back Jordan and Torry!!! Don't be like TPTB!!!

Was that Torri as Ducky's ex girlfriend ep? I absolutely hated what they did to her hair, make up and clothing in that one.

[Erin87]

I actually copied and pasted each fic into Word and fiddled with custom fonts and formatting to make 'em look even prettier.

Yup. That's sorta what I did too. Light in the Dark has a fancy font for chapter headings and page numbers and everything.

im surprised during Doppelganger Evil Sheppard didn't mention Elizabeth to Our John.

Yeah... I could have sworn that evil Rodney or one of the other people in the vision actually did, but now thinking about it I'm pretty sure that that was in a fic.

Here's a fic where she is in the vision. My Doppleganger Almost Killed Me

And, if she had pigtails, he'd totally be pulling them all the time...boys are goobers! lol

Heehee! Oh, that so makes me want to draw a picture of them as kids!

I didn't see your Elizabeth as some kind of superhero though...she was still very human

Spoiler:

(I mean, superheroes don't have emotional breakdowns and bash the crap outta stuff....people do though)

imo....and I loved her in your fic!

ITA on that. That was one of the many parts that I loved.

[Infinite-Possibilities]

Doppelganger was the first episodes they shot too. Since Torri had to show up in the other early episodes, wouldn't she have been able to did that one too? It was a fairly early episode so even if they didn't want to mention her for most of season 4, adding her in a couple scenes would have not really interfered with that plan. Maybe they just didn't think about her at all.

You could possibly argue the point that the entity was trying to convince John that all the things he was showing him were actually happening, and therefore Elizabeth suddenly showing up would have tipped him off early, but he didn't seem to bother keeping up that charade for too much time.

Watching Season 4 is because the writers seemed to be entirely oblivious to the huge void in the cast. I'm not sure why, even though she took over her role, Carter never seemed appear anywhere near as much as Elizabeth did.

It's been my experience that whenever there is a big void in a show like that (temporarily or permanently) you can often make it work by having the characters themselves step up and deal with it too. With Season 4, the PTB appeared to be of the opinion that everything was so much better without her.

I think TPTB did have a vague desire to continue with Weir's story but it was very low on their list of priorities. I mean even Jonas got one episode where he returned.

I used to think that the primary obstacle to Torri coming back was the actress's reluctance, not the TPTB's. And while I think there may have been a time where that was the case, I imagine the PTB are probably not happy about even mentioning her anymore than in passing anymore.

[Anuna]

Doppelganger was the first episodes they shot too. Since Torri had to show up in the other early episodes, wouldn't she have been able to did that one too? It was a fairly early episode so even if they didn't want to mention her for most of season 4, adding her in a couple scenes would have not really interfered with that plan. Maybe they just didn't think about her at all.

You could possibly argue the point that the entity was trying to convince John that all the things he was showing him were actually happening, and therefore Elizabeth suddenly showing up would have tipped him off early, but he didn't seem to bother keeping up that charade for too much time.

Watching Season 4 is because the writers seemed to be entirely oblivious to the huge void in the cast. I'm not sure why, even though she took over her role, Carter never seemed appear anywhere near as much as Elizabeth did.

It's been my experience that whenever there is a big void in a show like that (temporarily or permanently) you can often make it work by having the characters themselves step up and deal with it too. With Season 4, the PTB appeared to be of the opinion that everything was so much better without her.

I think TPTB did have a vague desire to continue with Weir's story but it was very low on their list of priorities. I mean even Jonas got one episode where he returned.

I used to think that the primary obstacle to Torri coming back was the actress's reluctance, not the TPTB's. And while I think there may have been a time where that was the case, I imagine the PTB are probably not happy about even mentioning her anymore than in passing anymore.

I think JF said it well - they simply didn't want her. It feels like they decided to give the characters selective amnesia, and the spell didn't work on John, so he walked around with a widower face.

[Probie]

Was that Torri as Ducky's ex girlfriend ep? I absolutely hated what they did to her hair, make up and clothing in that one.

This episode: link . I was just happy to see her. She always wears red clothes. I still think she's beautiful even in this episode.
My dad was happy to see her too. He said "Wait, this is the sci fi hot woman. I want to sleep but I have to watch it now." My dad is in love with her.lol

[drewandian]

Thanks for that. Everyone is a bit cranky right now in the political arena. LOL I wish everyone was as accepting and tactful as you are.

And speaking of wank, just think of the reaction if TPTB had gotten brave and had Elizabeth do things as morally dubious as John did on several occasions. Well, actually it couldn't have gotten much worse because she was blamed for the whole Michael fiasco even though Carson verbally took responsibility in canon. And just recently I read a description on another forum of John as being a psycho. So who knows how people react to things.

Oh, I think Elizabeth had her moments where she came VERY close to crossing that moral line..."Critical Mass" for example...and Carson verbally took responsibility in Michael, but didn't she tell him that if anyone was at fault, she was for giving him the OK to go ahead with the whole thing anyway?

[Scary Kitty]

Torri is so gorgeous! I want to see Jordan in NCIS again.
The story was sad. Poor Ducky. And I add: Mark Harmon is really really really charming.
Please NCIS producers, bring back Jordan and Torry!!! Don't be like TPTB!!!

Yeah! We want to see Jordan!

Was that Torri as Ducky's ex girlfriend ep? I absolutely hated what they did to her hair, make up and clothing in that one.

As far as we know, Jordan was a friend. Maybe a romantic interest, but it appeared to be left open-ended enough that viewers could make their own interpretation of it. I didn't like her stick-straight hair... though she was totally rockin' those knee-high boots in that one scene with Gibbs and Ducky!

Thanks for that. Everyone is a bit cranky right now in the political arena. LOL I wish everyone was as accepting and tactful as you are.

And speaking of wank, just think of the reaction if TPTB had gotten brave and had Elizabeth do things as morally dubious as John did on several occasions. Well, actually it couldn't have gotten much worse because she was blamed for the whole Michael fiasco even though Carson verbally took responsibility in canon. And just recently I read a description on another forum of John as being a psycho. So who knows how people react to things.

John's a psycho? Wow, I guess some people really don't like him!

I'd ask them to define a psycho (it's the same thing as saying to jack Hodgins something is "dirt". LOL If you watch Bones, youll get my lame joke). What is, actually a psycho? A psychopat? John doesn't meet the criteria. If I ever had to diagnose him, I'd say he is seriously neurotic with lots of repressed issues related to father - son relationship (surprise!), and his abandonment fear. That's John Sheppard in a nutshell.

I was trained to be tactful

Just kidding, honey. I wish people were more tactful, you know? Most of our problems would have been solved easily.

Now that sounds like John, to a T.

Doppelganger was the first episodes they shot too. Since Torri had to show up in the other early episodes, wouldn't she have been able to did that one too? It was a fairly early episode so even if they didn't want to mention her for most of season 4, adding her in a couple scenes would have not really interfered with that plan. Maybe they just didn't think about her at all.

That's it, in a nutshell.

You could possibly argue the point that the entity was trying to convince John that all the things he was showing him were actually happening, and therefore Elizabeth suddenly showing up would have tipped him off early, but he didn't seem to bother keeping up that charade for too much time.

Watching Season 4 is because the writers seemed to be entirely oblivious to the huge void in the cast. I'm not sure why, even though she took over her role, Carter never seemed appear anywhere near as much as Elizabeth did.

It's been my experience that whenever there is a big void in a show like that (temporarily or permanently) you can often make it work by having the characters themselves step up and deal with it too. With Season 4, the PTB appeared to be of the opinion that everything was so much better without her.

I think TPTB did have a vague desire to continue with Weir's story but it was very low on their list of priorities. I mean even Jonas got one episode where he returned.

I used to think that the primary obstacle to Torri coming back was the actress's reluctance, not the TPTB's. And while I think there may have been a time where that was the case, I imagine the PTB are probably not happy about even mentioning her anymore than in passing anymore.

Well, Torri's reluctance to come back for GitM was due to TPTW's reluctance to actually come up with a solid resolution for the storyline. She's publicly stated that she wanted to give the character and the fans closure, but she felt that GitM wouldn't do that (and sure enough, it didn't) and that TPTW didn't seem to know where they were going with the story (which Mallozzi later confirmed). TPTW no doubt don't want to talk about it because they don't like being reminded about how they screwed up.