General Ship ( Relationship) Discussion

[Shipperahoy]

I'm sure that shippers would prefer Jack and Sam get together. That's understandable. But, do you think overall, if the hints hadn't gotten broader, it wouldn't have been as important to see it on the show? I mean, see them get together as a couple? If the hints had stayed at a certain level, would they have been enough? You might be able to enjoy it for what it was, instead of getting worked up (maybe not the best description) for something that they kept hinting might happen later, no later, no later?

Ummm...that's kind of a tough question. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that. However, I think that if it hadn't been played up so much (i.e. the ever increasing lack of subtlety regarding the ship and the way that it was played up by TPTB and the actors themselves to an extent) then I would have been content with the subtle flirtation. The more it's played up the more you expect. When it's just subtle flirtation and maybe a few sidelong glances and no more you don't really expect a whole lot from that. When it gets to the point of AU kisses and declarations of feelings (even though I realize that not everybody saw the D&C declaration the same way) then you start to expect something to actually come of it. Does that make any sense?

[Madeleine]

Yup, that makes sense.

How much do you think the various chats and interviews where RDA, AT and assorted PTBs spoke about the ship affected your views / expectations?

[Shipperahoy]

Yup, that makes sense.

How much do you think the various chats and interviews where RDA, AT and assorted PTBs spoke about the ship affected your views / expectations?

Well they definately helped to build expectations. If you see interviews in which the actors themselves hint to the relationship and make it appear as though they enjoy playing with that scenario and/or that they want those characters to eventually be together then it makes you think that there's actually more chance of that happening vs. if it's just something that you're seeing on the show with nothing else to back it up.

[Dani347]

Ummm...that's kind of a tough question. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that. However, I think that if it hadn't been played up so much (i.e. the ever increasing lack of subtlety regarding the ship and the way that it was played up by TPTB and the actors themselves to an extent) then I would have been content with the subtle flirtation. The more it's played up the more you expect. When it's just subtle flirtation and maybe a few sidelong glances and no more you don't really expect a whole lot from that. When it gets to the point of AU kisses and declarations of feelings (even though I realize that not everybody saw the D&C declaration the same way) then you start to expect something to actually come of it. Does that make any sense?

Yes, it does. And, I realize answering the question after all this time is hard. But, it sounds the way I felt about Daniel/Janet. There was no encouragement, so I just enjoyed what was there. Of course, I didn't really see any ship until Lifeboat, and then after that, when I saw 2010 (I think that's the episode) the interaction between them looked different than it had the first time. But, I never expected more than just little glimpses interpreted my way.

[Shipperahoy]

I thought it might be perhaps time to bring this back to the front page considdering Joe's most recent answer to ship questions in his thread. Some people are happy with the fact that Joe has now pretty openly dismissed the Sam/Jack ship and think that this should suffice to satisy all the shippers questions while others still want a satisfying answer as to why something that's been built up for all these years is being kicked to the curb like yesterdays garbage. As most can tell I fall into the latter category

So post away. Vent, discuss, debate. I myself find myself quite surprised at how dismissive and quite frankly kind of rude Joe is being over this subject. While I certainly do understand that he may be very frustrated over being costantly questioned on the subject he never seemed to think it was uninteresting before. Of course that was before a certain pleather clad poster girl for dominatrix's came into the picture. Now, I don't hate the Vala character...I don't love her either. I think she could actually become an interesting multi-dimensional character if they make her a bit more real and follow up on her past as a Gou'ald and what it's done to her emotionally but I think that other characters and stories have been pushed to the background since her arrival on the scene

[Dani347]

Could Joe give any answer that doesn't amount to "yes, there will be a definite indication that Jack and Sam are together" that would have shippers feel the question has been answered as fully as it can possibly be, although not the way they want?

[Shipperahoy]

Could Joe give any answer that doesn't amount to "yes, there will be a definite indication that Jack and Sam are together" that would have shippers feel the question has been answered as fully as it can possibly be, although not the way they want?

While I'd certainly prefer that he answer in an affirmative fashion (i.e. Sam and Jack are DEFINATELY together) I would be satisfied if he answered definatively in a negative fashion as well. As long as it was a clear cut definate answer. Saying that they've (TPTB) moved on to bigger and better things doesn't say anything as to whether they've resolved the issue, just that they're going to let it stand as is and I find that frustrating. If Joe came online and said "They're not together and they never will be because..." then I would not be happy but I would be satisfied that the question had finally been answered.

[Shep'sSocks]

But how to phrase the question in such a way that will get a definitive answer?

[Dani347]

Maybe I'm just viewing this from my own ornery way of thinking, but if I wanted shippy scenes in the show, I would be very wary of asking about it over and over. If I was in charge of the show, it would be the very frequency of the questions that would set my mind to never have ship. In fact, if I was teetering on the brink of ship or no ship, that would set me firmly in the no ship line. But, maybe tptb aren't as obstinate as I am. One can only hope. Or, not hope, in my case.

[Shep'sSocks]

You mean, "Whinge and ye shall receive for TPTB will cave" ... ?

[Easter Lily]

I think it's a Catch 22 situation for Joe... If he gives a direct answer, he's perceived to be rude. If he gives an indirect answer, he's perceived to be evasive. So what kind of answer is he expected to give that will make people happy? The question was asked why the writers and producers have given up on this arc and he has come right out and said that it's pretty low on their priorities. I'd say it's an answer... it's not the one that S/J supporters want to hear but it's an answer.

Maybe I'm just viewing this from my own ornery way of thinking, but if I wanted shippy scenes in the show, I would be very wary of asking about it over and over. If I was in charge of the show, it would be the very frequency of the questions that would set my mind to never have ship. In fact, if I was teetering on the brink of ship or no ship, that would set me firmly in the no ship line. But, maybe tptb aren't as obstinate as I am. One can only hope. Or, not hope, in my case.

I'm with you Dani... if my child pushes all my buttons repeatedly (which she does) I'm more inclined to say "no" than to say yes... and send her to her room. I'm actually surprised that Joe even gave an answer this time.

[Shep'sSocks]

I think it's a Catch 22 situation for Joe... If he gives a direct answer, he's perceived to be rude. If he gives an indirect answer, he's perceived to be evasive. So what kind of answer is he expected to give that will make people happy? The questioned was asked why the writers and producers have given up on this arc and he has come right out and said that it's pretty low on their priorities. I'd say it's an answer... it's not the one that S/J supporters want to hear but it's an answer.

The answer they want is the one answer Joe is unlikely to provide.

[Shep'sSocks]

So I was just wondering if they had Sam and Jack just get together with no real fanfare and then they were just together but the storylines didn't focus on it would you still hate it?

Or if they completely stopped the overt ship and just had them get together at the end? That is what I've always wanted. The subtle UST that could be read either way and then they could be together at the end of the series. To me that wouldn't take away from the storylines or the other characters arcs.

Actually, it's not so much ship that I hate, it's the querilous tones that it be addressed, that Joe give a definitive answer of whether Sam and Jack are together. It's called leaving a storyline open yet some can't leave it alone. It's like a two-year-old picking at a sore.

[Agent_Dark]

I'm not a fan of ship, and wouldn't mind at all if the Sam/Jack thing was never brought up again, but I do think they way Joe answered that question in his thread was a bit dodgy.

To be perfectly honest, there are more interesting and important stories to tell at this point.

I don't know if its just me, but I read that as Joe basically dismissing the ship - and by extension the fans of it... I know I'd be a bit miffed if he said something like that about an aspect I like on the show...

[Shep'sSocks]

He's not dismissing it, he's not doing anything other than leaving the storyline open in case they want to do something down the track.