Jack O'Neill/ Sam Carter - Part of a team, not a ship

[Frostfox]

LOL!

BUT ummm....NO!

SMOR (Sam/Thor) is the one true ship that rules them all!!!


Carry on.

Laughs! Well, it's got more chemistry than Sam/Jack, that's for sure.

Sam/Thor it is!

/

FF

[Callista]

There must be at least ONE of all the infinitude of AUs which has the MOTHER OF ALL SHIPS!!!!

Lantash/Martouf/Sam/Jolinar/Jack/Kanan/Freya/Daniel/Anise/Thor

Poor Teal'c. He still doesn't get anything. Maybe we could work him and Junior in there somewhere?

[Khentkawes]

Posting quickly from the Vancouver Convention in downtown Burnaby....am sure the subject will be touched upon widely at AT's talk on Sunday....will report back comments and questions if I can when it's all over.....

You absolutely have to tell us how it goes! I'm so jealous of all the con-goers on GW. I demand that all con-goers appease my jealousy by relaying any tid-bits of note. Okay, not really. I'm not that demanding. But I hope you have a wonderful time!

You're forgetting something else! The TRUE LOVE of Jack and Thor!!!1 Thor's passion will not be denied!!!

Gosh, that's a heck of a love.....um.....polygon.

Lantash/Martouf/Sam/Jolinar/Jack/Kanan/Freya/Daniel/Anise/Thor

SMOR (Sam/Thor) is the one true ship that rules them all!!!

I have no words to express my supreme amusement at this moment.

Poor Teal'c. He still doesn't get anything. Maybe we could work him and Junior in there somewhere?

Sure, we'll just stick them in between Kanan and Anise. It turns out Junior always had a thing for Anise (I mean, he is an "immature" symbiote, basically a teenager. And since Anise's character was apparently meant to appeal to adolescent males... ). As for Teal'c... well, he secretly admired Kanan's sense of duty, and that Kanan had the guts to infiltrate Ba'al's fortress. He just never mentioned it because he didn't want Jack to feel uncomfortable, knowing that Teal'c had unrequited feelings for the symbiote he once carried.

Therefore, I give you:

Lantesh/Jolinar/Martouf/Sam/Thor/Jack/Kanan/Tea'lc/Junior/Freya/Daniel/Anise

Oh, and please note that Thor is in between Jack and Sam, because they both seemed to have "feelings" for Thor, and since feelings always means romance, it must be unrequited love (which incidentally, drove Sam and Jack together as they shared their frustration over Thor's refusal to acknowledge his own feelings on the matter... and over Thor's lamentable lack of cooking skills).

Which would make it a love-dodecagon. Yes, that is the technical term for a 12-sided shape. And no, I did not know that off the top of my head, but wikipedia is a many splendored thing.

For the record, folks, nonsense like this is the result of very little sleep. Just as a disclaimer. Now I return you to your regularly scheduled programing.

[Snotr]

I have no words to express my supreme amusement at this moment.



Sure, we'll just stick them in between Kanan and Anise. It turns out Junior always had a thing for Anise (I mean, he is an "immature" symbiote, basically a teenager. And since Anise's character was apparently meant to appeal to adolescent males... ). As for Teal'c... well, he secretly admired Kanan's sense of duty, and that Kanan had the guts to infiltrate Ba'al's fortress. He just never mentioned it because he didn't want Jack to feel uncomfortable, knowing that Teal'c had unrequited feelings for the symbiote he once carried.

Therefore, I give you:

Lantesh/Jolinar/Martouf/Sam/Thor/Jack/Kanan/Tea'lc/Junior/Freya/Daniel/Anise

Oh, and please note that Thor is in between Jack and Sam, because they both seemed to have "feelings" for Thor, and since feelings always means romance, it must be unrequited love (which incidentally, drove Sam and Jack together as they shared their frustration over Thor's refusal to acknowledge his own feelings on the matter... and over Thor's lamentable lack of cooking skills).

Which would make it a love-dodecagon. Yes, that is the technical term for a 12-sided shape. And no, I did not know that off the top of my head, but wikipedia is a many splendored thing.

For the record, folks, nonsense like this is the result of very little sleep. Just as a disclaimer. Now I return you to your regularly scheduled programing.

This is just too funny I want to see this ship! I want to read fic about it...ROFL...oh, and I LOVE the idea of Kanan/Teal'c and Junior/Anise/Freya!

[Frostfox]

Sure, we'll just stick them in between Kanan and Anise. It turns out Junior always had a thing for Anise (I mean, he is an "immature" symbiote, basically a teenager. And since Anise's character was apparently meant to appeal to adolescent males... ). As for Teal'c... well, he secretly admired Kanan's sense of duty, and that Kanan had the guts to infiltrate Ba'al's fortress. He just never mentioned it because he didn't want Jack to feel uncomfortable, knowing that Teal'c had unrequited feelings for the symbiote he once carried.

Therefore, I give you:

Lantesh/Jolinar/Martouf/Sam/Thor/Jack/Kanan/Tea'lc/Junior/Freya/Daniel/Anise

Oh, and please note that Thor is in between Jack and Sam, because they both seemed to have "feelings" for Thor, and since feelings always means romance, it must be unrequited love (which incidentally, drove Sam and Jack together as they shared their frustration over Thor's refusal to acknowledge his own feelings on the matter... and over Thor's lamentable lack of cooking skills).

Which would make it a love-dodecagon. Yes, that is the technical term for a 12-sided shape. And no, I did not know that off the top of my head, but wikipedia is a many splendored thing.

For the record, folks, nonsense like this is the result of very little sleep. Just as a disclaimer. Now I return you to your regularly scheduled programing.

Laughs. Why, your writing has a level of sophistication, wit and humour... why don't you write a TV show?
Heh, poking fun at S/J is like shooting fish in a barrel though, it's such an easy target!

FF

[fyere]

Therefore, I give you:

Lantesh/Jolinar/Martouf/Sam/Thor/Jack/Kanan/Tea'lc/Junior/Freya/Daniel/Anise

Oh, and please note that Thor is in between Jack and Sam, because they both seemed to have "feelings" for Thor, and since feelings always means romance, it must be unrequited love (which incidentally, drove Sam and Jack together as they shared their frustration over Thor's refusal to acknowledge his own feelings on the matter... and over Thor's lamentable lack of cooking skills).

Ever considered that Thor has such sizzling chemistry with both Jack and Sam because...he's played by Michael Shanks?

Something to dwell on. *dwells*

Okay, dwelling time over. So, recent developments on the S/J front...AT in her Q&A on Mallozzi's blog states what I've believed all along...that Sam and Jack haven't done anything yet because Jack isn't yet retired.

And Jack, far from being retired, (spoilers from Vancouver)

Spoiler:

has supposedly been promoted to a *three-star* general for his guest appearance(s) on SGU? Which means...what does that mean? He's the head of Homeworld Security already - how much higher can he go? Supreme Commander of All Secret Stuff in the Entire World? And what does his moving up in the ranks signify - that they're getting ready to let him retire, or that they need him around even longer than ever?

Either way, it's riskier and sillier than ever for S&J to attempt the kind of ~sekrit clandestine long-distance affair~ some shippers squee over.

Poor Jack. All he ever wanted was to go home and watch Simpsons reruns.

[Frostfox]

Ever considered that Thor has such sizzling chemistry with both Jack and Sam because...he's played by Michael Shanks?

Something to dwell on. *dwells*

Ah!!!! Hadn't thought of that!!!!

Okay, dwelling time over. So, recent developments on the S/J front...AT in her Q&A on Mallozzi's blog states what I've believed all along...that Sam and Jack haven't done anything yet because Jack isn't yet retired.

And Jack, far from being retired, (spoilers from Vancouver)

Spoiler:

has supposedly been promoted to a *three-star* general for his guest appearance(s) on SGU? Which means...what does that mean? He's the head of Homeworld Security already - how much higher can he go? Supreme Commander of All Secret Stuff in the Entire World? And what does his moving up in the ranks signify - that they're getting ready to let him retire, or that they need him around even longer than ever?

Either way, it's riskier and sillier than ever for S&J to attempt the kind of ~sekrit clandestine long-distance affair~ some shippers squee over.

Poor Jack. All he ever wanted was to go home and watch Simpsons reruns.

Spoilers for talk of 3rd film.

Spoiler:

I hope the writers have enough respect for the USAF not to have them shagging until they aren't serving officers. Well, I really hope they don't have them making the beast with two backs at all! But as I've seen what TPTB think is a 'romantic' story, I'm fairly sure film three is, at the very least, going to imply that Sam Gets Her Man (whether he wants to be got or not, is another matter).
Though the spoilers for Universe again show how aware TPTB are of the drawing power of RDA, I can understand why they don't want to cut themselves off from that by retiring Jack.

But by the time they do stop flogging the dead horse, Jack, Sam and the fans will all be drawing their pensions. There are whole areas of fandom, those who started watching in season's 9 and 10 for an example who have no interest, and that's not to mention the whole swathes of fandom from earlier seasons who's interest runs to other areas of the show.

FF

[Khentkawes]

This is just too funny I want to see this ship! I want to read fic about it...ROFL...oh, and I LOVE the idea of Kanan/Teal'c and Junior/Anise/Freya!

Those relationships have about as much potential as anything I've seen on the show. And given the oddities of fanfic, I'm shocked no one has come up with this yet!

Laughs. Why, your writing has a level of sophistication, wit and humour... why don't you write a TV show?

LOL. Well, I'd know how not to write a romantic relationship, at least.

Heh, poking fun at S/J is like shooting fish in a barrel though, it's such an easy target!

It is very easy indeed! Too bad the writers never realized that. They might have changed their approach to the relationship (or lack thereof).

Ever considered that Thor has such sizzling chemistry with both Jack and Sam because...he's played by Michael Shanks?

Something to dwell on. *dwells*

Hmmm... now there's a point I'd never considered. Yes, worthy of contemplation, indeed.

Okay, dwelling time over. So, recent developments on the S/J front...AT in her Q&A on Mallozzi's blog states what I've believed all along...that Sam and Jack haven't done anything yet because Jack isn't yet retired.

And Jack, far from being retired, (spoilers from Vancouver)

Spoiler:

has supposedly been promoted to a *three-star* general for his guest appearance(s) on SGU? Which means...what does that mean? He's the head of Homeworld Security already - how much higher can he go? Supreme Commander of All Secret Stuff in the Entire World? And what does his moving up in the ranks signify - that they're getting ready to let him retire, or that they need him around even longer than ever?

Either way, it's riskier and sillier than ever for S&J to attempt the kind of ~sekrit clandestine long-distance affair~ some shippers squee over.

Poor Jack. All he ever wanted was to go home and watch Simpsons reruns.

Is this good news for us, or bad news for us? I never can tell.

Spoilers for SGU (or GW's news story ), and minor ones for SGA's Trio and Enemy at the Gate

Spoiler:

I personally think that Jack as a three star general (in SGU) disproves everything that the shippers have been saying. Jack is by no means ready to retire. If he was, he would have done so by now. I think Jack's career means far more to him than most fans seem to give him credit for. Sure, he retired before and made numerous references to retirement, but he never seemed to get serious about it. At least that's my opinion. And I doubt the Air Force would promote Jack to a three star just so he could retire afterwards. Plus, if the extended-cannon-according-to-Joe-Mallozzi is to be believed, Sam said in the deleted scene for Trio that her "long-distance relationship" involved a guy in Washington who was going to retire soon. Well, that was quite a while ago. Since then, Continuum had come and gone, Sam's been given her own command, and Jack's been promoted again. Unless "soon" means something different than what I thought it meant, I don't see any kind of relationship happening with them.

Oh, and by the way, fyere, I'm laughing about your "Supreme Commander of All Secret Stuff in the Entire World" comment.

[Frostfox]

Those relationships have about as much potential as anything I've seen on the show. And given the oddities of fanfic, I'm shocked no one has come up with this yet!

And are more realistic than some relationships on the show....

LOL. Well, I'd know how not to write a romantic relationship, at least.

What? By not making the two protagonists to look like egocentric adolescents with Elektra/power issues?

It is very easy indeed! Too bad the writers never realized that. They might have changed their approach to the relationship (or lack thereof).

Hah, don't bet on it - it's twu luv written in the stars, remember. They wrote a romance which puts all other romance to shame, Romeo and Juliette had nothing on Sam 'n Sir.

Hmmm... now there's a point I'd never considered. Yes, worthy of contemplation, indeed.

Thor love.

Is this good news for us, or bad news for us? I never can tell.

Spoilers for SGU (or GW's news story ), and minor ones for SGA's Trio and Enemy at the Gate

Spoiler:

I personally think that Jack as a three star general (in SGU) disproves everything that the shippers have been saying. Jack is by no means ready to retire. If he was, he would have done so by now. I think Jack's career means far more to him than most fans seem to give him credit for. Sure, he retired before and made numerous references to retirement, but he never seemed to get serious about it. At least that's my opinion. And I doubt the Air Force would promote Jack to a three star just so he could retire afterwards. Plus, if the extended-cannon-according-to-Joe-Mallozzi is to be believed, Sam said in the deleted scene for Trio that her "long-distance relationship" involved a guy in Washington who was going to retire soon. Well, that was quite a while ago. Since then, Continuum had come and gone, Sam's been given her own command, and Jack's been promoted again. Unless "soon" means something different than what I thought it meant, I don't see any kind of relationship happening with them.

Spoilers, just because I can't remember all GW's current spoiler policy so better safe than sorry.

Spoiler:

It's becoming clear, that despite wishful thinking from some corners, Jack's career is as important to him as Sam's is to her. This I applaud. I'd like to think that RDA is proud of Jack's accomplishments, he should be. Throwing it all away so a small part of the fanbase can feel smug seems like a bit of a waste. Particularly as a large part of the same fanbase seemed happy with the end of season 8 and allowed their imaginations to fill in the rest with fanfic and the like, good on them.

A deleted scene is not and never will be canon by all the common definitions of the word. But, as you say, 'soon' implies, well, 'soon' and that episode was shown, what 12 months ago? He's still not retired and has just been promoted.
And didn't Jennifer say 'an older man' and Sam responded by 'not that much older'? Well, as Jack, even by the most conservative estimates is 17 years older than Sam, so 'not that much older' implies a couple of years, maybe five? 17? Er, no, that's old enough to be her father. Imagine what a 17 year old Jack was doing when Sam was born; or rather, don't, it's enough to put you off your lunch. By the time she was five he would have been married to Sara. Just think about it, and why on earth TPTB would think that this could ever be a healthy, normal relationship?

Oh, and by the way, fyere, I'm laughing about your "Supreme Commander of All Secret Stuff in the Entire World" comment.

Shouldn't that be "Supreme Commander of All Sekrit Stuff in teh Entire, Whole Wurld, Evah. Dude"

Okay, wasted enough of the morning, so I'd better be up and at 'em.

FF

[jckfan55]

^Well, to be fair, Jack was written as younger than RDA is. Still there is at least 10-12 years difference in age between the characters. At some point Sam will be stuck wheeling Jack around in his wheelchair while she's still fairly young...

Of course in this culture most people don't bat an eye at an older man-younger woman, but imagine if Sam and jack's age and ranks were reversed?

[Frostfox]

^Well, to be fair, Jack was written as younger than RDA is. Still there is at least 10-12 years difference in age between the characters. At some point Sam will be stuck wheeling Jack around in his wheelchair while she's still fairly young...

Of course in this culture most people don't bat an eye at an older man-younger woman, but imagine if Sam and jack's age and ranks were reversed?

There was a shot of Jack's ID with '52 on it as the year of birth? And Sam was born in 69? Their problem was making Sam so young, with all her (admittedly, bloody wonderful!) achievements, having her being a few years older would have been more realistic (ditto Daniel too).
I didn't have an opinion on the age difference until they introduced Jacob, who looked and acted like a contemporary of Jack's, rather than a potential father in law! It was TPTB shooting themselves and S/J in the foot. Again.

FF

[fyere]

Shouldn't that be "Supreme Commander of All Sekrit Stuff in teh Entire, Whole Wurld, Evah. Dude"

You're right! My oopsie. ALL SEKRIT STUFFS EVAR.

I was going to put 'Supreme Commander of the Asgard Fleet', because Thor wanted to go on vacation for a while and Jack would think it was cool to be O'Neill in command of an O'Neill, but then I remembered....

I didn't have an opinion on the age difference until they introduced Jacob, who looked and acted like a contemporary of Jack's, rather than a potential father in law! It was TPTB shooting themselves and S/J in the foot. Again.

What's that line from that ep that put me off...oh, yeah. "Don't get me wrong, Carter - your dad's great. I love him like a brother." Uhh...

I realized something a while ago concerning Jack's birthdate that kind of surprised me. Consider General Hammond, who was a sparky young Lieutenant in 1969. So he would have been born around, what, 1945 or so? Would 24-25 be about right for a Lieutenant? (Ford is a 1st Lieutenant at age 25, so I'm assuming.) Maybe even younger if he was a 2nd Lieutenant, or precocious and *really* determined to make General one day.

So Jack is born in 1952. General Hammond, beloved team father/grandpa figure, is only *seven years older*, or possibly less, than Jack, dashing romantic hero and Man of Action? Jack calls George, Hank, Jacob his friends. His buddies. His pals. The ol' Generals' club. Now, an age difference in a romantic pairing is all well and good (says the closet Sam/Teal'c shipper - at least he *seems* young! ), but when one of them might as well belong to *the previous generation* and is played by an older actor so at this point, looks it, you've got a little squick goin' on.

No, I don't know why I'm talking like Cam Mitchell. Just ignore that. Though I'm sure he's a little squicked by it, too.

[Frostfox]

What's that line from that ep that put me off...oh, yeah. "Don't get me wrong, Carter - your dad's great. I love him like a brother." Uhh...

I realized something a while ago concerning Jack's birthdate that kind of surprised me. Consider General Hammond, who was a sparky young Lieutenant in 1969. So he would have been born around, what, 1945 or so? Would 24-25 be about right for a Lieutenant? (Ford is a 1st Lieutenant at age 25, so I'm assuming.) Maybe even younger if he was a 2nd Lieutenant, or precocious and *really* determined to make General one day.

So Jack is born in 1952. General Hammond, beloved team father/grandpa figure, is only *seven years older*, or possibly less, than Jack, dashing romantic hero and Man of Action? Jack calls George, Hank, Jacob his friends. His buddies. His pals. The ol' Generals' club. Now, an age difference in a romantic pairing is all well and good (says the closet Sam/Teal'c shipper - at least he *seems* young! ), but when one of them might as well belong to *the previous generation* and is played by an older actor so at this point, looks it, you've got a little squick goin' on.

No, I don't know why I'm talking like Cam Mitchell. Just ignore that. Though I'm sure he's a little squicked by it, too.

Again, it's how Jack was written, how the character was conceived and acted which mad him feel too old for Sam, which emphasised the age difference, rather than glossed over or minimalized it.
I don't think there is an age limit on love (or being a hero for that matter) I just think that too often they went for the supposed 'cute' moment without looking at the wider picture they were painting. It's just creepy.

But there are many, many nails in the S/J coffin, this is just one of them.

FF

[jckfan55]

There was a shot of Jack's ID with '52 on it as the year of birth? And Sam was born in 69? Their problem was making Sam so young, with all her (admittedly, bloody wonderful!) achievements, having her being a few years older would have been more realistic (ditto Daniel too).
I didn't have an opinion on the age difference until they introduced Jacob, who looked and acted like a contemporary of Jack's, rather than a potential father in law! It was TPTB shooting themselves and S/J in the foot. Again.

FF

I could have sworn in S1 Jack said he was 40. And I was assuming Sam was AT's age. Good point on the idea that Jack and Jacob acted like contemporaries or at least equals. Though not sure how else they would act given Jacob's Tokra status. He's not really a general anymore.

[jdjunkie]

So, recent developments on the S/J front...AT in her Q&A on Mallozzi's blog states what I've believed all along...that Sam and Jack haven't done anything yet because Jack isn't yet retired.

Good old AT. Always knew she was on our side.

But honestly. If Sam and Jack are having some sort of clandestine, long-distance wuv affair, as we're being led to believe by some folk, are we also to believe, in deference to the regs, that haven't slept together yet? What are they? Teenagers?

Oh, for a believable, adult relationship ... Jack had one, with Sara, of course. I wish they'd explored that further. I liked and believed in that pairing.