AAARGH SG1 game + ethics

[roswellgray]

[QUOTE=neith4]

but you're not going to alter them by puffing yourself up like you're doing!

recyt all - puffing up

guys and gals - I did not start a discussion on the ethics of shooter games for reasons of vanity or to try to make myself feel - as alleged - superior moralistic or whatever - its not about ego - mine or yours - its about getting people to think the issues - i'm painfully aware the person who tries to walk the talk and practise ethics isnt going to win any popularity stakes !!!

a little respect is good tho ... but unlikely

fine. let's talk essentials. The boys you described in your response post did not get their values or their attitudes from the FPS games. They don't value your opinions. They're indifferent to the real life soldier's plight. They both do and do not aspire to be doctors, firefighters etc depending on the person.

They won't change their ways despite your woe to the world attitude. They and many like them ENJOY, nay REVEL in their games and nothing you say will dissuade the vast majority of them (99.98%) from spending their money on this multiBILLION dollar industry. Violence will NEVER disappear so long as one person is willing to fight. Women will never rule the world (thankfully) so you and others like you will never control male impulses.

You see none here that are also gamers agree with you. Certainly you are entitled to your opinion. Now stew in it alone.

[Hyperspace]

I think there's a difference between DOOM and for instance SW: Dark Forces...one is gorier and bloodier and the aim is to kill, kill, kill...in the other there is still a high body count but there is more of a mission emphasis.

Perhaps a better example is Star Trek: Elite Force where killing is not the aim, actually you can avoid it quite often (stealth missions, etc.)...

[yasmins]

Could you please NOT repeat the entire posting in the reply?

Re: you seem to think that people that love FPS are uneducated morons
- I dare say that many are very educated and working on scientific or related degree or have them already.

Not the gamers I've encontered!

[...]

please come to my netcafe and speak to the Unphilosophical individuals who think their rights as male teen gamers include swearing , using the f word in every other sentence, using the b - word, referring to characters and other players in a homophobic manner calling them ******s and campers etc -

I havnt meet any of these gamers who can take ethical complex positions to justify violent games OFFLINE and I wish some of them worked or played in our netcafe - the only one in the area - so I have no choice to go elsewhere - I would really like to be able to finish my coding without the constant distractions from foul mouthed male teens.

[...]

It sounds like you've had some extremely negative experiences with gamers where you live. However, the venue in which you have chosen to express yourself has a far broader audience than your netcafe. I'm sorry your experiences have been bad, but that really doesn't make it ok to condemn everyone who plays FPS games.

I am an educated woman (MS in comp sci) in my mid-30s. I have a career (write financial software for an investment bank). I have a full life with family and friends and many hobbies. Among those hobbies, I enjoy playing video games including FPS games.

I and the others participating in this thread have been trying to provide examples to you of people and situations in which your stereotypes are just wildly inaccurate. We have been trying to provide examples of how the behavior you describe has always existed independently of these games. However, you don't seem to get it. People play games. Some of them are jerks too. The games aren't making them jerks nor are the games some sort of litmus test in determining who is a jerk.

You need to understand that there is a whole world beyond your netcafe, and those of us out here do not appreciate being lumped in with the immature young men you have had the misfortune of encountering.

Regards,
Yasmin

[yasmins]

Women will never rule the world (thankfully) so you and others like you will never control male impulses.

???

Huh?

[roswellgray]

???

Huh?

neith implies boys = video games = mindless violence = no ethics = women have superior ethics = 2 + 5 = 7 = oops that last part was irrelevant to my point=

[yasmins]

neith implies boys = video games = mindless violence = no ethics = women have superior ethics = 2 + 5 = 7 = oops that last part was irrelevant to my point=

Don't worry. I'm a woman, and when *I* rule the world, I'll let all the mindless boys play as many FPS games as they want. It'll make them easier to distract and control. bwahahahahahaha!

[roswellgray]

Don't worry. I'm a woman, and when *I* rule the world, I'll let all the mindless boys play as many FPS games as they want. It'll make them easier to distract and control. bwahahahahahaha!

pppppphhhhhhhhhhhhbbbbbbbbtttttttttttttttttt

Remember what happened to queen Hashepshut!! *draws finger across throat* Not to mention cleopatra

[Matt G]

Anyway the last FPS I got really into was Rainbow Six, and that does have a pretty big strategy section before you go shooting which you do need to deal with(mission briefing, updates what what's been going on since last mission, selecting squad for mission, splitting squad into teams, selecting weaponary, gameplans for each team and which team you'll go with). Of course when playing with my kid cousins, I had to do all this solo!

[neith4]

fine. let's talk essentials. The boys you described in your response post did not get their values or their attitudes from the FPS games. They don't value your opinions. They're indifferent to the real life soldier's plight. They both do and do not aspire to be doctors, firefighters etc depending on the person.

and could the games possibly be reinforcing their indifference?

They won't change their ways despite your woe to the world attitude. They and many like them ENJOY, nay REVEL in their games and nothing you say will dissuade the vast majority of them (99.98%) from spending their money on this multiBILLION dollar industry. Violence will NEVER disappear so long as one person is willing to fight. Women will never rule the world (thankfully) so you and others like you will never control male impulses.

This is not about controlling male impulses or trying to stop boys from having fun - also pleasure is not the same thing as joy.
No one's saying you cant play just asking you to consider playing more ethically? Channel those impulse sinto something posotive and consider other guys to do so too?!

You see none here that are also gamers agree with you. Certainly you are entitled to your opinion. Now stew in it alone.

Mad - oooh you feel threatened cos an older woman asked you to think about something ethical? Thinking hurts? Being violent is easier?

Maybe I'm the sane logical one and that's why you feel threatened?

Maybe ?

[neith4]

It sounds like you've had some extremely negative experiences with gamers where you live. ... but that really doesn't make it ok to condemn everyone who plays FPS games.

One - I never condemned ALL gamers - one of the replies suggested I had which I hadnt and people seem to have registered this and thought I posted it when I didnt

Two - I and the others participating in this thread have been trying to provide examples to you of people and situations in which your stereotypes are just wildly inaccurate.

Fine there are some gamers who are actually sensible well rounded adults -
but they seem still to me - to be a small minority !!!


Like to come around to my local netcafe and explain to the feral kinder why using the ***** word is uncool? You dont have to put up with them - if you have a job in financial software - you probably have options I dont.

What are those of us surrounded by barbarians supose to do ?

why not try to educate the barbarians or at least make them aware other options are available?

Have you studied Buddhism? Why not turn gaming into a dharma tool or gateway instead of a mere toy?

[neith4]

neith implies boys = video games = mindless violence = no ethics = women have superior ethics = 2 + 5 = 7 = oops that last part was irrelevant to my point=

you have totally misinterpretated what i've been writing!!!

I certainly never said or implied women or myslef have superior ethics

what i've been trying to get across is that we just all think more about ethics !

[LtNOWIS]

The guys around here must be playing different games !

They're sure not using strategy - sample this morning while waiting for net admin to log me on to do email and forum stuff i glanced around the room - groan - i hope none of these guys ever join the military - one of them was apparently driving a tank with the top hatch OPEN!!!

Have you ever played an FPS game? If not, you really wouldn't know how much strategy is involved, and I really don't see how you can claim to. There's the question about whether or not you seek a vehicle, weapon, or power-up, weighing the benefit vs. the time to get it. There's the question of which route of attack to pursue. There's the question of whether to maintain a static shooting postition or taking the fight to the enemy. Granted, these decisions aren't all that deep, but they exist, especially in multiplayer modes. There's more there than in some other genres, and a honed tactical skill is also required.

About the hatch open thing, no game is completely realistic, nor should they be. Many things that work in games would be impossible in real life, and vice versa. That said, the marines once used Doom to build team coordination, and the Army currently makes an FPS game.

While your Net-cafe might be full of jerks, in my experience FPS games are no more immoral, hateful, or foul-mouthed than anybody else. Some of the nicest people I know play such games.

You also once said that people should play games that teach history and strategy if they play any games at all. Well, FPS games can certainly teach history, as effectively as any other genre. Someone could learn a lot about World War II.

I personally don't think FPS games are any more immoral than any other violent game. Is it really less evil to conduct a war on a board than to actually fight? I don't think any FPS games encourage killing civilians, like some other games do. In Doom and Halo, you can play the enitre single player storyline without shooting a single human being Are you familiar with the Grand Theft Auto series, or fighting games like Soul Calibur, Mortal Kombat, or Street Fighter? If so, can you please tell me how you feel about them, so I can better understand your position.

[neith4]

REcyt all argh - my spelling is deteriorating!

maybe I should just give up on logic and just try some violence
no wait better option I'll let someone who really is a superior being loose in this forum - OOOOH Goldie here have the keyboard

(anyone who has visited Sassy Gate and knows about Ms. Gilda Dragonides shudders)

A Lil' dragonoid leaps onto my lap and takes over the keyboard !

Hello boys and grls - Goldie here - ready for a tail slapping good time

(see my portrait up on my scribe's web site for an image of me and my magnificent tail - http://www.geocities.com/scholara/gallery.htm)

Sooo you like voilence and games hehehehe

okay let's play a FPS game - I'll be the shooter and you can be the prey

bang bang bang !!! what its no fun if you got shoot ?

you're whining? but its just a game

how could that effect your self esteem?

what i'm being too stroopy scribe?

but unlike you poor humans I am a truly superior being

my scribe's muttering something about having provided an example of true high and mightiness I have to go now - darn!!!

Goldie keeps it far more crudely then me but folks can we try to remember the original question was - are FPS games ethical not wah I'm a gamer and I have threatened / insulted cos you made me think about ethics.

Can we stuck to the original question?

Or do I have to resort to unethical behaviour and give Goldie permission to hunt you down and tail slap you especially roswell ? The PTBs havnt done anything to offend her lately and she needs some exercise!

Pleas estick in the idea and dont drag wounded egos into it!

Should our games be ethical?

[neith4]

[QUOTE=LtNOWIS]Have you ever played an FPS game?

No they're against my personal zen catholic ethics set but I have seen other people play them.

I dont play voilent games - I regard most of them as unethical.

It is not logical to presume that cos most of the gamers you know are allegedly "nice" people that the majority of them that you dont know are also "nice" .

I do have a satire section on my web site but any violence there is being used as a dharma tool!

[LtNOWIS]

Personally, if I were to play a FPS I want it to be as realistic as possible. If that means that a leg flies away, some floors get painted red, some blubbery and screamy noises are included, than that is what I want to enhance the ability to have vicarious roletaking. That's the magic, I don't need to see gore **** because I'd enjoy to see suffering, but I do need it if I want to play the game and have it feel as real.

I agree. Of course, a game doesn't need to be perfectly realistic, as that's impossible, but I find sterilized, Teen-rated violent games distasteful. It's like cartoon violence in that it portrays people being exploded or shot, but not in a way that depicts the terribleness of such an event. War is a grimy, horrific, atrocious practice, and should be portrayed as such. Of course, the gore shouldn't be over-the-top, like in some games.