Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Probie]

Question: I was watching "Pegasus Project" and I thought about you. With the story "It's an illusion", how do you explain this crossover? If this idea (They woke up on the planet of the episode "Home") was the real end of SGA, it also means the story in SG1 was an illusion. Am I clear?lol But I don't know if "Pegasus Project" was after or before "TRW" and I don't know if my question is logical.lol

[Eri13]

Question: I was watching "Pegasus Project" and I thought about you. With the story "It's an illusion", how do you explain this crossover? If this idea (They woke up on the planet of the episode "Home") was the real end of SGA, it also means the story in SG1 was an illusion. Am I clear?lol But I don't know if "Pegasus Project" was after or before "TRW" and I don't know if my question is logical.lol

Told from the perspective of Atlantis, it's an illusion. Told from the perspective of SG-1, it's real. Here's how it works:

For starters, if we presume Atlantis's S2-5 are illusions, then Atlantis and the SG-1 timeline will never match up. From the SGA perspective, any interactions with SG-1 people have been dreamed up in the minds of the Atlantis folks courtesy the fog people.

BUTTTTTTTTTTTT...

At some point, when they wake up, time will have reverted back to '2004', or some point close to when they started the expedition (presuming, as we've seen before, that not much time passes in real life when people are trapped in an illusion). Given that, time is then free to evolve again--which means it's entirely possible for the time line to develop to a point where the Pegasus Project storyline happens in 'real time' just as it happened when they dreamed it. So the SG-1 people DO experience TPP in real life, while the Atlantis people experience it again, but this time 'for real'.

The episode actually supports this idea quite nicely (other than the 'hey, we've done this before' sorta references). The only people in Atlantis we see are Elizabeth, Rodney & John. Everyone else's status is open to interpretation. Plus, there are a few interesting differences between TPP and Atlantis Season 3:

1) Rodney kinda reverts to jerk-Rodney of SG-1, which is a little OOC for his character development in SGA.

2) John brings up Rodney's lemon allergy, when he never mentions it in SGA.

3) Elizabeth's hair is straight and smooth, whereas in Atlantis she wore it curly or curled at the ends.

So The Pegasus Project could actually slot in quite nicely if the story reverted back to Home.

It also works after The Real World, and I think (based on the length of Elizabeth's hair) that it does happen after TRW.

[Probie]

Told from the perspective of Atlantis, it's an illusion. Told from the perspective of SG-1, it's real. Here's how it works:

For starters, if we presume Atlantis's S2-5 are illusions, then Atlantis and the SG-1 timeline will never match up. From the SGA perspective, any interactions with SG-1 people have been dreamed up in the minds of the Atlantis folks courtesy the fog people.

BUTTTTTTTTTTTT...

At some point, when they wake up, time will have reverted back to '2004', or some point close to when they started the expedition (presuming, as we've seen before, that not much time passes in real life when people are trapped in an illusion). Given that, time is then free to evolve again--which means it's entirely possible for the time line to develop to a point where the Pegasus Project storyline happens in 'real time' just as it happened when they dreamed it.

As far as the SG-1 people, they're just living it out.

The episode actually supports this idea quite nicely. The only people in Atlantis we see are Elizabeth, Rodney & John. Everyone else's status is open to interpretation. Plus, there are a few interesting differences between TPP and Atlantis Season 3:

1) Rodney kinda reverts to jerk-Rodney of SG-1, which is a little OOC for his character development in SGA.

2) John brings up Rodney's lemon allergy, when he never mentions it in SGA.

3) Elizabeth's hair is straight and smooth, whereas in Atlantis she wore it curly or curled at the ends.

So The Pegasus Project could actually slot in quite nicely if the story reverted back to Home.

It also works after The Real World, and I think (based on the length of Elizabeth's hair) that it does happen after TRW.

Ok....I really like this idea now.
Thanks for the explanation

[Scary Kitty]

drew, I've got a fluffy/zany vid rec... the infamous Sparks Ignite trailer! Can't go wrong with that.

Told from the perspective of Atlantis, it's an illusion. Told from the perspective of SG-1, it's real. Here's how it works:

For starters, if we presume Atlantis's S2-5 are illusions, then Atlantis and the SG-1 timeline will never match up. From the SGA perspective, any interactions with SG-1 people have been dreamed up in the minds of the Atlantis folks courtesy the fog people.

BUTTTTTTTTTTTT...

At some point, when they wake up, time will have reverted back to '2004', or some point close to when they started the expedition (presuming, as we've seen before, that not much time passes in real life when people are trapped in an illusion). Given that, time is then free to evolve again--which means it's entirely possible for the time line to develop to a point where the Pegasus Project storyline happens in 'real time' just as it happened when they dreamed it. So the SG-1 people DO experience TPP in real life, while the Atlantis people experience it again, but this time 'for real'.

The episode actually supports this idea quite nicely (other than the 'hey, we've done this before' sorta references). The only people in Atlantis we see are Elizabeth, Rodney & John. Everyone else's status is open to interpretation.

That's delicious!

2) John brings up Rodney's lemon allergy, when he never mentions it in SGA.

You mean John has never mentioned it on SGA, right? Since Rodney has mentioned it a couple of times on SGA, and I'm pretty sure at least one of them was when John was there to hear it.

3) Elizabeth's hair is straight and smooth, whereas in Atlantis she wore it curly or curled at the ends.

So The Pegasus Project could actually slot in quite nicely if the story reverted back to Home.

It also works after The Real World, and I think (based on the length of Elizabeth's hair) that it does happen after TRW.

Hmm, I hadn't actually considered that placement for TPP; in my personal canon timeline, I've got it set not too long after Misbegotten, but having TPP as late as after TRW definitely works as well.

[drewandian]

hee hee SK I have that vid saved in my favorites already...have watched it a few times!

[Eri13]

drew, I've got a fluffy/zany vid rec... the infamous Sparks Ignite trailer! Can't go wrong with that.

That's delicious!

You mean John has never mentioned it on SGA, right? Since Rodney has mentioned it a couple of times on SGA, and I'm pretty sure at least one of them was when John was there to hear it.

Yes, just John. Rodney, of course, brings it up in Rising. But I always thought it was odd that John pulls a lemon out of his jacket and mentions that little tidbit to Mitchell when he never actually EVER threatened Rodney with citrus before.

Hmm, I hadn't actually considered that placement for TPP; in my personal canon timeline, I've got it set not too long after Misbegotten, but having TPP as late as after TRW definitely works as well.

Yeah, timing wise it's kinda hard to place, but based on her hair I thought it was later in the first half of season 3. Since they came on Odyssey, I figured Midway wasn't complete which puts it before The Return (it's also possible they needed the ship for the Gate experiment--who knows?)

But Elizabeth's hair is a little longer than in Progeny, which is where I think they stopped filming for a little while (since every episode after, including TRW, has her with her hair getting down past her shoulders). So I figured it was after that--best guess is that it's after Common Ground but before McKay and Mrs. Miller since the ZPM isn't depleted.

Most crossovers are intended to be difficult to place, anyhow.

[Scary Kitty]

hee hee SK I have that vid saved in my favorites already...have watched it a few times!

Just watched it again.

Yes, just John. Rodney, of course, brings it up in Rising. But I always thought it was odd that John pulls a lemon out of his jacket and mentions that little tidbit to Mitchell when he never actually EVER threatened Rodney with citrus before.

It's very odd! One would think that John would be all over anything he could use to yank Rodney's chain, but he doesn't. Weird.

Yeah, timing wise it's kinda hard to place, but based on her hair I thought it was later in the first half of season 3. Since they came on Odyssey, I figured Midway wasn't complete which puts it before The Return (it's also possible they needed the ship for the Gate experiment--who knows?)

But Elizabeth's hair is a little longer than in Progeny, which is where I think they stopped filming for a little while (since every episode after, including TRW, has her with her hair getting down past her shoulders). So I figured it was after that--best guess is that it's after Common Ground but before McKay and Mrs. Miller since the ZPM isn't depleted.

And they didn't even mention the gate bridge in TPP; you'd think that there might be some snarkiness between McKay and Carter over it as they both contributed to the design, but there's nothing.

So, between CG and McKay and Mrs. Miller? Sounds good to me.

Most crossovers are intended to be difficult to place, anyhow.

Darn those writers. Don't they know we nitpickers need to have our details?

[Eri13]

Just watched it again.

It's very odd! One would think that John would be all over anything he could use to yank Rodney's chain, but he doesn't. Weird.

And they didn't even mention the gate bridge in TPP; you'd think that there might be some snarkiness between McKay and Carter over it as they both contributed to the design, but there's nothing.

So, between CG and McKay and Mrs. Miller? Sounds good to me.

Darn those writers. Don't they know we nitpickers need to have our details?

Yeah, the citrus thing is one thing I found supremely strange. Like, one of those things you go, 'heh, really?' when John mentions it. Because John IS prone to threatening Rodney from time to time, but he never goes after the citrus allergy and then three years in during the crossover, you get this weird scene with him mentioning it to Mitchell as though he does it all the time. *shrugs*

But, if you look at it from the perspective of a non-SGA-watching-SG-1-viewer, then John's behavior is to be looked at as 'oh. I get it--that guy is an Atlantis version of Mitchell! And he's totally dating the leader of the expedition--did you see how they flirted with each other?'

Problem is, any SGA-watching-SG-1-viewers (or conversely, SGA-watching-non-SG-1-viewers) would go 'what the heck is Sheppard doing with a lemon in his pocket?'

[Scary Kitty]

Yeah, the citrus thing is one thing I found supremely strange. Like, one of those things you go, 'heh, really?' when John mentions it. Because John IS prone to threatening Rodney from time to time, but he never goes after the citrus allergy and then three years in during the crossover, you get this weird scene with him mentioning it to Mitchell as though he does it all the time. *shrugs*

And let's not forget that inexplicable sighting of an empty lemon jello cup at McKay's workstation during Tao of Rodney later in Season 3. It's like a total 'right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing' disconnect happening with the writing. Bah.

But, if you look at it from the perspective of a non-SGA-watching-SG-1-viewer, then John's behavior is to be looked at as 'oh. I get it--that guy is an Atlantis version of Mitchell! And he's totally dating the leader of the expedition--did you see how they flirted with each other?'

Flirting, shamelessly having eye!sex in front of SG-1 at the briefing, probably did it in a closet before the briefing and going off to find another closet after the briefing... Ahahahah!

Problem is, any SGA-watching-SG-1-viewers (or conversely, SGA-watching-non-SG-1-viewers) would go 'what the heck is Sheppard doing with a lemon in his pocket?'

Exactly! I still cracked up at it, but more at the absurdity of Sheppard carrying around a lemon than my knowledge of McKay's "allergy."

[Scary Kitty]

The Obsession List:

Spoiler:

1. We are officially obsessed with John/Elizabeth when someone posts a pic with ice sculpture and we all see Sparky in it.
2. .....when I see my boss and I wonder what he would think if I give him a hug.
3. when every new song I hear turns into a Sparky fanmix in my head...
4. When I look in a catalog at this year's collection of UGG boots and imagine John getting Elizabeth a pair of them for Christmas...
5. When your XBOX gamer tag is Sparky4evr...
6. When upon receiving your free copy of SIMS3, your first thought is "Oh, I can make Elizabeth and John and make them fall in love, get married and make Sparky bebbies!"
7. When you write oodles of fanfiction fixing the mess on the show so that you can get John and Elizabeth together.
8. When 98.9% of your sketchbook is filled with drawings of either Sparky or their kids.
9. When you buy the John and Elizabeth action figures just to put them in... 'compromising positions.'
10. When the majority of your conversations with your friends inevitably mention Sparky in some form or another
11. When you look on various websites for mixed drinks for a "Sparky" cocktail. And find one.
12. when you see the words sparky or John and Elizabeth in the same sentence.
13. When you are reading a book about firetrucks to your kids and can't help but grin like an idiot when you read that the fire dog's name is...yup...you guessed it...SPARKY!
14. When you name one of your hair colour mixes "Sparky Red".
15. When your computer is a veritable shrine to Sparky: wallpaper, folders full of pics, artwork, more wallpapers, fanfics...
16. When you drive by the local marina and giggle knowingly at a yacht named 'Sparky.'
17. When you've worked out the only difference between your ex-principle and Elizabeth is that your principle doesn't have a Sedge, and you try to work out who John is.
18. All of your favorite songs end up in your sparky fanfics, either as titles or quotes.
19. When you read other couples fanfiction and substitute John and Liz to see if it would work.
20. You read the Sparky Thread in the mornings instead of the news paper.
21. You print out Sparky fanfiction so you can read it away from your computer.
22. When this morning, you receive a call of Elizabeth from Atlantis and you can't stop smiling and imagine that there is maybe a John with her. But it was not the real Atlantis but just a name of a company and Elizabeth was the customer. (This is the second time this has happened)
23. You see a carnival with a ferris wheel and you immediately think of John taking Elizabeth for a ride.
24. Whenever you hear something else named Atlantis (Space Shuttles, Space Stations, ships, hotels, mythology) and you immediately make John & Elizabeth a part of the story.
25. When every time you see a couple with UST in another show, you think that Joe and Torri could do it better.
26. When asked what you would ask for if someone gave you a present and money wasn't an object, you immediately think of buying the rights to the franchise and making a movie so John and Elizabeth could get together.
27. You wished you could've been at the Fourth of July parade where David Hewlett and his wife cosplayed as John and Elizabeth to see them in person.
28. Red and black become your new favorite colors.
29. While watching your most favorite Christmas movie of all time, you can't help but wanna see John and Elizabeth in the big, romantic dance scene instead of the actual characters
30. You see kids playing with a dog that looks like Sedge and wonder if the kids are John and Elizabeth's.
31. you see a copy of war and peace and you wonder if john has a picture of elizabeth in it. or they read it together and wrote notes on the side to discuss the current chapter they are one.
32. Every time Joe or Torri guest stars in something other than SGA, you keep hoping to hear their characters give a closet Sparky mention.
33....at night when you "daydream" about potential Sparky fic ideas as you drift off to sleep....hoping for good sparky dreams..
34......when you have Sparky dreams more than 1 night a week....
35. When you're secretly pleased by the fact that your hair color is caught somewhere in the middle between John and Elizabeth's.
36. When you write Sparky fanfic anywhere, even in a doctor's waiting room.
37. When while buying your Christmas tree you wonder if John and Elizabeth would have a live or artificial one and picture them arguing about it.
38. When you're at a spin class, doing sprints, look down, see your seat is on the "E" setting and wonder "I wonder if John and/or Elizabeth would do this to keep in shape?"
39. when you see a couple of young kids and the girl gives the boy a hug and the boy is shocked and you wonder if john and elizabeth did that if they ever met as kids.
40. When you keep thinking about John and Elizabeth's favorite foods and you get the idea of doing an Atlantis cookbook. true story
41. When you have a plan to break your tv (without your parents suspect you, of course) just to see eyes/sex in good quality
42. When the first thing you think of when your TV dies is how much better Sparky will look on a new one.
43. When the first thing you watch on your new HDTV is one of your favorite Sparky episodes.
44. When you draw pictures of yourself with John and Elizabeth, just cause you love them so much.
45. When watching the ep "Home", after Elizabeth says something's not 'right' after Simon kisses her, you literally yell at the TV "That's because he's not John!"
46. You get a tattoo and wonder if John or Elizabeth has one.
47. You see a pendant that looks kinda-sorta like a stargate, and you think it would make a great present for John to give to Elizabeth.
48. You see a messy haired baby and think of Sparky babiez.
49. You begin thinking up new ideas to do 'manips' using them
50. You hear a song on the radio, and wonder if it would go well with a Sparky vid
51. You wonder if Elizabeth and John would go clothes shopping together and what kind of goofy fun they could get into
52. Seeing an ad for Christmas pajamas with candy canes on them makes you think about Sparky and gives you a smutty plot bunny.
53. Upon getting a Wii for Christmas you and your hubby look at each other and say, at the same time, "We can make John and Elizabeth Mii's"
54. You go to Disneyland, and while watching the Christmas fireworks show, they start playing 'I'll Be Home For Christmas,' and you think about how John and Lizzie won't be together for Christmas.
55. You and your fellow Sparkies come up with themes for every day of the week on what to discuss/fic/picspam about John and Elizabeth.
56. When getting ready for a night out a karaoke, you look at the Sparky Song List and pick songs from there to sing.
57. When your friends know your obsession enough to give you an absolutely amazing drawing of John and Elizabeth (that kissing manip I did) for a Christmas present.
58. And when you scream (really) and sink to the floor in happiness when you open said present.
59. You check the thread at least once every hour, eagerly awaiting the moment when the thread hits a new post milestone.
60. You sing "Something to Talk About" at karaoke and almost start to giggle at the line "Stand just a little too close" because it makes you think of Sparky (well...I wanted to giggle at pretty much the whole song...)
61. All this talk about blizzards and getting snowed in makes you want to read/write some fic about John and Lizzie cooped up in a cozy cabin during a snow storm.

62. You name the various components of your computer setup for Atlantis and Sparky.

[Lt.Colonel John Sheppard]

Eri 13 Do you really think Sheppard is the atlantis version of Mitchell? i always thought since he is the first leader of the first atlantis Recon Team he would be more like the Jack O'Neill of the group since Jack is the first leader of SG-1.

[Southern Red]

Hi, miss me? RL gets complicated this time of year and I have to actually go out and do stuff. Today was my annual holiday tea at the Ritz Carlton with my 2 friends. It was oh so very refined and naturally there was an accident on the beltway on the way home which turned a 30 minute trip into 1 1/2 hours.

But while stuck in traffic I was listening to my Aaron Neville Christmas CD and heard Please Come Home For Christmas . Proving once again that I can find Sparky everywhere.

[pkprd869]

*hobbles into thread* Oh boy, it was a rough one. Never good when the liquid steel doesn't want to turn into solid steel. Need some sparky to help me feel better.

[Scary Kitty]

Hi, miss me? RL gets complicated this time of year and I have to actually go out and do stuff. Today was my annual holiday tea at the Ritz Carlton with my 2 friends. It was oh so very refined and naturally there was an accident on the beltway on the way home which turned a 30 minute trip into 1 1/2 hours.

But while stuck in traffic I was listening to my Aaron Neville Christmas CD and heard Please Come Home For Christmas . Proving once again that I can find Sparky everywhere.

From 30 minutes to an hour and a half? Ack! Not a fun drive.

Oooh, that is such a Sparky song... sing it to us, Aaron!

*hobbles into thread* Oh boy, it was a rough one. Never good when the liquid steel doesn't want to turn into solid steel. Need some sparky to help me feel better.

Meep! How's this fic: Love Bug, by Zandra's Ashes. It's not finished yet, but there's already some good fluff and Lizzie thrown for a loop by a loopy John.

[Lt.Colonel John Sheppard]

Yeah I can Imagine John looking up at the stars on the balcony of atlantis and just thinking of Elizabeth wanting her to be with him on earth for christmas. when he listens to that song. Wait to go SR