Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

So either the crew is consisted of idiots or they are willfully ignorant

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #76
    Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
    eli is suspicious. the others, questioning

    as to Rush being the only one to understand the ship, that's doubtful. Right now, yeah he had the most experience, but I think that's more because he didn't allow others to learn. They were there to be his assistants, fetch him coffee, do his scut work. I doubt he briefs and trains them adn shares any more knowledge than he has to.

    that's how he keeps his control. And, for example, that's how it took Eli to figure out that he'd edited the database, not once, but twice. (inserting the Icarus planet, deleting the kino footage).

    In my opinion, rush doesn't want competition, just lackies, so he shares as little as he can, so he's always the expert, always in control, and he can tweak the data to say whatever he wants it to and no one else is any the wiser, because they lack the knowledge to question him.

    Treatment like this breeds a lot of dissent and distrust amongst people. They get frustrated with being kept in the dark, with being stymied, and knowing Rush, likely snarked at and insulted if the mood strikes him.

    So, for a lot of them, maybe they are suspicious about how it happened. But they're simply to glad to be rid of him that they don't push. Because, with him gone, the scientists can now honestly study stuff and work on the ship without being curtailed and directed.

    Sure, he may know more, but I do think he keeps others from learning, and they will be well rid of the conflict and control

    I disagree that Rush views the other scientists simply as his secretaries. There's no coffee to fetch, after all.
    We always see him working alone, or with Eli, or (when the chair is found) with all of them. Yes, the work he has them doing is less important, and he directs them; Rush is the lead scientist and that's typically how science teams IRL operate, in my personal experience. And science is a highly competitive field to start with; just giving away what you know about a project to others is a good way to get your research stolen.

    Of course, he shouldn't be so near-sighted as to keep thinking in terms of who is going to get the credit. The habits of a lifetime are hard to break, even if you know you're handicapping yourself.

    But indeed, you're right that Rush doesn't respect them enough to keep them briefed on what he is doing or learning. It may be a method of keeping control, but I think it stems more from his lone wolf, anti-social nature. He prefers to work alone; he works best alone. And he works hard, and fast. In the episodes, we see him working when others are busy doing non-scientific things (things they choose to do, not what he orders.) Because of this, he's learned more in the past few weeks or months than all of them combined. He gets very frustrated when he does try to explain things and others can't keep up, as evidenced by the way he treated Volker. But, keep in mind, that was when he was having his nervous breakdown. He was ashamed afterwards of his behavior, at least that's what he told TJ.

    I think part of it is also that he doesn't trust any of them to 'be on his side.' Given the constant conflict between him and Young.

    I think the other scientists may indeed do more learning in his absence because they have to, but the focus will always be on getting home now. And their new boss is Young, who only cares about the science insofar as how it may get them home quickest. Their comprehension of the ship and tech as a whole may well be more hampered by being under the control of a military commander who takes risks with technology he doesn't understand (such as trying to dial Earth when there wasn't enough power to operate the ship even.)
    Not that I can blame them for focusing on getting home, but I do think that taking their time to understand the ship (right now they can't steer it, they can't regulate most of the systems, etc) is smarter because they can't rely on being able to get home before another crisis comes up.

    On the brightside, for the scientists, all of Rush's research is probably in his room or on the computers already. Eli, who has shown his superior understanding of the workings of the system, will be able to crack any passwords or the like and he's their best bet for interpreting and relaying all that Rush has learned and hasn't told anyone. Young will certainly order Eli to get hold of this stuff and learn what Rush was up to.

    It doesn't change my opinion, though, that they are all better off with Rush there. There's only so much that these other scientists can do, given that their fields of study are different than Rush's. Astrophysicist, geologist, etc.
    They can catch up, yes. But do they have enough time to do so?

    Comment


      #77
      Originally posted by Blackhole View Post
      I believe Stargate Atlantis came out concurrently with the 8th season of Stargate SG-1. To achieve maximum continuity you may want to watch the first 7 seasons of SG-1 first, assuming you get into the show enough to enjoy it.

      The MGM website says Rush is one of the leading scientists of his time. I read it yesterday for the first time. See it below:

      "The scientific head of the Icarus program and a certifiable genius, Dr. Nicholas Rush is one of the most brilliant scientists of his day. Having devoted some of the most difficult years of his life to the program, he knows more than anyone the importance of what is beyond that 9th chevron address. Definitely not the most agreeable aboard the ship, he is without a doubt the mastermind behind most of what goes on, whether people know it or not. Unwilling to bend to any sort of military rule, his focus is always on discovering the secrets to, and purpose of the Destiny."

      I have watched all the series from their inception many times I have to admit that Rush didn't come across to me as that brilliant. I suspect part of that impression arises out of the fact that SGU is different than previous series in that it isn't letting the Destiny’s problems solved as fast, making Rush's competence seem less. I think that is why die hard fans don't regard him as being as smart as Carter and McKay and other scientists. Many of these same fans expect them to stone to the Destiny so they can fix things. I don't think that is going to happen anytime soon as SGU's writers for dramatic purposes don't want the show's problems solved that quickly or easily.
      Yeah, you'd wonder why they don't do the logical thing to use those stones; but indeed it is different than the previous series, from what I know of them.
      From an outsider's POV, I see Rush as taking on a task that is far too much for one man to accomplish quickly. Even using the other scientists. Which is probably something he knows and is why he was so eager to research and use the Chair. All the pressure on him keeps building and building because everyone wants results now and he can't produce them.
      Keep in mind, on other shows, the mission was intentional. The ships were better understood (unless I've read wrong.) Figuring out the ship was not the focus of the other series.
      Bottom line; the Destiny is different than any other ship that mankind has known about. Ideally, they'd be able to bring it back to Earth and study it for several years before using it. Since that isn't possible, it's a constant struggle.
      The only thing that makes me question Rush's brilliance is his awkward actions in "Justice." Why'd he let that Kino see him in the first place? I just think there's something missing there that I can't quite figure out.

      Comment


        #78
        Originally posted by Daro View Post
        The stones are only to be used for beating up rivals and having sex using other folks' bodies. There'll be none of this logical 'let's bring in someone who can help us.' crap!

        Forgive me, you are likely correct in saying Daniel is the expert.

        I'm ashamed to say I'm very new to Stargate. I watched the movie, but haven't seen the other series. I plan on buying the boxed set for season 1 of each this weekend.

        As for Rush's expertise, I have to believe that O'Neill wouldn't have Rush on the project as the lead scientist to start with if he wasn't near the top of the list.
        If you really want to splash out I brought the complete SG-1 Series 1-10 box set, which included AoT and Continuum, off Amazon a few months ago and it cost less than £100 here in the UK. The SGA Series 1-5 box set was more but it may have come down in the run up to Christmas.
        "So, what's your impression of Alar?"
        "That he is concealing something."
        "Like what?"
        "I am unsure. He is concealing it."

        "Well, according to Einstein’s General Theory of Relativity, there’s nothing in the laws of physics to prevent it. Extremely difficult to achieve, mind you – you need the technology to manipulate black holes to create wormholes not only through points in space but time."
        "Not to mention a really nice DeLorean."
        "Don’t even get me started on that movie!"
        "I liked that movie!"

        Comment


          #79
          The thing is, they can have their cake and eat it too if they just work at it.

          don't focus on just getting home, focus on getting the SHIP home. then the people will be home, the Destiny will be in Earth's orbit and Rush can study it until he's an old doddering fool

          Unless, of course, he's afraid if he just gets the ship back to earth, he'll lose his position as boss of the ship, so he'd rather keep it isolated (you know, aloof and alone and loner) and keep it to himself than risk getting back to earth and losing control of it
          Where in the World is George Hammond?


          sigpic

          Comment


            #80
            Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
            The thing is, they can have their cake and eat it too if they just work at it.

            don't focus on just getting home, focus on getting the SHIP home. then the people will be home, the Destiny will be in Earth's orbit and Rush can study it until he's an old doddering fool

            Unless, of course, he's afraid if he just gets the ship back to earth, he'll lose his position as boss of the ship, so he'd rather keep it isolated (you know, aloof and alone and loner) and keep it to himself than risk getting back to earth and losing control of it

            It's hard to focus on two different goals when they have a limited number of scientists and a limited number of resources.

            I do think you're right about Rush's fear of losing control of the mission. We need to find out more about what the people on Earth think of him and then maybe we'll see if things are really as tense as they seem. I got the distinct impression that he wasn't liked to start with, nor was he quick enough in producing the results that Senator Armstrong and Telford wanted from him.

            Comment


              #81
              Far too much contention for a group that's lost impossibly far from home.

              Comment


                #82
                Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
                The thing is, they can have their cake and eat it too if they just work at it.

                don't focus on just getting home, focus on getting the SHIP home. then the people will be home, the Destiny will be in Earth's orbit and Rush can study it until he's an old doddering fool

                Unless, of course, he's afraid if he just gets the ship back to earth, he'll lose his position as boss of the ship, so he'd rather keep it isolated (you know, aloof and alone and loner) and keep it to himself than risk getting back to earth and losing control of it
                Given how long the ship has been travelling and how far it has travelled it would take a very long time to get it back to Earth (millions of years) unless they can duplicate the wormhole drive whist in a star
                "So, what's your impression of Alar?"
                "That he is concealing something."
                "Like what?"
                "I am unsure. He is concealing it."

                "Well, according to Einstein’s General Theory of Relativity, there’s nothing in the laws of physics to prevent it. Extremely difficult to achieve, mind you – you need the technology to manipulate black holes to create wormholes not only through points in space but time."
                "Not to mention a really nice DeLorean."
                "Don’t even get me started on that movie!"
                "I liked that movie!"

                Comment


                  #83
                  not necessarily, the ship has FTL drive.

                  would it be a long trip? yeah. but maybe they could galaxy hop. or maybe they find a place where the Daedy or Hammond or another ship rendevous with them and they can at least change crew and get supplies.

                  If they can break the ship out of its predetermined course, jump it off the tracks so to speak, they can get it back to earth or to the Peggy galaxy and have a shot at keeping it instead of just being passengers for a very long trip
                  Where in the World is George Hammond?


                  sigpic

                  Comment


                    #84
                    Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
                    not necessarily, the ship has FTL drive.

                    would it be a long trip? yeah. but maybe they could galaxy hop. or maybe they find a place where the Daedy or Hammond or another ship rendevous with them and they can at least change crew and get supplies.

                    If they can break the ship out of its predetermined course, jump it off the tracks so to speak, they can get it back to earth or to the Peggy galaxy and have a shot at keeping it instead of just being passengers for a very long trip
                    That is much like what happened with Atlantis. I believe this is probably what is going to happen (beginning of season 2)
                    Tst

                    Comment


                      #85
                      Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
                      not necessarily, the ship has FTL drive.

                      would it be a long trip? yeah. but maybe they could galaxy hop. or maybe they find a place where the Daedy or Hammond or another ship rendevous with them and they can at least change crew and get supplies.

                      If they can break the ship out of its predetermined course, jump it off the tracks so to speak, they can get it back to earth or to the Peggy galaxy and have a shot at keeping it instead of just being passengers for a very long trip
                      I detailed here http://forum.gateworld.net/showthrea...6#post10671606 , why turning the ship around wont help them squat.
                      Later, AdamTM

                      I swear a lot, just take it as my attempt at honesty.

                      Stargate Atlantis Unlimited

                      Stargate Universe - BSG Style

                      Stargate Universe - Monk Style

                      SGU SUCKS

                      Comment


                        #86
                        Originally posted by Daro View Post
                        Yeah, you'd wonder why they don't do the logical thing to use those stones; but indeed it is different than the previous series, from what I know of them.
                        From an outsider's POV, I see Rush as taking on a task that is far too much for one man to accomplish quickly. Even using the other scientists. Which is probably something he knows and is why he was so eager to research and use the Chair. All the pressure on him keeps building and building because everyone wants results now and he can't produce them.
                        Keep in mind, on other shows, the mission was intentional. The ships were better understood (unless I've read wrong.) Figuring out the ship was not the focus of the other series.
                        Bottom line; the Destiny is different than any other ship that mankind has known about. Ideally, they'd be able to bring it back to Earth and study it for several years before using it. Since that isn't possible, it's a constant struggle.
                        The only thing that makes me question Rush's brilliance is his awkward actions in "Justice." Why'd he let that Kino see him in the first place? I just think there's something missing there that I can't quite figure out.
                        SGU is more realistic that no matter how smart the scientists are it would take a long time to figure a ship as complex as the Destiny out. In SG-1 and SGA Carter or McKay would have it figured out by the end of the episode.

                        The Kino is probably programmed to investigate anything moving. I wondered how the Kino captured Spencer's suicide. I went back and watched it again. It appeared that Spencer was looking and talking directly to the Kino. He must have grabbed one and positioned it to record his suicide note.

                        Rush may or may not have seen it when he walked into the room. You would think that if he had seen it then he would delete its contents as soon as he left Spencer’s quarters that evening with the gun. If he had done this then the files would have already been erased by the time Eli backed them up to his computer. If he didn’t notice it or wasn't worried anyone would think to look at it till later, then by the time he deleted it Eli had already made his backup copy. When Young talked to Rush in the morning he asked him where he was. He said he was working on the ship's computer's interface. He probably deleted the files at that time. Eli and Scott didn't get the idea to review the Kino recordings until after the gun had been found in Young's quarters and after they had reported to Wray about it. It was probably well into the day before this occurred. Rush had plenty of Time to get to the ship’s computer and delete the files.

                        I suspect anyone spending too much time paying close attention to all the details of any show would likely spot inconsistencies in the story and ruin it.
                        Last edited by Blackhole; 12 December 2009, 09:33 AM.

                        Comment


                          #87
                          Originally posted by Daro View Post
                          It's hard to focus on two different goals when they have a limited number of scientists and a limited number of resources.

                          I do think you're right about Rush's fear of losing control of the mission. We need to find out more about what the people on Earth think of him and then maybe we'll see if things are really as tense as they seem. I got the distinct impression that he wasn't liked to start with, nor was he quick enough in producing the results that Senator Armstrong and Telford wanted from him.
                          The conversation in “Earth” by the IOA head with Wray show that Earth doesn’t believe Rush wants to come home and isn’t trusted. That was why he wasn’t included in the rescue plan briefings. Rush’s conversation with Telford also during “Earth” show that Rush is very afraid if two way gate travel is established back to Earth that he may be ordered to return.

                          Comment


                            #88
                            Originally posted by AdamTM View Post
                            I detailed here http://forum.gateworld.net/showthrea...6#post10671606 , why turning the ship around wont help them squat.
                            they don't have to turn it 'around', just figure out where they are in relation to the milkyway or pegasus galaxy and steer that way
                            Where in the World is George Hammond?


                            sigpic

                            Comment


                              #89
                              Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
                              they don't have to turn it 'around', just figure out where they are in relation to the milkyway or pegasus galaxy and steer that way
                              I think they already know that. In "Air" when Eli was looking at the map of the Destiny's journey and its flight path was very far away from Pegasus. So just getting it into those galaxies would probably take a lot more time than they have. I would imagine that they would have to use the gate to get home.

                              Comment


                                #90
                                Originally posted by Skydiver View Post
                                they don't have to turn it 'around', just figure out where they are in relation to the milkyway or pegasus galaxy and steer that way
                                You didnt read my post at all did you?
                                Later, AdamTM

                                I swear a lot, just take it as my attempt at honesty.

                                Stargate Atlantis Unlimited

                                Stargate Universe - BSG Style

                                Stargate Universe - Monk Style

                                SGU SUCKS

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X