where did season 10 go wrong?

[ReganX]

That's your opinion. In many fans opinions the changes were handled well. In fact it's a majority since the ratings were pretty good considering the show did loose some viewership.

Unless you have evidence that the majority of those viewing Season Ten feel that the changes were handled well, I suggest that you refrain from making such claims. If you visit the Anti-Season Ten thread, you will find people who, while they may not feel that the changes were handled well, continue to watch. Short of conducting a survey of every viewer, there is no way we can know how they all feel about the changes.

As far as the ratings being pretty good goes, considering that Season Ten has, so far averaged only 1.54 ratings points per episode that could be considered a matter of opinion. In the opinion of the Sci-Fi channel execs, they were clearly not good enough to merit renewal.

[ReganX]

Again I disagree. The writers did not write Cam and Vala at an expense of the other characters. All the characters have had equal parts and the orriginal cast has not been sidelined.

In your opinion, perhaps. I disagree. ParadoxRealities calculated the number of lines each character had, and their average per episode which clearly indicates that the characters did not have equal roles.

http://forum.gateworld.net/showpost....postcount=4404

No no one is obliged to accept the changes and yes some agree with me and others don't. I think TPTB did appeal to the fans just some don't think so.

I'm not certain I understand. Are you saying that TPTB did make the show appeal to the fans but that there are some fans who don't think the show appealed to them or do you mean that they tried to make the changes appeal to the fans but some fans didn't like the changes?

[majorsal]

Yup, it's enough to go and read (or listen to) Brad Wright's interview here at GW. He said (and this was LONG before the cancellation!) that if they had rebranded the show after season 8 (in fact season 9 and 10 the season 1 and 2 of the new show in their minds) the show would have been able to go on for YEARS. Didn't happen unfortunately. ****ing Skiffy wanted their record. They got it and said: Good bye.

why do you think changing the cover of the book would make any difference in what's inside it? poor is poor, and 'redecorating' its outside isn't going to make it better... imo




sally

[Amanda Eros]

I would have too. The changes didn't have to happen, but if they needed to add to the cast they could have done it in a better way. I think you said it well with a Major Mitchell and Vala as she was in PU. That might have worked better, and wouldn't have put of as many fans as these last two season have.

I agree, if they went with Vala as the new villain approach with the Lucian Alliance thrown in the mix. Especially with the way they introduced her in PU. That would have been awesome! Then Ba'al, supersoilders, the anubis clone, and the remaining system lords, plus if they really wanted to have another 'hot' actress on set they could have made her into another Goa'uld. (I like the actress that plays Adria, however I don't like thinking about how they grew her character to the age of cleavage. That's kind of gross since she is technically still an infant in chronological terms) Keeping all my ideas in mind, they could have dragged out the series to the desirable tenth season.

However introducing a villain that should have a series of it's own. Having the SGC accept a woman on their flagship team that has a questionable history, and then when she lets down her guard to be herself, have the cognitive level of a teen. (It is likely she never was able to develop cognitively beyond a teen since she was taken as a host during those years. She's been free for ten years and has hopefully aged accordingly putting her at early thirties?) That really turned me off. Having Daniel and Vala become Vaniel... Plus I think Mitchell really should have stayed a Major, it would have made more sense with the way his character acts ... the list goes on and on.

[majorsal]

Actually, I'd say the show changed while the taste stayed the same. Fans grow old with the show and generally, when they do, they tend to be fond of their good old hubby rather than some youngers in the bar.

i'd say that's almost poetic in its simplicity and honesty. to me at least.




sally

[Titania V V]

And that's it, they've proved by this they're unable to accept the changes, even when better actors are joining the show and the new direction of the show is much more interesting, but at the same time more difficult to understand - the Ori and religious philosophy isn't an easy subject and it's probably too difficult for some. The Goa'uld were definitely much easier and less complicated.

IMHO, it wasn't a question of not accepting the changes of Season 9-- it was being unhappy with how the changes were carried out. It's been argued over and over (by posters far more eloquent then I'll ever be ) on various threads, that the changes were necessary, given the departure of RDA for example, but The Producers made very poor choices in execution (again IMHO). As a long time fan I found the fact that well loved characters (and I'm not just talking Jack here, folks) were dismissed without a second thought or REAL mention, as though since they had ceased to exist for The Producers, they ceased to exist for the audience-- a key reason why I lost interest in the series I'd never miss both Friday showings of. I couldn't just ignore the show's history as The Producers apparently so easily did.

And then there was how military protocol, which appeared to be strictly adhered to for so many years, seemed to be thrown out the window along with so many characters and cultures that were disposed of without a look back. That military realism added hugely to how realistic the show felt, coupled with the fact that these people were our contemporaries (how exciting the concept that THIS could be happening in OUR lifetime, not some distant "stardate" in the future ). Taking away that military realism made the show seem like another dime a dozen scifi show to me.

The reliance on ships and beaming technology for quick convenient rescue, and the tendency to ignore the actual Stargate itself for interplanetary travel, along with what I felt as the loss of the sense of family amongst the characters, were the final nails in the coffin for me.

I was open to change, but the methods failed miserably, IMHO. Judging by the numbers, I'd venture to guess the casual fan (who comprises the majority of the viewing audience, after all is said and done) may have tuned out Season 10 because the Season 9 changes were too forced and all too often ignored what worked best about the show to begin with.

[Descent]

1.6 ratings with only a .4 drop shows that the majority of fans (least those with Neilson boxes) are still at least watching the show. Just throwing it out there cause I've seen lots of people say "a majority of fans didn't like the show so they stopped watching, blah blah, etc. etc."

[tsukasa14]

Ok grant it some people stoped watching b/c of the changes. The show was not cancelled b/c of the ratings as the ratings were higher than you stated. the lowest was 1.4 and highest 1.6 so the total combined was very good. Ratings may have played a small part but it was not the full reason.

Has it ever occurred to you why a shiny spinoff like SGA gets a better rating than SG-1 S10 despite the fact that it doesn't have the Farscape fanbase and Michael's fans to back it up? To add to that, SGA's rating is steady without needing the savestargate campaign. A lot more people accept what they are seeing in SGA than SG-1 S10. This just proves fans are willing to give the new cast and storyline a chance but TPTB doesn't quite meet the expectation in S9 and S10. The rating may be not the only reason for the cancellation but it's a damn big one. Not enough viewers results in reduced cash flow which inevitably leads to the end of the franchise.

[tsukasa14]

1.6 ratings with only a .4 drop shows that the majority of fans (least those with Neilson boxes) are still at least watching the show. Just throwing it out there cause I've seen lots of people say "a majority of fans didn't like the show so they stopped watching, blah blah, etc. etc."

You're probably right but still, there's an issue with the diminished number of viewers. At the beginning of S9, the show had a 2.1 rating but the number went downhill quickly after 1 and a half years and eventually hit 1.54 as average in S10 (and that includes the out of ordinary rating for episode 200). If we represent this in proper chart form to predict the future, how low will S11's rating be if it has a chance to exist? After two years, the new SG-1 has turned more people off than gained more audience. Who knows how long before the momentum will be halted and the rating reaches equilibrium but Scifi has decided that the new SG-1 wasn't worth the risk.

[Farscapefan]

About this "whorelette" thingie (why the frell do I have to do the job for the antis? ) - here there is a piece of "The Ties That Bind" DVD commentary by Mallozzi, Will Waring and Martin Gero:

"JM: Now, in the original version, you know it was just this and the audience was left to assume what they would. Um, later we got a note from Claudia who, I think, was kinda concerned about sort of that her character was, you know, kinda the two dimensional whorelette. And she, you know, wanted to make it clear that, you know, Arlos may have assumed that, you know, whatever happened happened. But in fact, you know,… she…Actually we wrote a line for her where basically she explains to Daniel and Mitchell that, you know, he had fallen asleep. So basically he could have assumed whatever… whatever, assume what she would have told him. But I think that may have been lost.

WW: No, I think that line’s still in there.

MG: That’s still there, absolutely."

[SGFerrit]

at the end of season 9 everything was awesome and the stage seemed set to keep SG-1 going for another few seasons, yet the decision to axe came in about the first third of season 10. so where did the writers screw up to reduce the ratings enough to make it seem non-viable?

What do you mean 'the writers'?

Season 10 is widely considered better than season 9, if you are looking for someone to blame I can certainly think of better people.

[Dream-a-Little]

Yes, but if the parent show is doing well ratings-wise when it ends, those who invested in it may be willing to support a new spin-off, allowing the franchise to continue even when the show does not.

At this point the parent show should be Atlantis. And yet it's ratings are not much different than SG-1's. It's advantage over SG-1 is a cheaper cast. It will be interesting to see if it can survive on it's own. If it can't, then that would be another arguement against Stargate being a franchise.

[Crow T. Robot]

Has it ever occurred to you while a shiny spinoff like SGA got a better rating than SG-1 S10 despite the fact that it doesn't have the Farscape's fanbase and Michael's fans to back it up? To add to that, SGA's rating is steady without needing the savestargate campaign.

Good points.

Also cancelled long-running shows tend to see a ratings boast as old time fans tune in to see how they plan to close down shop and end the series. It’s a trend you see.

[Dream-a-Little]

The new cast isn't exactly cheaper than the old cast and plus, a five people team puts a burden on the budget. It would have been wiser to make a complete new SG team with the old SG-1 members showing up once in a while. Jonas would work, even the cadets in Providing Ground as long as they're given a fitting leader.

I think the idea was to eventually make a whole new SG-1 team. I think they just wanted to transition the old cast out over time the same way that they transitioned RDA out. And I do believe the new cast is cheaper than the old cast at this point after 10 years of pay raises. And that's essentially what Brad Wright and Robert Cooper have been saying in interviews since the beginning of the year. The only cast member who has a big enough name outside the genre to be pricey is Beau and he didn't do all 20 episodes of SG-1 last year. They shared his twenty episode commitment with Atlantis.

[Crow T. Robot]

I think the idea was to eventually make a whole new SG-1 team. I think they just wanted to transition the old cast out over time the same way that they transitioned RDA out. And I do believe the new cast is cheaper than the old cast at this point after 10 years of pay raises.

Good points.

I tend to agree. I think the plan was to start transition the old cast out. Let’s face it MS and AT have started dropping hints they’re about ready to move on and after 9 and 10 years who can blame them?

The thing is despite all the blame that Sci Fi is getting for canceling the show. MGM is showing no inclination that SG-1 is worth the money to break the non-compete clause with Sci Fi, look for another backer, and move the series to another US network. Add in Sci Fi stated openly IF MGM lowed its fees it might consider rethinking its decision. So for whatever reason it’s not economical for MGM to continue the series. I doubt the up-front cast payroll of the show is any major factor. Whatever the cost is it’s on MGM’s side.