The ori are bad... why exactly?

[Ltcolshepjumper]

They heal the sick and seem to give meaning to the lives of the masses. We saw first hand in Vala's little storytelling that the true believers really are genuinely content...

Besides the whole "being forced to worship" it seems as if they are a positive step forward from the status quo of continuous conflict with intergalactic factions. (Including all war both on Earth, other planets, and between races)

And even the worship doesn't seem all that bad... the followers do not seem to mind prostration and if we accept christian doctorine as morally correct they are living "good christian lives"

They also do not seem to be all that aggressive considering the power they have... They, up to this point, just want us to see the light and voluntarily follow them... which explains why they just didn't wipe us or other non-believers out when they had perfect opportunities to do so...

Just something to consider...

Let's spill it out for you. The Ori claim to be gods. They promise their followers enlightenment yet they sap the life from them instead, only to gain more power. Their followers, mislead into believing they will ascend, instead die meaningless lives, in submission to beings who are not all-powerful. How is that not evil? They invade another galaxy just for the sole purpose of destroying the Ancients and to enslave innocent races. How is that not evil? Would you say that genocide was good? Because that is exactly what happened to the Sodan.

[sporka42]

Okay, since you bought out this question, I'll explain it.

The Ori are evil because they will kill anyone that hears their message and won't bow to them. They created a fleet of ships with the purpose of destorying anyone that does not believe as they do. They sent plagues to Earth and several other planets in order to wipe out any resistance. Some in the form of disease, some in the form of insects that destroy crops and kill people.

They will get their followers to kill everyone that resists them without mercy without remorse.

And lets not forget the most important feature here. They are assended beings, who are using other beings of a lower evolutionary existance as a way to become more powerful, by feeding on the energys of those that worship them. They are on a higher plane, they should have no need for that kind of influence.
They rule over an entire galaxy of people, yet they have no qualms about sacrificing the people that worship them in order to destroy or convert another galaxy.
They promise assention to all, but do not allow any of their worshipers to reach the level of true peace and enlightenment that would allow it.


They are no better than the fundamentalist/evangelical/rightwing/hardline/fanatic that would kill a woman for wanting control of her reproductive rights, or kill homosexual, or burn a witch, or arrest someone for stating any belief that does not conform to their beliefs.

*That* is why they are evil.

[Attilitus]

Yea that sucks for the people living in the galaxy now... but if the ori were to truely dominate the galaxy the 'big picture" end result (which is the only thing ascended beings would care about) would be better than constant fighting and bickering among the lower life.

Even their aspirations to "sap power" and "kill the ancients" can technically be justified by their desire to enlighten more people currently kept in "chaos" because the ancients have been sheltering them.

[Sauron18]

I guess you could compare it to communism, somehow...

In the long run, if everyone accepted it there would be less or no war and poverty and all that stuff, but we'd be giving up too many freedoms we enjoy.

[Attilitus]

I wonder how the ancients justify their philosophy of ignoring mortals beyond simple apathy or self-absoration...

[MTgate]

I wonder how the ancients justify their philosophy of ignoring mortals beyond simple apathy or self-absoration...

I think i already explained this somewhere the ancients beings smart don't want to suffer for doing right. i said something about saving a rat/wild animal. if you save it that might eventually leed up to something worse happening.

[Sauron18]

I wonder how the ancients justify their philosophy of ignoring mortals beyond simple apathy or self-absoration...

Well it's not their buisness, it's as simple as that. If people minded their own buisness there would be less conflicts.

It may seem cruel, but it is nonetheless true.

[The Engineer]

I guess you could compare it to communism, somehow...

In the long run, if everyone accepted it there would be less or no war and poverty and all that stuff, but we'd be giving up too many freedoms we enjoy.

"Who's not with us is against us." - a familiar communist slogan.
The Ori use it as a guide through the Milky Way on their path of conquest of as many souls they can take for their own worshipping.

[sporka42]

Yea that sucks for the people living in the galaxy now... but if the ori were to truely dominate the galaxy the 'big picture" end result (which is the only thing ascended beings would care about) would be better than constant fighting and bickering among the lower life.

Even their aspirations to "sap power" and "kill the ancients" can technically be justified by their desire to enlighten more people currently kept in "chaos" because the ancients have been sheltering them.

And not a single one of them would have free will, how is that good? The people in the Ori galaxy aren't allowed anything other than what the Ori say they can have. What if a brilliant mind like Sam Carter or Rodney McKay tried ask questions against the belief system. They would be left out in the sun for days tied in a town square until they repented, or they would be burned alive an an example. How is that good? How is the loss of free thinking and the open exchange of ideas a good thing?

[Attilitus]

Well it's not their buisness, it's as simple as that. If people minded their own buisness there would be less conflicts.

It may seem cruel, but it is nonetheless true.

Good point.

[Attilitus]

And not a single one of them would have free will, how is that good? The people in the Ori galaxy aren't allowed anything other than what the Ori say they can have. What if a brilliant mind like Sam Carter or Rodney McKay tried ask questions against the belief system. They would be left out in the sun for days tied in a town square until they repented, or they would be burned alive an an example. How is that good? How is the loss of free thinking and the open exchange of ideas a good thing?

Well in the big picture where the ultimate achievement is Ascension (and all mortal knowledge gained before that point is rendered meaningless) peace and contentment among mortals would be more important than their "meaningless" (in relation to ascended beings) cultural and scientific advancements.

[MTgate]

Well it's not their buisness, it's as simple as that. If people minded their own buisness there would be less conflicts.

It may seem cruel, but it is nonetheless true.

Or as an example, if a colony of ants just minded their own buisness the whole colony would fall!

[Attilitus]

I liked the analogy SySTeMLoRDLoL made in the episode topic about us not judging the actions of bacteria to be morally right or wrong. That could explain the ancients lack of "care" for what happens to us.

[The Engineer]

Well in the big picture where the ultimate achievement is Ascension (and all mortal knowledge gained before that point is rendered meaningless) peace and contentment among mortals would be more important than their "meaningless" (in relation to ascended beings) cultural and scientific advancements.

But if it is that "meaningless" to them why torture and kill them for trying?
If they know that whatever those low beings do to achieve cultural and scientific advancements will be futile in comparison with the final goal of ascension why bother to discourage them by these methods? Even the prodigal son returns.

[Attilitus]

Well note that the end result of their torturing and killing is long term peace without disturbance. The end result of the Ancient's philosophy is continued war and conflict.

Remember that the ancients do not ascend people... only the radical ones that care about mortals (Oma ect.) do.