Is SG1 Committing Genocide? ('Arthur's Mantle' SPOILERS)

[Deevil]

No you see, we aren't taking away that which makes them survive, we are taking away the source of their power.

That is different.

They are still living, just not interacting with other dimensions.

[PG15]

Its necessary but its wrong. When you start throwing out ethics, what we have basically become are the worst monsters in history like the nazi's, khemer rouge,huta/tutsi's in rawanda, bosnia. In their perspectives they were backed into a wall. There only way to maintain their societies were to kill off an entire race. So is sg1 any better. Like I said its not the first time they had to kill off an entire race. Remember the ashen. Or the gould killing plague.

Fine, it's still wrong.

But it's also still necessary. Can you suggest an alternative?

[Dani347]

How do you know that restricting them to one dimension is taking away something vital they need?

[PG15]

Indeed. The Ancients pretty much stay in their realm except for some rebellious few, and they seem to be fine.

[metroid]

mahram, if your not willing to listen to reason anyway, why did you even start this topic?

like spg_1983 said:

You are drawing false and biased comparisons. true comparisons would be taking a criminal and placing them in jail. They can live, move around their cell, talk to other prisoners, but they can not exert power or influence outside their prison.

mahram, do you stand outside prisons protesting against the 'genocide' (by your view of it) they are commiting against the prisoners?

[mahram]

well in canada we dont have the death penalty. We are enlightened people

mahram, if your not willing to listen to reason anyway, why did you even start this topic?

like spg_1983 said:



mahram, do you stand outside prisons protesting against the 'genocide' (by your view of it) they are commiting against the prisoners?

[IcyNeko]

How do you know that restricting them to one dimension is taking away something vital they need?

Seems to be perfectly A-OK for the Ancients. I think of it as solitary confinement. Besides, the only reason they interfere with the lower planes of existence is to steal energy and grow more corrupt and powerful.

Erm.. yeah. ok. Seems like we need a dictionary lesson here...

gen·o·cide ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jn-sd)
n.
The systematic and planned extermination of an entire national, racial, political, or ethnic group.

What the Orii are doing is considered Genocide. They're systematically plaguing their enemies to death. What the Humans are doing is considered "confinement". No one's dying. They're just being sent to the corner to think about what they did wrong.

For a really, really long time.

BUt they still have each other.

[spg_1983]

well in canada we dont have the death penalty. We are enlightened people

And what does that have to do with anything?

[Deejay435]

thats the problem we have ethics and laws. We dont know if all of the ori want us dead, it could be a majority of them do, but we are willing to wipe them out. Its not the first time sg1 has committed genocide, remember how they wiped out the ashen. And joe wanted todo an episode dealing with Sg1 in a war crimes tribunal dealing with wiping out of the ashen. Hopefully we will see it during season 10. We didnt know if all the ashen wanted us dead, but we wiped them all out. How about the replicators. Or how about the gould when sg1 had the gould killing plague. They would have used it, if it didnt kill all jaffa to. Genocide is genocide, regardless of reasons.

Speaking about the german analogy. We were willing to wipe out Japan with nuclear weopens if they didnt surrender. Remember the truman quote Truman promised a "rain of ruin" if Japan did not surrender immediately. When people are at war, henious crimes are committed.

The Ascendeds that Daniel joined, briefly, remain-with one or two minor exceptions like Orlin-on their own plane of existance. Once SG1 gets a chance to use the weapon the Ori will be kept on that same plane of existance.

The Ascended are not dead. They're not suffering. They choose to remain on that plane of existance, so it's quite clearly not like being dead. Using the weapon doesn't even come close to killing them. Nor does it even come close to causing them to live in a vegatative state, like you compared it to, in another post. Was Oma Desala in some kind of hell, or in pain, or feeling as if she was dead? Were all the Ascendeds who inhabited her 'diner'? No. In fact, the Ascendeds have themselves made a rule that they don't permit themselves to come onto our plane of existance. Are they then commiting mass suicide? No, again.

As for the Ascehen-SG1 did not wipe them out either. First, the Aschen was a collective of planets. The worst that would have happened is the Aschen dialed the black hole from one planet, and it was lost to the black hole. All their other planets would have been completely safe. So their society, their culture, and their people would not have been 'wiped out'. Not to mention-the Aschen were supposed to be so much more advanced than we are. We managed, with our comparatively less advanced tech to not get destroyed when we dialed into a black hole-I'd certainly expect the Aschen to be able to save themselves if we could.

[IcyNeko]

Oh god, what if the Aschen come back later in Season 10 to haunt us? Better get my suntan going. Don't want to look pasty faced like those fools.

[DrPepperJunkie]

personally, i don't think we're deliberately going out into the universe trying to wipe out the Ori. i think that if they had stayed put where they were we would have had no reason to want to defend ourselves against them. they are the one coming here to exact retribution on us. they're the ones building the supergates and ships for the sole purpose of getting us to join them or be wiped out. all i see us doing is trying to preserve our way of existence the best way we know how. we've already seen Daniel trying to resolve various situations with Priors peacefully to no avail. so i guess the question is, what is the right course of action in a situation that calls for immediate attention against an enemy with superior technology that won't listen unless you're saying what they want?

[A Lost Cause]

Was eradicating the Goa'uld any different then what they're doing now? not really, if anything, this is less severe then what they did the the goa'uld due to them not actually killing the Ori.

As for it being genocide, I doubt it, because even if there are Ori who don't agree with the rest, they seem content to not involve themselves on our plain so they wont even notice the difference, and really, all we are doing is throwing them into a theoretical prison. So legally, they(Sg1) are doing nothing wrong besides not giving them a trial, however it is reasonably obvious they are guilty

[IcyNeko]

Taking out the Goa'uld was more self defense, considering that the Goa'uld were always attempting to erradicate Earth.

[BigBadBob]

The definition of genocide is Deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group. So is sg1 committing genocide. Yes sg1 has the right to defend themselves but its still genocide by killing all of the ori. It would be like the americans killing off all of the germans during world war II, or killing off all of the vietmese during the vietnam war. So is sg1 committing genocide. The definition of genocide is Deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group. So they fit the defintion, regardless of the purpose, its still genocide.

they will not stop until we all worship them or are dead. Simple as that.

It's us or them.

[spg_1983]

Was eradicating the Goa'uld any different then what they're doing now? not really, if anything, this is less severe then what they did the the goa'uld due to them not actually killing the Ori.

As for it being genocide, I doubt it, because even if there are Ori who don't agree with the rest, they seem content to not involve themselves on our plain so they wont even notice the difference, and really, all we are doing is throwing them into a theoretical prison. So legally, they(Sg1) are doing nothing wrong besides not giving them a trial, however it is reasonably obvious they are guilty

Im sorry when did we "eradicate" the goa'uld? They got their asses kicked by the replicators due to their own arrogance and that was enough of a weakness for the Jaffa to fully overthrow them, but their are still goa'uld out there. They are by no means all dead, just with out power or followers, plotting how to get back into power like Ba'al has been.