S10: Critique & Contemplation

[scifithinker]

Through a scheme involving goats, time travel, and a very unexpected pregnancy, I have managed to regain my soul.

So when's the kid due? And is it a goat or a human?

Doin' my part to add to the snark. Just sayin'.

[scifithinker]

I also preferred Brad's Quetesh, much much more than Rob's Vala.

I definitely agree with your assessment. As Qetesh, Claudia got to play a character who fit into the Stargate mythology without being shoehorned in. None of those pesky continuity errors to jar me out of my watching the story.

[VSS]

That still doesn't exclude the political appointment angle. Jack might've been forced to brief Landry on the program after Landry had been appointed by Kinsey or someone else.

Anyway: You're seeing it all wrong. Kinsey appointed Landry and then altered his memories to think Jack did it.

True. Absence of evidence isn't equal to evidence of absence- still, the twists and turns one must endure to maintain character continuity in the last two seasons is kind of painful, isn't it?

[Mandysg1]

[VSS]

Translation: I'm desperate enough to believe Jack wouldn't appoint Landry I'll believe anything.

[Mandysg1]

Translation: I'm desperate enough to believe Jack wouldn't appoint Landry I'll believe anything.

For a minute there, I thought you were trying your hand at s9 and 10 writing style

[suse]

Spoiler:

I thought they were great villains. They were like the Goa'uld, but they could back up their power with miracles. If you looked at it the right way you could see yourself converting to Origin, but there were very convincing arguments for doing so. They made Supergates and black holes, they were at least as powerful as the Ancients, and they just seemed generally unstoppable. We fought them every step of the way.
I will agree though that the Ark of Truth was kind of an anticlimactic end to the arc. Oh well. It was fun to watch.

Spoiler:

As could the Goa'uld, they just used a different trick. Basically they're like the Goa'uld but without the class, style, and history, and as such they are boring.

Had they at least shown a small bit of Ancient history by means of a flashback episode where we see the Ancients and Ori fighting, it would've at least given them something that made the substantial. Now they were nameless, boring enemies that worked through even lamer operatives.



Which doesn't make an iota of sense. They have the power, they have the technology, they have the knowledge, and yet they are stopped by a bunch of primitive apes with a fleet of about 3 vessels and primitive weapons? That requires WAY too much suspension of disbelieve.

The Ancients could wipe out life in a galaxy, then surely the Ori could instruct their priors to simply wipe out all life on Earth by means of constructing another Dakara device? It should be trivial for them. Plus, give the priors and soldiers some phasing technology and personal shields, and make them go through the Earth gate and simply take over from there. If the Tollan can escape from the SGC with primitive technology then surely the Ori could do the same.

This is what makes the Ori boring. They are nearly all powerful, have all the tech in the universe, and yet we all know they'll be stopped by the primitive apes from Earth. It makes no sense and severely limits their potential.

They would've been way more amusing had they invaded the Galaxy, nearly wiped out the Ancients and Earth would be the last bastion, protected by the remaining ancients, and the SGC would have to fight alongside the Goa'uld in a guerrilla warfare.



It was a lame cop-out. A big Deus ex Machina to solve a boring storyline.

Spoiler:

The Ori are this monolithic, überpowerful group of villains. They never engage their opponents with meaningful dialogue; they simply threaten and then kill. There is no real opportunity for SG-1 to hurt them. In the end, the only way the humans can defeat them is by finding a magic weapon from an ancient race and using it to commit genocide with no discussion of the ethical implications of their actions.

The Ori aren't complex enough to be interesting. The whole storyline is what I'd expect from an inexperienced fanfic writer.

Okay. You win. The Ori are boring. I will now remove any enjoyment I might have experienced while viewing the episodes in the last two seasons.

You can enjoy it. Really, I'm glad I guess someone did. What you can't expect to do is make a unilateral statement

I have given up all hope.

The Ori were not boring!

and not have it challenged here.


suse

[hedwig]

But, but that would make sense. Something that was in short supply for most eps in the last few years.



suse

[EvenstarSRV]

Most specifically, Insiders. Landry, knowing that that whole level was compromised, should have severed power/the intranet to forestall the specific thing that happened.

Yeah, that episode was mainly what I was referring to, along with Sam agonizing over getting Merlin's device to work in LITS, but not trying to shift the blame to Landry and the IOA for rushing her into it.

For me, it's character moments like that that humanize any TV show, but especially scifi shows since you're usually already dealing with a rather fantastical setting and events.

Their followers had to use a staff, the same way the Goa'uld had to use instruments. Yes, it was more powerful, but it was still technology. We don't know what the Ori use, we never saw them, only their followers. And flames.

I think besides the flames in Avalon/Origin, the only time we ever saw the Ori themselves was when Adria fought Morgan le Fay in Ark of Truth, which felt like a blatant copy from the Anubis/Oma scene in Threads.

What also bothered me about the Ori arc in season 10 was that after the build up to The Shroud, the next 4 episodes didn't really deal with fallout from the Ori's defeat. S10 was the first Stargate season I actually got see live, and it felt kinda like 'ok, the Ori are dead, now we've got time to go to high school reunions, have Jaffa revenge sprees, and humor Vala's dad'. It was very confusing.

[silly sally]

Very clever. DID YOU ALSO KNOW THAT RACE CAR SPELLED BACKWARDS IS RAC ECAR? (MORE COMMONLY KNOWN AS RACE CAR?)

I thought they were great villains. They were like the Goa'uld, but they could back up their power with miracles. If you looked at it the right way you could see yourself converting to Origin, but there were very convincing arguments for doing so. They made Supergates and black holes, they were at least as powerful as the Ancients, and they just seemed generally unstoppable. We fought them every step of the way.
I will agree though that the Ark of Truth was kind of an anticlimactic end to the arc. Oh well. It was fun to watch.

Clarke's law states "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
Ori were a bad, really bad re-hash of the Goual'd...
And boring

[Gregorius]

True. Absence of evidence isn't equal to evidence of absence- still, the twists and turns one must endure to maintain character continuity in the last two seasons is kind of painful, isn't it?

Season 7 prepared me well for explaining those things.

[Gregorius]

Clarke's law states "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
Ori were a bad, really bad re-hash of the Goual'd...
And boring

As I said to Suse: The Ori are like zombies, but instead of "Brains" they go "Convert".

[silly sally]

Vala was such a waisted opportunity. I'm doing a Star Trek marathon and after watching ST:TOS, ST:TNG, I've just finished "Deep Space Nine" and I've realized Vala could have been Stargate's version of Garak (the clever spy, shady man, that at first reluctantly and then with conviction helps the real heroes (SG-1)); heck they could have added some subtle, clever banter with Daniel too, just like it was between Garak and Dr. Julian Bashir...
But I guess Coop's long past capable of clever or subtle writing...

[Vladius]

Clarke's law states "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
Ori were a bad, really bad re-hash of the Goual'd...
And boring

Yeah, I know.

In some respects they were better than the Goa'uld. They felt more dangerous. From day one they burned Vala alive with lava... before bringing her back to the dead on the spot without any sarcophagus dilly we had to worry about.

Why were they boring?

[Ashizuri]

Why were they boring?

lets see, a group of beings who used their super powered technology to make people worship them as gods, killing anyone who didn't.

Aliens playing gods? Wait a minute, are they "false gods?"

Seems familiar...almost like I've seen this story before...


They were the same badguy we'd seen for 8 years, just dressed a bit differently. It's like putting a pig in a dress and trying to pass it off as a woman. Nope, still a pig.

That's why the Ori were boring for me. You can take away the glitter eye-liner and gold lame' but as badguys go, the Ori and the Goa'uld were pretty interchangable, and they did it better the first time around.

I personally found the Goa'uld infinately more appealing and dangerous. I mean, it took more than a magic box for SG-1 to defeat the Goa'uld. And for all we know, they're not defeated. (Goa'uld Kinsey is alive. Is, is, is! He had potential to be soooo awesome. He made it off that Alkesh, I refuse to believe otherwise.)