What's happening to SGA?

[J_schinderlin56]

I have a right to get irritated about stuff that annoys me. To me seeing certain things happen shapes my opinion about where I think the show is going. I think some of the things that have happend (and I won't repeat them) have had a negitive effect on where I see the show going (which was the question by the way) Then I think that I have the right to express my Opinion about it. If you don't fell that way good for you. In fact I agree with you guys on a lot of those points. But comming in here and "Mom"ing a disscussion or saying "You people need to grow up" Give me a break. We're talking about people pretending to fight aliens on the lost city of Atlantis. I've said all I'm going to say about this.

[matthewscott614]

The show's gone completely sideways... Lost its vision, lost its character... It's becoming another 'me too' Sci Fi show: put some aliens in + put it on another planet = got yourself a Sci Fi show. Now: add space ships that make big explosions and some 36-24-36 'doctors' and 'officers' = got yourself a GREAT Sci Fi show. Then: kill off half of major characters that actually add some substance and replace them with more 36-24-36 'doctors' and 'officers' = emotionally turbulent GREAT Sci Fi show. Finally: should it by some cosmic coincidence happen that you replace a major character that adds substance to the show with another one that adds substance to the show - kill it off and make it 'more' emotionally turbulent. P.S. - if you somehow managed to keep some good and developed characters, retard them into comedy reliefs.

You've got yourself a Great Sci Fi show!!!

Any similarity with SGA is purely coincidental...

BLAH...
Jure

Wright & Cooper are busy making kick ass movies,
meanwhile SGA is going down the **** hole.

[Detox]

Wright & Cooper are busy making kick ass movies,
meanwhile SGA is going down the **** hole.

The evidence seems to be contradicting that. The greater majority still enjoys Atlantis and all the episodes it's been turning out, and from what I can tell, with their People's Choice win and all, is that they're getting a even bigger audience base and are extending into more mainstream viewers.

[Alipeeps]

I have a right to get irritated about stuff that annoys me. To me seeing certain things happen shapes my opinion about where I think the show is going. I think some of the things that have happend (and I won't repeat them) have had a negitive effect on where I see the show going (which was the question by the way) Then I think that I have the right to express my Opinion about it. If you don't fell that way good for you. In fact I agree with you guys on a lot of those points. But comming in here and "Mom"ing a disscussion or saying "You people need to grow up" Give me a break. We're talking about people pretending to fight aliens on the lost city of Atlantis. I've said all I'm going to say about this.

You're more than entitled to your opinion and to express it and I never said anything to the contrary... I also never said anything about anyone needing to grow up and I would report any posts saying anything like that. My "mom-ing" was purely on the basis that the discussion was veering off-topic and into territory that the mods have asked people to steer clear of - i.e. speculation on Torri's motivations/feelings etc. We can't possibly know exactly what went on behind the scenes and we have no right to know.

You're entitled to feel that your perception of how Torri was treated has affected your enjoyment of the show but equally, other people are entitled to express their opinions and to respond to and clarify points you have made - e.g. about the contract situation.

[Linzi]

Obviously that's your opinion and you're entitled to it but I'd be interested to understand your reasoning behind that statement, that "nearly all" the episodes in Season 4 are rip-offs of SG1. I personally am not seeing that so maybe you could explain which SG1 episodes you think nearly all the Season 4 SGA episodes are ripping off and in what way? What SG1 episode, for example, does Reunion rip off? Or Missing? Or Spoils of War? Or Trio?



As has been explained several times in several threads, contracts in the acting industry simply don't work the same way as elsewhere - a 6 year contract for an actor does not mean a guarantee of 6 years of full-time work. It means the studio/production company are effectively paying the actor to "reserve" first dibs on their availability. It means full-time work for as long as a) the show gets renewed or b) the character remains part of the show. It's standard procedure, even when filming a pilot, before the show has even been picked up, to sign actors up for anywhere from 4 to 7 seasons right from the start - so that if the show is a success and does run for those years, the producers know they have the cast members available for as long as they need/want them. Characters are written out of shows ALL the time for all sorts of reasons and an experienced actor/actress knows how the system works. Sure, it's always going to be upsetting to be written out or have the role reduced, but making it sound like the studio/production company/TPTB pulled some kind of unusual, underhand manouevre and sacked someone half way through a guaranteed contract simply isn't accurate.

And folks, at the risk of playing mom, this thread isn't about how TPTB treated Torri or why she turned down the role in Season 5 etc etc... I'd hate to see this turn into another argument on that subject.

Agreed.

Any contract has a get-out clause for each side anyway. My husband works on contracts, has done for 20 years. If the company he's working for didn't want his services anymore then they're free to break the contract at any time. If, however, his contract has to be renegotiated periodically, then if he's not picked up, that's the way it goes. It's not personal or being treated badly at all.

As for the situation with Amanda. Well she didn't have any contract in place after season 4, so she was free to do what she wants.

I think what's happening to SGA is that it's evolving. Obviously some don't like what it's evolving in to. Equally there are those who prefer the changes.

Me? I go with the flow. I personally have been pleased with the majority of changes in SGA.

[Ice Wolf]

Their decisions to remove Weir and Carson had nothing to do with what the fans wanted. And they didn't screw up with Torri. They offered her a part to come back and she turned them down without even reading the script.

They offered her a part to come back, however her reasons for turning it down aren't know. What we know is that they only talked to her about 2 weeks ago about it. However aparently they had been working of the story since S4 wrapped. By the time they offered her the part she may have had other work lined up and couldn't fit it into her schedule. Had they wanted to assure that she would be back they should have contacted her earlier like all the other actors they were able to confirm in the press release. It looks like Mallozzi and co left it too late and they only have themselves to blame.

I think SGA has gone downhill and is not the show I loved any more. Its not the same show any more the feel of it is all different, sure it may still have the 4 members of SGA-1 still their, but the soul of the series seems to be gone, the spark isn't there for me any more. Weir being gone is one of the major reasons for me but its not the only one. Weir was more than just the leader, her interactions with the other characters made up a lot of the feel of the show. I think i could have still enjoyed the show with Weir being gone but for the way it was handled in the show, it didn't have the real impact that it deserved. When Daniel died in SG-1 the grief for the characters left carried through for more than just the episode he died. That didn't really seem to happen with Weirs death the writers handled it badly.

[MatroxMeteor]

I think SGA has gone downhill and is not the show I loved any more. Its not the same show any more the feel of it is all different, sure it may still have the 4 members of SGA-1 still their, but the soul of the series seems to be gone, the spark isn't there for me any more. Weir being gone is one of the major reasons for me but its not the only one.

I agree with you. SGA is going the same path Star Trek Enterprise did. They both had a very interesting premise with the possibility of very interesting stories that would make them unique. SGA was set in a different galaxy, with the team isolated from Earth, facing a new enemy and just beginning to uncover a wealth of Ancient heritage. They could've left Atlantis isolated for several more seasons, explore the galaxy, explore the races (the Genii seem such a wasted opportunity), develop characters. Instead, they went for instant action, new space ships, big guns and explosions. Sure, it makes for ratings, but in the long run it's not the VFX and guns and explosions that count. It's not what made SG-1 so big. Enterprise was exactly the same. They had an established universe, they had so much potential to explore first contacts with the Romulans, Vulcan-human relations, Andorians, early warp technology development and tests...? What did they do - they conjured up some stupid temporal cold war, a plot contraption that permitted them to think up new aliens every week. With new ships and big guns and explosions. They even invented the Talib... sorry, Suliban. These were never seen in any future Treks, but hey, that's OK - it was a temporal cold war, never really took place, erased in time, ... Oh yeah, Enterprise was cancelled after Season 4.

Weir was more than just the leader, her interactions with the other characters made up a lot of the feel of the show. I think i could have still enjoyed the show with Weir being gone but for the way it was handled in the show, it didn't have the real impact that it deserved. When Daniel died in SG-1 the grief for the characters left carried through for more than just the episode he died. That didn't really seem to happen with Weirs death the writers handled it badly.

Yeah, the impact of Weir's (and Carson's) death was just too shallow. They worked and lived together for three years, they endured hardships and mourned deaths of their friends, they established trust between themselves and relied on each other to make it through alive. But here after their deaths it seems like everyone recovered in a couple of days and forgot about them completely. I think many fans just cannot identify themselves with such characters. I cannot identify myself with such a character... In the end I remember SG-1 by the *team*, not by how they defeated big bad new aliens every second week with increasingly big guns and big explosions. Oh wait, they didn't do that!

[Erised]

MatroxMeteor, hmmm I don't know. Judging from the ratings, big guns and explosions aren't helping at all .

[Skydiver]

Folks

We have NO IDEA AT ALL what happened behind closed doors at Bridge between Torri and the producers. And it's irresponsible to be putting forth one's personal opinions and interpretations as fact.

[Heaven]

I agree with you. SGA is going the same path Star Trek Enterprise did. They both had a very interesting premise with the possibility of very interesting stories that would make them unique. SGA was set in a different galaxy, with the team isolated from Earth, facing a new enemy and just beginning to uncover a wealth of Ancient heritage.

yep. and here is what happened:
the different galaxy turned out to be just around the corner with 304s going back and forth every two weeks and not to mention the intergalactic gate bridge.
the expedition (if you can even call it that anymore) that was once isolated is now answering to the IOA.
and as for the Ancient heritage, Atlantis became nothing more than the SGC of the Pegasus galaxy, and the Ancients became a boring incompetent race of humans whose technology fails to surpass ours with the exception of the ZPM.

The original premise is pretty much gone now, and it's not coming back.
it's become a very different show.

They could've left Atlantis isolated for several more seasons, explore the galaxy, explore the races (the Genii seem such a wasted opportunity), develop characters. Instead, they went for instant action, new space ships, big guns and explosions. Sure, it makes for ratings, but in the long run it's not the VFX and guns and explosions that count. It's not what made SG-1 so big.

I agree.

[Briangate78]

The evidence seems to be contradicting that. The greater majority still enjoys Atlantis and all the episodes it's been turning out, and from what I can tell, with their People's Choice win and all, is that they're getting a even bigger audience base and are extending into more mainstream viewers.

Ratings are slightly higher from last season's 2nd half, and this season's 2nd half has more viewers than last season's 2nd half. Did you know that "Be All my sins Remember'd" had the most viewers since Season 2!

[EdenSG]

What’s happening to SGA?

It is going through cast changes, it is evolving, just as SG-1 did, Star Trek, Farscape and probably about 80% of the other shows out there do these days.

Some of the changes are by design of TPTB others are necessitated by decisions of the actors to leave or not return.

Personally I feel…
TPTB have a right to make changes they feel are in the best interest of the show – it is their show. Not only do they have to take a broad base of viewers into account, but also MGM, network people and advertisers.
Actors/Actresses have a right to leave a show. It is their life, their career, their decision.
Fans have the right to like or dislike the changes – it is their right to have an opinion.

I will never understand all the reasons for or the driving forces behind why actors make their decisions, or why TPTB make certain changes and therefore I will not sit in judgment of or blame the TPTB or the actors. Because I don't - and never will - have all the facts behind any on these decision I will not second guess them. I will never let an actor’s choice or a TPTB’s decision make me upset or angry because it is just a TV show and frankly they don’t have that power over me – and I won’t give it to them.

If TPTB make a creative decision – any creative decision whether it is a “big” one like a cast change or a “small” one like having a character ask another out for a drink it will be greeted by those who love it or hate it. You ask 10 different people to give their assessment of SGA this season and you will get 10 different answers. For this reason TPTB cannot let fan desires dictate the direction of the show. What fans want is way too polarized. As has been said before, which fans do they listen to? The one’s who love Weir or the ones that hate her? The ones that love (relation)ships or the ones that don’t? The ones that prefer stories on spaceships or the ones that prefer gate episodes? The list of differences among fans is endless. And no one fan group is more right or more justified in their opinion than another group. There is no righteousness of a cause here – just opinions based on one’s personal preferences/beliefs –nothing more, nothing less.

What is the end result of the season 4 changes so far? Some fans are happy and some fans are angry – nothing new. Ratings have been steady throughout the season and it has been picked up for another season. Personally, there are things about season 4 that I have really liked and other things I haven’t. For the most part I have very much enjoyed it and except for a few episodes I think it has been a strong season so far.

What will be the result of the changes is season 5? I have no idea, but I intend to tune into to find out. I try to go with the flow and see how things will work out. If I have a specific direction I want the show to go in and that doesn’t come to fruition I am not going to blame the actor or TPTB. How can I blame them for not seeing my vision? What makes my vision right? I can only see things from my own narrow perspective as a fan – I have no idea what the pressures, circumstances or expectations are behind the scenes. My expectations are for an entertaining show, interesting character development and some intriguing story lines – the specifics of how I leave up to TPTB. Cast changes can be good or bad, but I usually always find them interesting – and for the most part as long as the core premise of the show is intact I can deal with changes. The greatest power I have as a viewer, or a fan or what ever you want to call me is my right to decide whether I like it or not. And as long as I continue to enjoy it, I will watch it.

[MatroxMeteor]

Atlantis has lost friends and watching them try to cope with the loss

Where exactly did you see them trying to cope? Better yet, in which episodes were these friends mentioned at all? It seems to me that everything is going as if they never existed.

I still think the best is yet to come with the last 4 episodes. This season has had some of the best battles, a lot of character eps, and just some clever writing. I do hope next season can top this one.

Battles are OK, true (the wussification of the Aurora class cruiser is NOT!). But clever writing? Come on... Travelers & Larrin, Quarantine, that little Princess vs. the big bad Genii and the latest 'stuck in a big hole with no way out'? Hardly something to keep you on the edge of your seat...

[Briangate78]

Where exactly did you see them trying to cope? Better yet, in which episodes were these friends mentioned at all? It seems to me that everything is going as if they never existed.



Battles are OK, true (the wussification of the Aurora class cruiser is NOT!). But clever writing? Come on... Travelers & Larrin, Quarantine, that little Princess vs. the big bad Genii and the latest 'stuck in a big hole with no way out'? Hardly something to keep you on the edge of your seat...

Coping with mentioning friends.

After Lifeline, Weir's name came up several times, and they made it known to the viewers that the characters still thought she was alive and wanted to rescue her, and had guilty thoughts for leaving her behind. At the end of This Mortal Coil, the scene between Zelenka and Mckay, then Sheppard and Mckay is what we call coping with the loss of a friend.

Clever Writing

You just mentioned my least favorite eps this season, very interesting.

I am talking about eps like "Lifeline", "Reunion", "Tabula Rasa", "Doppleganger" "BAMSR", "Adrift", "This Mortal Coil", "Miller's Crossing", "The Seer", and Spoils of War". All had good writing and direction, IMO. I can watch these eps over and over again and still be entertained.

My only regret for next season is no Weir for the Weir story arc which had so much potential. Well Torri quit or declined the role, so nothing we can do about that. Good luck to her.

[Reiko]

Because the moddies want us to stayaway from the topic, I will refrain from discussing BTS with Torri .. but most people already know how I feel about that

Just wanted to weigh in on this, as I'm really glad to see I'm not the only one that's been less than thrilled with recent episodes. I (along with my family members that also follow the show) have been extremely disappointed with the season this year.

Oh, you're definately not the only one, Chopingrl84. Come to the Anti thread. We have cookies

Personally JM is doing a good job.

Personally I think that Wright and Cooper should have stayed. Despite the fact they were the ones who kiled Carson I do think management was much better under them.

SGA was set in a different galaxy, with the team isolated from Earth, facing a new enemy and just beginning to uncover a wealth of Ancient heritage. They could've left Atlantis isolated for several more seasons, explore the galaxy, explore the races (the Genii seem such a wasted opportunity), develop characters.

I agree with you MatroxMeteor. Though I think Atlantis should eventually contact Earth, I though their isolation in Pegasus could had have been prolonged for another season. I also think the Genii, and now even, the Wraith are a wasted opportunity. I'm tired of those godawful replicators

Yeah, the impact of Weir's (and Carson's) death was just too shallow. They worked and lived together for three years, they endured hardships and mourned deaths of their friends, they established trust between themselves and relied on each other to make it through alive. But here after their deaths it seems like everyone recovered in a couple of days and forgot about them completely. I think many fans just cannot identify themselves with such characters. I cannot identify myself with such a character... In the end I remember SG-1 by the *team*, not by how they defeated big bad new aliens every second week with increasingly big guns and big explosions. Oh wait, they didn't do that!

I also agree with you here. The characters and thier friendships held me for the first three seasons moreso that the SFX. But the sh*t hit the fan after Sunday. Absolutely no mention of Carson in the following two episodes. Elizabeth was only mentioned sparingly this season.

I don't know what I'm watching but it's not Stargate:Atlantis anymore...