Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Athenaktt]

Can't wait to read it!

On a sadder note (still got my Zen though it cost me a few tears) I was watching the profile on Paul in the season 2 extras and they showed a scene from the first reading and the three people in frame from right to left was Rainbow, Paul and Torri. Look at the order, Ford, Carson, Weir....what does that say to you?

What that says to me that those were the people Carson has had the most interaction with. Also since they are in a reading, those three have been in scenes together more than with the rest of team at least in the beginning of season 2.

"Always look on the bright side of life". That's my motto.

Oh great... now I have the song in my head... At least I got rid of the Psych theme song... D'oh!

[SallyLizzie]

I liked Kolya. He was the bad guy that always seemed to threaten Weir because he knows to hit John where it hurts.

I think he passed that info onto Cowen. Coup

Spoiler:

Didn't Cowen threaten to kill of one of her team every 15 minutes until he got what he wanted... starting with John? That makes me think that the Genii really aren't that bad. They don't really want to kill people, they just want to survive, which is why they started with Shep bc they knew she was most liklely to crack with him.

And I love that scene where she leans over her laptop. I was squeeing when I saw it. She expected more of him, he hurt her really bad there.

Reminded of the scene in... ToR?

Spoiler:

Where she's at her laptop and John comes in and leans over her shoulder. I think he says something about - gah! I can't remember! But she gives him this little look and the whole thing is really cute.

Because she obviously held him in higher light after saving her but in Hot Zone he just brought her right back down again, and it really did show.

It would have been something she expected of him in the beginning, and probably still at that point, except during TS/TE their relationship shifted slightly. John realised she meant more to him than just another boss and so his attitude changed after that, and they started to become closer ("Sometimes Elizabeth talks her way into a corner..." - the use of her name is warm and familiar, like when talking about a friend, not someone who is just a colleague). Elizabeth sees this change in him and I think that's why it hurt as much as it did; she thought they had turned a corner and he respected her enough to leave his insubordination behind.

I think Elizabeth's question of does he really trust her made him think about that. He does trust her and he does respect her but he also knows that there are situations where he will be the one more qualified to make the decisions. HZ taught him that there are ways about doing that, which don't include berating her order in public, and that he can actually make Elizabeth see his POV.

-- First Strike

Spoiler:

Which is why in FS he's so thrown that she won't give him the chance to reason with her, bc it's something that they 'do' now: John disagrees. John changes her mind. John feels better about taking whatever action but it's not like he's undermining her. So for him not to be able to do it this time, it had to leave a twinge of guilt. Not that he felt bad for what he was doing, but bc he felt bad for essentially going against Elizabeth.

-- as I was saying, lol. I think that realisation helped to kill the tension between them and just made their working relationship a lot easier, thus making it easier for their friendship to grow as well.

On Kolya

Spoiler:

ITA that his demise was a total waste. The final story should have involved Elizabeth. *pouts* But I was hoping he would remain John's nemesis for a long time.

Spoiler:

It certainly shouldn't have felt as empty as it did. It would have been a good excuse to give John some further development, and I think given the relationship they built up through TS/TE, Brotherhood, CG, that there should have been at least one little scene at the end showing John dealing with it (prefably with Elizabeth *las*)

So while usually I'm against dead characters coming back, I could live with Kolya coming back bc:

1. Robert Davi has such an amazing presence.
2. I love the Genii.
3. They could give Kolya the death he deserves.

[Blower'sGate]

Can't wait to read it!

On a sadder note (still got my Zen though it cost me a few tears) I was watching the profile on Paul in the season 2 extras and they showed a scene from the first reading and the three people in frame from right to left was Rainbow, Paul and Torri. Look at the order, Ford, Carson, Weir....what does that say to you?

It means nothing at ALL ! Everything's gonna be alright ! Plus I'm trying to finish my first chapter so keep your Zen on, cause I really need it right now... or I'll never be able to finish my damn chapter!

So, on a higher note ( and you still got your Zen ), my fanfic's about a weird stargate and ... lol. I can't spoil you guys !

[Vicky]

So, on a higher note ( and you still got your Zen ), my fanfic's about a weird stargate and ... lol. I can't spoil you guys !

Heeee! Fic! Can't wait to read it!

On Kolya:

Spoiler:

I still don't understand his death. He was my favourite bad guy and his death, in that particular ep, and like this... Gah...
This is why I've asked JM on his blog because he wrote the ep but he hadn't answered me! Meh!

@Athena: Thanks because now I have that song in my head too...

*goes back to write her fic*

[SazZat]

@Saz - During the season one I think she was more avare of those feelings than him... your post reminded me at that moment in Siege 3, when she gives him a hug. She comes down the stairs, so determinant, happy, her strength renewed... and hugs him, without shame or any doubt. And he is pretty amazed and surprised, and the look on his face reminds me of someone who recieved a wonderful gift one never expected.

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1139/bscap1120uy3.jpg

And then he carefully puts his hand between her shoulders, so gently ... WOW and then presses her a bit stronger to himself...
and after she pulls back, he can't hepl but smile... and smile... and smile never leaving his lips!!! Aaaaw!!

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/6248/bscap1122ks4.jpg

Awwww!! lol that is the only constructive thing I can say there....I really need to get the Season 2 box set now. Just have to work a couple more weekends and I should be in a position to spend some money

<snip>It would have been something she expected of him in the beginning, and probably still at that point, except during TS/TE their relationship shifted slightly. John realised she meant more to him than just another boss and so his attitude changed after that, and they started to become closer ("Sometimes Elizabeth talks her way into a corner..." - the use of her name is warm and familiar, like when talking about a friend, not someone who is just a colleague). Elizabeth sees this change in him and I think that's why it hurt as much as it did; she thought they had turned a corner and he respected her enough to leave his insubordination behind.

I think Elizabeth's question of does he really trust her made him think about that. He does trust her and he does respect her but he also knows that there are situations where he will be the one more qualified to make the decisions. HZ taught him that there are ways about doing that, which don't include berating her order in public, and that he can actually make Elizabeth see his POV.<snip>

Yeah I totally get what your saying. It definitely shows after those episodes that they have a much greater understanding for each others positions. They definitely trust each other more and I also think that once John knew that Elizabeth has faith in the decisions he makes it has made him become a little less reckless...well, not less reckless, but he doesn't feel he has to just do things for fear of getting told that he can't. He knows that his opinion does matter and that he will be listened to. I think that was an important thing as well.

[SGLAB]

Did you preorder them? Because I've known people who preordered their DVDs and get them a day or to before the street release date. But since you're waiting, probably not.

As for "The Eye"...

That is another reason why I love "The Storm/The Eye". I liked Kolya. He was the bad guy that always seemed to threaten Weir because he knows to hit John where it hurts. That's why I was irked in "Irresponsible"

Spoiler:

at how they killed Kolya. It was a pathetic and weak death for a character that we've spent over two years loving to hate.

Pre-ordered by two days. (Sunday night) I may get it Thursday at the earliest. I had some gift cards to SamGoody, but there's no store in my area so I ordered it on their website.

[SazZat]

A little gift for you all before I go offline for the night to watch some DVDs

It's nothing much. Could probably be used in a signature or something if any of you wanted.



I'm working on another desktop right now as well so I will definitely show it off on here sometime.
Sparky makes me feel so creative Soon I'll be writing fanfiction...or maybe not. Although the other day, during a theory lecture, I wrote a 4 page transcript that featured a lot of Sparky hurt/comfort/angst. I might just type that up someday. It was a good use of the 2 hours that would have otherwise been spent being bored and confused

Oh and I'll throw in a couple of icons for good measure as well. I haven't really made any real good ship ones in the last few days. I've mostly been doing induvidual Shep and Elizabeth. Not sure if you'd be interested in seeing them though so just a couple of basics for now:



nighty night!

[Vicky]

I love the second icon, Saz!


Yeah!!! I'm done with my fic!! It's into my beta's hands now!

So, G'night all, guys!

[Easter Lily]

Got my S2 boxset for Christmas... hehehe... *gloats* (I live on the other side of the planet) but haven't had the chance to break it in yet.

Great discussion people... I haven't had much time to participate lately... spending a lot of time on parenting forums instead.
Keep up the good work.

My favourite sparky moments:
All of them... especially the long looks.

[Blower'sGate]

First chapter : almost done !

[Athenaktt]

Easter Lily! It's been a while since I've seen you here! Good to know you're still lurking around.

I'd have to agree with you there. No matter how we "rank" the John/Elizabeth moments. All of them will have a special place in my heart because they are "Sparky moments"

[Anjirika]

What that says to me that those were the people Carson has had the most interaction with. Also since they are in a reading, those three have been in scenes together more than with the rest of team at least in the beginning of season 2.

"Always look on the bright side of life". That's my motto.

Oh great... now I have the song in my head... At least I got rid of the Psych theme song... D'oh!

But you don't understand, it was during the reading of the pilot. That was it, it was how they were sitting round the table with all of them. It has nothing to do with the scene at all....

It means nothing at ALL ! Everything's gonna be alright ! Plus I'm trying to finish my first chapter so keep your Zen on, cause I really need it right now... or I'll never be able to finish my damn chapter!

So, on a higher note ( and you still got your Zen ), my fanfic's about a weird stargate and ... lol. I can't spoil you guys !

Well I see symbolism everywhere and to me it's urber creepy that the three characters that have left chronologically were sitting beside each other at the very beginning with Sheppard beside Ford I think and Teyla beside Lizzie, but it was hard to tell because only Rainbow, Paul and Torri were in the frame for more than a split-second....

....I just see it as a whole karma/foreshadowing thing thats super creepy. I mean, Ford was the furthest from the camera with Carson and Elizabeth following. It's the boot order of Atlantis.....

[Athenaktt]

But you don't understand, it was during the reading of the pilot. That was it, it was how they were sitting round the table with all of them. It has nothing to do with the scene at all....

You're saying the TPTB planned for the failing of Ford's character and the others from the beginning? And the seating arrangements are foreshadowing the future of other characters? I wouldn't give the TPTB that much credit since that was nearly 4 years ago assuming planning the Atlantis pilot began a year earlier or more. I think the TPTB writing the pilots at that time were too busy planning a pilot that will let them get picked up for a whole season than plotting the demise of characters two or three years down the line.

I wouldn't call it symbolism or foreshadowing and definitely not karma, but probably and most likely coincidence.

Sometimes over-analyzing things can be bad, especially when it make you and others feel bad.

[Athenaktt]

Now onto less gloomier news and to bring the thread back to the happy place we were a few pages eariler.

We were talking about Sparky moments...

Aside from the number of wonderful eye!sex that goes on between John and Elizabeth. All the balcony scenes indoor and outdoor up-to-date are my favorite scenes too.

There is something about just seeing the two of them in the balcony that is so private and it is like they are just in there own little world for that moment. Even if they are staying in a bustling control room with Rodney in the background ready to interrupt.

Here are a couple caps that I found in my collection. Feel free to add more.

"Underground"


"Before I Sleep"


"The Gift"

[Ronnikins]

Let's not forget the John!butt:desk scenes!

Spoiler:

From Critical Mass



From Coup d'Etat

And somebody mentioned something about John leaning over Lizzie?



and one more for good measure.



From Tao Of Rodney