Star Trek Into Darkness : Spec/Ideas/News (SPOILERS)

[DigiFluid]

What sells TV does not necessarily sell a movie.

Not one Trek movie has been about exploration. Every one of them has had a villain in one form or another. Seven of eleven have been good to excellent. No sense in messing with an established pattern of success.

[Snowman37]

Perhaps, maybe you're right. Every good story needs a good antagonist, right? What about the stories without antagonists that excelled with the audience? What's your response to that? Sphere didn't have a villain. Generations had the best villain. Soran wasn't out for revenge, he wasn't out to conquer, and he wasn't out to destroy. He simply wanted to get back to the Nexus. Destroying whole solar systems? Collateral damage. That made him interesting.

[jelgate]

Soran was still an antagonist

[Snowman37]

I just said that. Why are you repeating me?

[jelgate]

Because you contradicted yourself

[Snowman37]

No, I did not. You should read more carefully before clicking reply.

[jelgate]

Yes you did. You should take your own advice

[Snowman37]

Prove it. Let's see some quotes.

[jelgate]

No. I not required to prove how you say you do not want an antagonist for the Trek movie and then use antagonist stories to justify it

[Morbo]

Perhaps, maybe you're right. Every good story needs a good antagonist, right? What about the stories without antagonists that excelled with the audience? What's your response to that? Sphere didn't have a villain. Generations had the best villain. Soran wasn't out for revenge, he wasn't out to conquer, and he wasn't out to destroy. He simply wanted to get back to the Nexus. Destroying whole solar systems? Collateral damage. That made him interesting.

i agree. i think he was the best villain as well precisely becasue of his motivation. and generations is a great movie i don't care what anyone says.

Not every movie needs an antagonist. Why can't space itself threaten the Enterprise? Why does the entire Federation have to be in jeopardy? A big reason why I love Insurrection is that the Enterprise crew were trying to protect one planet that no one really cared about except for the people living on it. I want to see more stories like that. I'm getting tired of X villain wants to destroy the entire Federation. That's happened in First Contact, Nemesis, Star Trek (2009), and it seems to be the plot of the next movie. In The Motion Picture and The Voyage Home, it was only Earth in jeopardy. In The Wrath of Khan, The Search for Spock, and The Final Frontier, it was merely the Enterprise. The Undiscovered Country dealt with space politics between the Federation and the Klingons. I could go on and on, but ya'll get the idea. I'm just tired of super villains trying to destroy the entire Federation. Going after a single planet such as Earth, OK, it's Star Trek, so going big by jeopardizing an entire planet makes sense. But why does it have to be the entire Federation, several hundred planets and moons?


The movie's negative feedback has nothing to do with the absence of a villain. It was criticized for being too slow in pacing.


But isn't that what they did in half the episodes?

nero didn't want to destroy the federation. his main revenge was on spock, and vulcan. sure he was angry that starfleet didn't do anything to help romulus, and then after starfleet got involved trying to stop him in his quest, he set out for earth.

and as far as the TNG episodes, sure there was space exploration going on, but only in a very few episodes did anything have to do with discovering new life, or new nebulae, etc. and even then, someTHING ultimately was threatening the enterprise.
i mean, think about it.
are you going to watch an episode where they find a nebula, and send out a probe, and the whole rest of the episode is Data and Geordi giving technical information about the nebula's makeup, particles, refractory differentials, and color combinations?
RIVETING television, right there.

[Morbo]

oh, and did anyone notice at the end of the japanese trailer the erie similarity to the end of wrath of khan? homage? retelling? coincidence?

[Pharaoh Hamenthotep]

Not every movie needs an antagonist. Why can't space itself threaten the Enterprise? Why does the entire Federation have to be in jeopardy? A big reason why I love Insurrection is that the Enterprise crew were trying to protect one planet that no one really cared about except for the people living on it. I want to see more stories like that. I'm getting tired of X villain wants to destroy the entire Federation. That's happened in First Contact, Nemesis, Star Trek (2009), and it seems to be the plot of the next movie. In The Motion Picture and The Voyage Home, it was only Earth in jeopardy. In The Wrath of Khan, The Search for Spock, and The Final Frontier, it was merely the Enterprise. The Undiscovered Country dealt with space politics between the Federation and the Klingons. I could go on and on, but ya'll get the idea. I'm just tired of super villains trying to destroy the entire Federation. Going after a single planet such as Earth, OK, it's Star Trek, so going big by jeopardizing an entire planet makes sense. But why does it have to be the entire Federation, several hundred planets and moons?


The movie's negative feedback has nothing to do with the absence of a villain. It was criticized for being too slow in pacing.


But isn't that what they did in half the episodes?

So it would be the Enterprise fighting the vasty nothingness of space? Kirk goes head to.. nothingness against the near vacuum of the void between planets? Spock uses logic against explosive decompression? How exactly would that movie work?

[Snowman37]

No. I not required to prove how you say you do not want an antagonist for the Trek movie and then use antagonist stories to justify it

I think you need to work on your reading comprehension. I did not contradict myself. I conceded.

A vast number of episodes from the various shows are indeed about space itself without a villain. Does anyone remember Voyager's "The Cloud?" Voyager flies through a nebula without realizing it was a living creature. The ship had to fly back in, repair the damage, and get back out without taking on damage itself. Granted, that wouldn't fly with a movie, but point is, there were a lot of episodes like that. Now, can a movie be done without a villain? Sure. Nothing comes to mind right now, but when I think of something, I'll come back and post it. Now, let's run with the idea of the movie needed an antagonist. Why does he have to be out to destroy the Federation? I already saw this in the movies with the Borg, Shinzon, and Nero. Again? Why can't it just be a single planet at stake? That worked in the original series movies when it was just Earth being threatened by V'Ger and the Whale probe. It also worked for TNG when it was a solar system with an inhabited planet in Generations and the Ba'ku's homeworld in Insurrection.

[jelgate]

I think you need to work on your reading comprehension. I did not contradict myself. I conceded.

Which is just another way to acknowledge you were wrong

[Ukko]

So it would be the Enterprise fighting the vasty nothingness of space? Kirk goes head to.. nothingness against the near vacuum of the void between planets? Spock uses logic against explosive decompression? How exactly would that movie work?

Dont be silly PH. You fight space by filling it all up......with......squares and rectangles.

Spoiler:

STAR TREK: THE WRATH OF TETRIS!!!
The Eighties are back, and this time, its.....personal?