Deep Space 9 Superior

[USS Defiant]

Does this look like the IMdb board to you?. The second you came on here you attacked DS9 and any DS9 fan in general as these types that like only DS9 and everything else Trek sucks. Why don't you save that crap and negative energy for the other forum and spare us your biased opinion.

Word brother Weyoun!. Don't listen to mr. morale policeman tell you otherwise, what you said is not over the line, it's dead on hilariously correct. Then ya got flyerdog, replying with "touchy, aren't we?" LOLOLOL. Brother Starbase is right flyer, I think you might just find us pretty cool cats if you put away your angst, unlike other DS9 fans on another board that seem to have irked you permanently.

[the Fifth Race]

Forgive me brother Fifth and brother Davis for I did not like Blade.

You are forgiven my son. LOLOL, somehow I had the feeling you would go the other way on this one brother jelgate. I do love your new DS9 worm-hole avatar!.

Ah, The Omega Man and Soylent Green are the next two Charlton Heston films for me to see and I can't wait to buy them on DVD. Thanks for pointing them out, brother Starbase.

Count me a huge Soylent Green and The Omega Man fan as well. If you or anyone that hasn't seen these 2 epic scifi classics as of yet, you are in for a huge treat!.

Agreed, remakes don't usually have a very good track record, but if they are executed in a creative and inventive way, it can even become superior to their original counterparts. Ron Moore's "Battlestar Galactica", Last of the Mohicans, David Cronenberg's "The Fly" (which there remaking for a 3rd version in 2009) and Sci-Fi Channel's "Dune".

Good calls brother WS, The Fly and Scifi Channels Dune were both very good films. A few others off the top of my head that are IMO better than the original or an earlier version are -- The Thing with Kurt Russell -- 3:10 to Yuma with Russell Crowe -- Cape Fear with Robert DeNiro -- Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1978 version) with Leonard Nimoy -- Scarface with Al Pacino -- The Ten Commandments with Charelton Heston -- Walking Tall with the Rock -- The Wicker Man with Nicolas Cage.

Agreed, brother FR. I absolutely love Army of Darkness! It's good, wacky fun! LOL. Horror movies that have a nice blend of comedy are the best! I think the two go together in a perverted sort of way. LOL.

I just dusted off my Army of Darkness DVD the other night and re-watched it. Still brilliantly funny and twisted. God I love that movie!.

I agree with you again on this one too, brother FR. The only thing is, I was hoping that Raimi would have included Spiderman's notorious wise-cracking jokes based from the comics I've enjoyed reading during my preteen years. Still, he's done a terrific job with Spidey just the same.

Good call again brother WS. I was kind of waiting for the wise-cracking Spiderman which we got a few glimpses of in the films, but not nearly as much as we got in the comics.

[flyerdog]

Word brother Weyoun!. Don't listen to mr. morale policeman tell you otherwise, what you said is not over the line, it's dead on hilariously correct. Then ya got flyerdog, replying with "touchy, aren't we?" LOLOLOL. Brother Starbase is right flyer, I think you might just find us pretty cool cats if you put away your angst, unlike other DS9 fans on another board that seem to have irked you permanently.

ditto

[USS Defiant]

ditto

LOL, see, no need to fear us evil and diobolical DS9/Trek fans here on GW flyerdog.

[USS Defiant]

DS9 Season III Episode Discussion
Episode #59 Heart of Stone

Kira and Odo chase a Maquis criminal to an isolated planet where they track him on foot through rocky caves. Kira gets her foot stuck in a bizarre crystal that begins to envelop her entire body. Now Odo must free her before she faces a rather claustrophobic demise.

Kira becomes trapped by the end of the first act. Using phasers instantly proves to be a bad idea as the crystal simply absorbs the energy blast and displays a sudden growth spurt. Odo's next attempt is to use a jerry-rigged device from the Runabout to create sound waves at a frequency that may break down the crystal. Naturally, these things take time, and as the computer analyses the composition of the rocky substance, Odo and Kira find they have little to do but talk.

Since "The Collaborator," we had suspected that Odo has some buried feelings for Kira. In "Fascination," the writers confirmed so, as it ends with a disappointed Odo pondering over his affections for Kira as she (presumably) walks away with Vedek Bareil. She hasn't the slightest clue how Odo feels about her. She considers him a close friend--nothing more. Then, in the last episode, in what now seems to be part of a master plan to develop this whole thread, the writers wrote Bareil out of the show by killing him on the operating table. With "Heart of Stone," they waste no time to delve back into this storyline. The results are mixed--often interesting, but in the end (as I will explain in a moment) fairly meaningless.

On the upside, there's a memorable bit where Odo tells Kira the story about how he got his name. Derived from the Cardassian word "nothing," Odo, initially a misunderstood liquid, was destined to be forever known as nothing, even after everyone learned he was a sentient being. It really makes you feel for the guy, and it's nice to see how far the writers have evolved this character in the past two years.

This whole show, however, basically rides on the outcome resulting from one scene, which goes like this:

Kira: "I want you to get out of here."
Odo: "Don't you understand? I can't!"
Kira: "You have to. Odo, please!"
Odo: "No. I won't leave you."
Kira: "Why?"
Odo: "Because! Because--I'm in love with you."

This scene is wonderfully performed by Auberjonois, who does the job of convincing us that Odo has all of these bottled up emotions that begin exploding out of him. But when Kira returns with "I'm in love with you, too" the scene rings somewhat false, because from what we've been spoon-fed on this issue for the entire Season III, Kira considers Odo a close friend and nothing more. Simply put, life isn't that easy. This is not a storyline that is about instant happy endings. It's about unreturned feelings.

Fortunately, the script ultimately nullifies this line, because even Odo doesn't believe it. He suspects that this is not really Kira, because Kira would never lie to him, even in a situation like this. Odo is right, as False Kira morphs into her true self--the still nameless shapeshifter (Salome Jens) who tried to coax Odo into taking his "proper place" as a Founder in "The Search." In fact, the shapeshifter masqueraded as the Maquis terrorist, then kidnapped and stashed Kira away in hope of again luring Odo back to the "Great Link."

Set as a B-story is a lightweight but amiable yarn involving Nog trying to persuade Sisko to recommend him for Starfleet Academy. He says he doesn't want to end up like his father Rom, who has chased fortune his entire life with little success. Not much to mention at the this time, but as we all know, Nog makes good on his promise to Sisko.

"Heart of Stone" has some good dialogue and engaging moments. I will give it a 7.7 rating.

[the Fifth Race]

DS9 Season III Episode Discussion
Episode #59 Heart of Stone

The gimmick of this episode was unsuccessful because Kira and Odo have been so inconsistent this season, it's hard to tell when we're dealing with the real Kira and when it's an evil impostor. I didn't find it implausible that the present incarnation of Kira would lie to Odo about her feelings if she thought she were dying. I should have started to doubt her when she began sniveling. It seemed strange that she would get weepy over a rockslide when the love of her life died a week ago, yet she as giggling with Odo through the entire teaser. She also seemed too scared, and not pissed off enough. So although I cringed when she came out with "I love you, too," I didn't find it THAT much more out of character then, say, her little fling with Bashir in "Fascination."

Odo was very moving in declaring his feelings, but the situation was so forced that I felt sorry for him more as a character on a bad TV series than as a person with pain I could relate to. He didn't get to show a lot of range, be he does anguish so well that I didn't much care. I wish he hadn't come out and said he loved her, that's the sort of scene that should be left to all of out imaginations...but since she didn't actually hear it, I guess it still can be. His explanations at the end were magnificently understated.

But what was the shapeshifter going to do if someone OTHER than Kira was in the runabout with Odo? Did she sit around and wait for the two of them to leave the station together? A lot more doesn't make sense than the fishy situation on the moon. And did they say they were going to fly the runabout into the Badlands, after we've been told specifically on Voyager that no other Federation ships can fly there? Sigh.

A lot of this episode reminded me of Classic Trek - I liked the big dark cave set, the Nasty Alien Entity which they immediately tried to kill because that's what one does with Nasty Alien Entities. I loved the subplot, although I really thought Sisko needed to explain a thing or two to Nog BEFORE writing the damn letter!.

I didn't care for Heart of Stone, I give it 7.0 star rating

[Rac80]

you know it's funny because the ratings system is so silly these days...granted studios would rather go for the PG-13 than R as it = greater revenue..but as an example..the upcoming MOvie "Hancock" was going to be an "R" movie because of one scene: where Hancock hands a bottle of booze to a child..the ratings board told them they had to remove that scene or get an 'R' rating...

in Casino Royale, Daniel Criag was forbidden from smoking on screen..or the would give it an "R" rating

it seems that excessive alcohol use or tobacco use = "R"

Yep but sex or gore will get you a PG-13. I would rather see the smoking and drinking. I look at it as an attempt atsocial engineering not political correctness(which I really have MAJOR issues with as well!). Now I neither smoke nor drink but I would rather see that than sex and violence. which is why I avoid most "dark" movies and all horror! Harry Potter 5 is about as dark as I like. I know, but as I said I work with REAL criminals (clerking for a judge part-time these days) and the horrors they perpetrate and thus I prefer "fluff" movies!
Nope I am not a DS9 snob, I like ALL trek (well, except for TNG as everyone here knows) just liked DS9 best but I also loved VOY ....janeway was great!

[nx01a]

I'm a sucker for Kira/Odo. I'm also a real sucker for the Female Shapeshifter and her machinations with Odo. I'm also a sucker for Odo in general! Nog and Sisko... Sigh. The days before he traded Sisko's desk.
We see the Changelings' ability to mimic people very effectively [sans Odo's limitations], foreshadowing 'The Die Is Cast' and 'The Adversary', not to mention the rest of the series.

Now Odo must free her before she faces a rather claustrophobic demise.It's quite ironic that Nana Visitor herself is deathly claustrophobic.

Heart Of Stone: 7.5/10

[Krisz]

As we are all different, so are likes and dislikes. How people deal with these various viewpoints is the key. I for instance have a veriety of interests, some I'm more passionate about than others. If I want to share my passion for things I go and find like minded people. Hence this thread and GW for Stargate, for instance. Having a wider interest also brings you into contact with the people who are passionate about the things you aren't but do like for differing reasons.

This is what I find here. A group of people who are passionate and informed about certain topics and are interested to learn more that comes from actually taking note of what others say about topics they may not have that great an interest in. I for one am not a fan of the new Dr Who but I enjoy the discussions about it because I'm interested in what makes it good for those that like it. I have given shows and movies a look that I've previously dismissed as a result of the discussions on here. I believe having an open mind is important, including myself on occasion!

I personally saw Flyerdog's views of fans of various Treks bashing other Treks as frustration with the nature of discussion, ie: the lack of it on other boards. I took it that he/she felt that at least there was reasoned discussion here regardless of what personal opinion is held about DS9 or other Trek series'. As long as there is a reasoned argument to back up an observation, instead of 'Trolling' I will give that viewpoint a hearing.

However, at the end of the day it is a thread for those like me who feel DS9 gives more depth to the Trek universe and worthy of the 'Superior' title in all the ways you will find discussed here. It is not perfect in every way but it is worthy of its place as the top Trek show in my opinion.

[flyerdog]

Trivia question:

Which actor from a Star Trek Series was once on M*A*S*H ?

[the Fifth Race]

As we are all different, so are likes and dislikes. How people deal with these various viewpoints is the key. I for instance have a veriety of interests, some I'm more passionate about than others. If I want to share my passion for things I go and find like minded people. Hence this thread and GW for Stargate, for instance. Having a wider interest also brings you into contact with the people who are passionate about the things you aren't but do like for differing reasons.

This is what I find here. A group of people who are passionate and informed about certain topics and are interested to learn more that comes from actually taking note of what others say about topics they may not have that great an interest in. I for one am not a fan of the new Dr Who but I enjoy the discussions about it because I'm interested in what makes it good for those that like it. I have given shows and movies a look that I've previously dismissed as a result of the discussions on here. I believe having an open mind is important, including myself on occasion!

I personally saw Flyerdog's views of fans of various Treks bashing other Treks as frustration with the nature of discussion, ie: the lack of it on other boards. I took it that he/she felt that at least there was reasoned discussion here regardless of what personal opinion is held about DS9 or other Trek series'. As long as there is a reasoned argument to back up an observation, instead of 'Trolling' I will give that viewpoint a hearing.

However, at the end of the day it is a thread for those like me who feel DS9 gives more depth to the Trek universe and worthy of the 'Superior' title in all the ways you will find discussed here. It is not perfect in every way but it is worthy of its place as the top Trek show in my opinion.

Word Lady Kris. So very well said, I couldn't agree more!.

I to find myself fascinated with all the various scifi discussions that break out on this thread. Even if I don't like the particular show, movie, genre, etc.. I still find myself very interested in everyone's opinions and takes. I have expanded my overall scifi knowledge by three fold, I have been introduced to new and exciting shows, series and movies that I never gave a thought about before, and I have made some pretty darn good friends along the way. Onething this thread has proven to me is that DS9/Trek fans are some of the smartest people around.

[the Fifth Race]

Trivia question:

Which actor from a Star Trek Series was once on M*A*S*H ?

That would be Rene Auberjonois aka Odo who played the original Father Mulcahey in the M*A*S*H: Motion Picture. Heck I remember Rene as the Benson's snooty boss Clayton Runnymede Endicott III (love that name!) on said named show.

I understand the Gary Burghoff aka Radar is a huge Star Trek fan and tried to land a role on TNG.

Have you gone back over this thread and seen the Trek Quizzes I put together twice a month Flyerdog?. My Quizzes cover mainly TNG, DS9 & VOY with a minimum of TOS, ENT and Trek Movie questions. Half the Quiz is multiple choice and half are fill-in questions. There always great fun and challenging. I am posting my next one a week from Monday, I hope you join us for the fun.

[Lieutenant Colonel Davis]

Trivia question:

Which actor from a Star Trek Series was once on M*A*S*H ?

Rosalind Chao. She played Klinger's wife.

[gopher65]

Actually a lot of my favourite episodes of Star Trek are VOY and ENT episodes. And I just rewatched most of TNG season 3, and I have to say, season 3 is *so* much better than seasons 1 and 2 that I caught a year or two ago on a random cable channel. Lots of good episodes in the first 3/4 of season 3, including one of my favourite Star Trek episodes, Yesterday's Enterprise. I bet those Romulans were caught off guard when the Enterprise-C blinked for a moment, then suddenly had fully recharged shields and weapons .

[Krisz]

I found ENT hard going to start with. Moving to another country broke up my viewing of it so I forgot about it for a couple of years. I did get an opportunity to watch it finally to the finale. It did get more interesting through the 3rd and 4th series, so I'm glad I gave it another chance.

There is a lot I like about ENT, such as the way they made the Enterprise feel like it was a logical development from Cochran's prototype. There was also a good sense of the human race's first tentative steps into the unknown. I appreciated the attention to detail of things like this. Whilst I couldn't really get to grips with and see the point of the 'Temporal Cold War' theme, all the early interactions with alien species that we get to see in later Trek were always a joy to see. One of my favourite characters was Shran, got to love Jeffrey Combs, he brings such depth to the characters he plays on Trek.