The Political Discussion Thread

[Ian-S]

"Former CIA officer" is all I need to read, obviously Joe Public is no longer buying the BS stories about terrorist cells hiding around every corner so someone's invented a new term, 'supercell'.

How original.

[Annoyed]

Lets all carry those lil things about that you can pee in when you cant find a toilet, those plastic things, then empty them in big tanks, or save till you get home, problem solved

You have no idea how close to home that hits.

I'm in the process of shopping for a used powerboat to have fun on Lake Ontario & the St. Lawrence with. I would prefer an open bow type, but have to go for a cuddy cabin style instead because I'm a diabetic, which normally makes you have to relieve yourself more often then usual. Combine that tendency with modern medications which deliberately dump excess sugar into the urine bladder via the kidneys, and you end up having to "go" at least once every couple of hours.

So I decided on the Cuddy style just so that I have a place to put a porta-potty so I don't have to worry about being too far from acceptable facilities.

[Annoyed]

What, urinals in a unisex toilet? Isn't that a little bit sexist seeing as the women can close the cubical door?

No way, if men have to stand at urinals in unisex toilets then there's no dam doors for women to hide behind....

Good point! You want equality, let's have equality!

[garhkal]

When does that happen -- like I said the ladies' line is always a mile long.

Unless it's dad's taking their little daughters -- and boy, have I heard funny stories about those events.

Guys often go when ever, gals i often see going during breaks. So often those lines are NOT there all the time. Just like the last 2 times i went to the theater, the guys was full up and had like 8 people outside of it, but there was only 3 gals standing outside theirs..

Have you been forced to worship your god in private for fear of abuse?

Judging by the # of times there has been stories in the news about this or that school being sued to stop xyz praying, holding bible studies, removing pictures of jesus and such, i would say we are very CLOSE to that..

No one is talking about taking away gendered bathrooms.

You might be surprised to hear this.. But, and you might want to sit down..

Everyone has used a unisex bathroom.. You might, and this is the shocking part, you might even have one in your own home.

That we do. BUT these discussions are about forcing it into public venues such as schools, malls etc..

Now for the rest of you...if we are to keep gendered bathrooms and make laws about them, then who should go where? Should it only be transitioned/birth men in the men's room and transitioned women in the women's bathroom? Should it be based on self identification? If transitioned, how much down the road does one have to be before they go to the other gender's bathroom? How much of a burden do facilities have to face in creating a unisex bathroom if that's the solution? (Remodeling for an extra room with plumbing isn't cheap for smaller buildings while a bit more affordable for huge shopping malls).

To ME, if they are born male, or have fully crossed from female to male (not still undergoing hormone therapy, but have had all the ops needed), they should be in the male toilet/shower/locker room. If they are born female or have fully crossed to female from male then they should be in the gals.. If they are 'transitioning, they should stay in their original gender's room. OR use ones assigned as 'uni-sex' so anyone can be in there.

And no, just "self identifying" is IMO no where near enough to allow someone to just go ahead and use the other restrooms or showers..

The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to speak publicly about the investigation.

I told you so...

I always have to laugh at that. If they are unauthorized to speak about it, why the frak ARE they speaking about it? Why are there never charges levied against those who DO??

[Coco Pops]

So if an LGBT or gay cake shop owner refuses to prepare a white wedding cake for a straight couple getting married, is that them just expressing their rightful opinion, or is it discrimination?

That would be the same discrimination as if a cake shop owner did not make one for a gay LGBT couple....... It works both ways.

Why the hell does everyone bring up this mythical cake shop?

Has it actually ever happened?

Didn't Mississippi pass such legislation?

Will gays now be segregated as that state was famous for that?

[Coco Pops]

"Former CIA officer" is all I need to read, obviously Joe Public is no longer buying the BS stories about terrorist cells hiding around every corner so someone's invented a new term, 'supercell'.

How original.

The politics of using fear to scare the public isn't working so they have to up their game.

[Gatefan1976]

You have no idea how close to home that hits.

I'm in the process of shopping for a used powerboat to have fun on Lake Ontario & the St. Lawrence with. I would prefer an open bow type, but have to go for a cuddy cabin style instead because I'm a diabetic, which normally makes you have to relieve yourself more often then usual. Combine that tendency with modern medications which deliberately dump excess sugar into the urine bladder via the kidneys, and you end up having to "go" at least once every couple of hours.

So I decided on the Cuddy style just so that I have a place to put a porta-potty so I don't have to worry about being too far from acceptable facilities.

[Serious mode]
Have you considered looking into your diet on a very aggressive level dude?
PM me if you want to, cause I know a few people who have had diabetes and have managed to control it via diet without drugs.
[/Serious Mode]

[garhkal]

Why the hell does everyone bring up this mythical cake shop?

Has it actually ever happened?

You obviously have not paid attention to the news.. Here is just 3 links to reports on bakeries/cake shops sued for not willing to bake a cake for a gay marriage..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/07...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/06...s-beliefs.html

[SGalisa]

Have politics gotten so bad that the discussions have *tanked* down into the "toilet talk" now?
Too funny!

(Warning--some of the below might be graphic in text..)

To ME, if they are born male, or have fully crossed from female to male (not still undergoing hormone therapy, but have had all the ops needed), they should be in the male toilet/shower/locker room. If they are born female or have fully crossed to female from male then they should be in the gals.. If they are 'transitioning, they should stay in their original gender's room. OR use ones assigned as 'uni-sex' so anyone can be in there.

And no, just "self identifying" is IMO no where near enough to allow someone to just go ahead and use the other restrooms or showers..

Agree with the above, because it makes sense.
So, when our coworker who was a he, but is now almost a full she (except for the extra appendage snippage, which no one seems to be asking about) comes into the restaurant's public ladies room, those of us who *know* might get a tad giggly behind the scenes, but it should be perfectly normal, since he is now wearing mini skirts in addition to the boobage tops..
No one blinks twice in the unisex restroom, because it's private, and yah go to whichever one is available.

But in public, it's like walking into a bathroom with your in-laws. Just weird. Most of my in-laws' family likes to keep their restroom times separate from each other, so when we're in the same room and in the stall next to them, it's just plain weird. Same thing with work -- going from private unisex bathrooms (one toilet in each room) to a gender assigned group gathering is going to be just plain weird getting used to.

Had no problems in previous jobs with mutli-stalled toilets, but after 15 years of enjoying the privacy of a (single toilet) unisex bathroom and switching over to a gender grouped restroom in the same office, is going to take some adjusting. There are moments such as pooping and intestinal gas escaping that yah just don't want anyone who knows you to hear, and then there are other moments like tinkle-time when it sounds like the waters of Niagra Falls coming out. Plus, we'll know who's been leaving pee on the seats after all this time, as well as leaving *certain* (gasp/gagging *cough*) odors behind..!

It's the little things that matter..

...because I'm a diabetic, which normally makes you have to relieve yourself more often then usual. Combine that tendency with modern medications which deliberately dump excess sugar into the urine bladder via the kidneys, and you end up having to "go" at least once every couple of hours.

Once every few hours isn't all that bad. That is normal. I used to have issues with going every ten minutes for several hours--that is NOT normal. Problem seemed to get corrected or healed when I began taking nutritional supplements (powder mix to add to juice or milk, which makes it more like a thickened shake drink), which fixed the leaky bladder issue within the first week. Never thought I'd ever see the day I didn't have "to go" for 3 hours. *whew!*

[Serious mode]
Have you considered looking into your diet on a very aggressive level dude?
PM me if you want to, cause I know a few people who have had diabetes and have managed to control it via diet without drugs.
[/Serious Mode]

I think that depends on which type of diabetes a person has, also. My hubby is type 2 and could reverse his problem if he put an effort into it, but he doesn't want to. My mom was type 1 and totally insulin dependent--so it wasn't as easy for her to reverse her situation. She was on so many meds that the meds were conflicting with her food diet and causing other problems. I was border line hypoglycemia, and managed to reverse that enough that I'm almost within what is considered *normal* ranges for blood sugar levels, etc.

When I began taking a nutritional powder supplement (mostly soy), and figured out which vitamins I *actually* needed that had to be taken individually, and not the amounts given in a multi-vitamin tablet, then my body started re-adjusting and healing to the new stuff my body wasn't previously getting. No meds, just supplement. There are still some issues, like skin rashes, but not sure if the supplement is causing that or some vitamin deficiency somewhere. Now the doctors are looking at both my vitamin lists (which I have to take certain B vitamins separate from a multi, and without A, because I get enough A, B1 and B2 already in my food diet) and seeing if there are any additional steps needed to be taken (like reduction or increase of something, such as vitamin B12).

[Falcon Horus]

"Former CIA officer" is all I need to read, obviously Joe Public is no longer buying the BS stories about terrorist cells hiding around every corner so someone's invented a new term, 'supercell'.

How original.

I kinda like the word.
Although, I was under the impression it was a word already in use to describe a superstorm... but that would still be a good analogy.

Guys often go when ever, gals i often see going during breaks. So often those lines are NOT there all the time. Just like the last 2 times i went to the theater, the guys was full up and had like 8 people outside of it, but there was only 3 gals standing outside theirs..

I find that women tend to think ahead, and go before the movie or whatever event so they don't have to go during, unless it's a really long event.

To ME, if they are born male, or have fully crossed from female to male (not still undergoing hormone therapy, but have had all the ops needed), they should be in the male toilet/shower/locker room. If they are born female or have fully crossed to female from male then they should be in the gals.. If they are 'transitioning, they should stay in their original gender's room. OR use ones assigned as 'uni-sex' so anyone can be in there.

Transitioned transgenders' hormone therapies never stop -- for the record.

And obviously you still don't understand the difference between gender and sex:

"In general terms, "sex" refers to the biological differences between males and females, such as the genitalia and genetic differences. "Gender" is more difficult to define but can refer to the role of a male or female in society (gender role), or an individual's concept of themselves (gender identity). "
Source: Sex And Gender: What Is The Difference?

Why the hell does everyone bring up this mythical cake shop?
Has it actually ever happened?

It has -- been talked about at length too in the thread, and in the Religious one too I think.
See Garkhal's links.

Didn't Mississippi pass such legislation?

HB1523 as was signed into law by the governor

Plenty of articles out there but here's where I found the link to the bill so I'll leave it here too:
Why Mississippi’s New Anti-LGBT Law Is the Most Dangerous One To Be Passed Yet

[Ian-S]

You obviously have not paid attention to the news.. Here is just 3 links to reports on bakeries/cake shops sued for not willing to bake a cake for a gay marriage..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/07...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/06...s-beliefs.html

I think they were more asking about when the roles have been reversed, which unless such stories are being suppressed for political reasons, it hasn't happened yet, which is fair enough, however the reason people bring it up as an example is that there is racist and homophobic incidents that do happen on the 'reverse' side, but these very rarely get reported with as such vigour as a traditional racist/sexist/homophobic event does.

Personally I think if you are running a business, you should set aside any notions of religious/racist/homophobic policies you have if you want to stay in business for very long, but it doesn't happen, just go into a Jewish Bakery and ask for a bacon sandwich and see what reaction you get, of course that is their right, but if a non-jewish shop said they could/would not serve kosher meat, that would be racism (happens in the UK a lot), my point was, which everybody seem to get here, is that racism/homophobia is not a one way street and works both ways, but try and bring that up and oh boy....

[SoulReaver]

You obviously have not paid attention to the news.. Here is just 3 links to reports on bakeries/cake shops sued for not willing to bake a cake for a gay marriage..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/07...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/06...s-beliefs.html

I wonder what would've happened if the baker had been muslim (would they still have sued? how would the baker have reacted?)

[Annoyed]

[Serious mode]
Have you considered looking into your diet on a very aggressive level dude?
PM me if you want to, cause I know a few people who have had diabetes and have managed to control it via diet without drugs.
[/Serious Mode]

Once every few hours isn't all that bad. That is normal. I used to have issues with going every ten minutes for several hours--that is NOT normal. Problem seemed to get corrected or healed when I began taking nutritional supplements (powder mix to add to juice or milk, which makes it more like a thickened shake drink), which fixed the leaky bladder issue within the first week. Never thought I'd ever see the day I didn't have "to go" for 3 hours. *whew!*



I think that depends on which type of diabetes a person has, also. My hubby is type 2 and could reverse his problem if he put an effort into it, but he doesn't want to. My mom was type 1 and totally insulin dependent--so it wasn't as easy for her to reverse her situation. She was on so many meds that the meds were conflicting with her food diet and causing other problems. I was border line hypoglycemia, and managed to reverse that enough that I'm almost within what is considered *normal* ranges for blood sugar levels, etc.

When I began taking a nutritional powder supplement (mostly soy), and figured out which vitamins I *actually* needed that had to be taken individually, and not the amounts given in a multi-vitamin tablet, then my body started re-adjusting and healing to the new stuff my body wasn't previously getting. No meds, just supplement. There are still some issues, like skin rashes, but not sure if the supplement is causing that or some vitamin deficiency somewhere. Now the doctors are looking at both my vitamin lists (which I have to take certain B vitamins separate from a multi, and without A, because I get enough A, B1 and B2 already in my food diet) and seeing if there are any additional steps needed to be taken (like reduction or increase of something, such as vitamin B12).

Thank you for your suggestions, been over all this with my Doctors.
They have me on a drug which, while it is quite good at helping keeping BS levels good, increases the frequency of urination. That's how it works.

If I gotta go often, I guess that's a fair price for staying alive. 100 years ago, this would have likely killed me by now.

And put the time machine down, PH.

[Falcon Horus]

I wonder what would've happened if the baker had been muslim (would they still have sued? how would the baker have reacted?)

One educated guess later -- they wouldn't have walked into that bakery, unless they advertized cake-making.

Funny thought here, the biggest supporter I had so far and a little too eager to find me a girlfriend (and invited herself to my future wedding (if that ever happens) already) is a muslim friend of mine.

[Coco Pops]

You obviously have not paid attention to the news.. Here is just 3 links to reports on bakeries/cake shops sued for not willing to bake a cake for a gay marriage..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/07...ding-cake.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/06...s-beliefs.html

OK I was not aware of those. I hadn't seen those stories...... Wow just wow.

You can't set aside your personal worldview to do business and make money. Just wow. Some people.

I'm rather surprised it has actually happened.