Unending (1020)

[Mesenet]

I guess I shouldn't have been surprised, but I thought they would do better when airing the final episode. Silly me, I guess I know better now.

I think we all hang on to that thread of hope. (I don't know how tho. After two years it shouldn't exist anymore.)

[acdj31]

Here is my two cents.

That was the finale? Ugh.

It was a decent episode in its own right, but as a season finale, it was bad, and as a series finale it was rubbish. They used a stand alone episode to end the show on. Yuck.

I agree it wasn't a great series finale but it was okay. Better than "Enterprise" or even the "Sopranos" finale.

{Stargate/Sopranos ending (Spoilers)

Scene:
Teal'c is standing there holding the crystal in the shield surrounding him.
Cut to the outside of the ship where we see the beam hit
the ship.
Then cut to black.}

The ep did have it good moments especially at the end when they all walk up the ramp.

All Good Things Must Come To An End.
It has been a great 10 years. Thank you to everyone: the cast, the crew and even to the other fans I have meet a long the way. LONG LIVE SG-1!!!!

[Mav]

Definite mixed feelings about the episode.

On one hand, it was cool to see the Asgard one last time, especially handing over all their knowledge and technology. I geeked out when Thor called the Tauri the 5th Race one last time, ah memories of season 2 there. I really loved Thor.

At the same time it seemed like the Asgard were giving up. I'm sure they didn't want to start dying in pain and anguish but certainly it wasn't going to start like, the next day. They could have continued working on a solution. Asked for help, etc

Now, I'll be honest, I haven't read the thread past page one, so many pages etc. So I'm not sure if this has been brought up but, the Asgard upgrades are a plothole in my opinion. Back in Season 9, the Asgard sent a single ship along with the Tauri, Jaffa Nation, and the Lucian Alliance to combat the oncoming Ori ships. IIRC the Asgard ship wasn't really a match, it didn't destroy an Ori ship nearly as easily as they did in this episode (which isn't even a Asgard ship simply a Tauri ship upgraded). Sure, they could have advanced their weapons a lot, in a year or so but still, they go from not having any effect on the Ori shields to completely destroying their ships, within a year?

The rest of the episode was, iffy. Sam's smart, I don't think it would have taken her all those years to figure out how to turn back time. I think they just used that as a gimmick to both get in the romance of Jackson and Vala, and make Teal'C older.

I really disliked how the episode basically started with some great action we've come to expect, to 40 minutes of them just living their lives on a ship.

I really disliked how it was so blatantly obvious, even to non Internet fans who know of the upcoming direct-to-dvd movies, that the ending was so..open ended. Obviously the Ori aren't defeated, the Replicators are still out there as a looming threat on both galaxies, what to do with the Asgard knowledge, etc

If anything the "last" episode was more of a tease than anything. It was nice and all, it wasn't what I'd call "bad" but they should offer more than a "subtle cliffhanger" ending.

It was a good show, a great show. Sad to see the head suits cancel it "while it's on top" in some vain attempt to secure the longest running show, which ironically doesn't go to them. Sure, the America record does since they beat X-Files by a full season but globally, Doctor Who is in it's 29th season, plus the movie plus the tv specials ;p (I'm American, not touting the horn for the UK, just saying going out for those reasons aint great).

Haven't decided if I'll check out the SG-1 movies, maybe if they air them on SciFi sure but as much as I love SG-1 I can't see shelling out $18-30 (depending upon which store) for a 2 hour dvd movie just ain't feasible for me, financially (the season dvd's are, since for the price of like two maybe three movies, you're getting over 20 hours of content, episodes plus extras)

I'll keep watching Atlantis. Tek ma tek, SG-1

[P-90_177]

At the same time it seemed like the Asgard were giving up. I'm sure they didn't want to start dying in pain and anguish but certainly it wasn't going to start like, the next day. They could have continued working on a solution. Asked for help, etc

True but for all we know they were already dieing in pain and anguish and they do strike me as a very proud race.

[morjana]

That was...interesting.

I did like that the series ended with SG1 going through the Stargate on another mission.

As to the episode...

I'm not going to mince words...That whole Daniel/Vala scene was so terrible; I was quite miffed when Vala didn't ***** slap Daniel into the next galaxy/century/made-for-tv-movie-on-sci-fi-channel!

Yeah, yeah, I DO get the whole Daniel-really-loved-Vala and was hurt that (he thought) Vala was having fun at his expense...

However...if you really DID love someone...would YOU really say what Daniel said to Vala -- and with so much animosity, hate, venom and ridicule?

This is the Daniel who fell in love with Linea/Ke'ra and defended her against Jack.

This is the Daniel who fought so valiantly to keep Reese alive and raged against Jack when Jack killed Reese.

This is the Daniel who so tenderly assisted Apophis' host as he died in "Serpent's Venom." Daniel even provided the funerary statue so that the funerary statue would take the host's last breath and carry his soul back to Egypt.

This is the Daniel that comforted Shyla at the end of "Needs," even after what Shyla did to Daniel and the rest of SG-1.

This is the Daniel who thought of a way of saving the alien race in "A Message in a Bottle," even though they had mortally wounded Jack and were in the process of destroying Earth.

This is the Daniel who loved Sha're so much that he accepted the responsibility for her child with Apophis, tried to protect him, and still speaks fondly of him.

This is the Daniel who forgave Teal'c for selecting Sha're as a host candidate for Amaunet. And forgave Teal'c for killing Sha're to save Daniel's own life.

No...that scene was very un-Daniel.


And why were ONLY Daniel and Vala allowed a romance during this episode?

Why couldn't there have been a hint that Sam found some solace with Cam and/or Teal'c?

And apparently no one on the Odyssey remembered that Teal'c was ALREADY at least 60 years older than them when the episode BEGAN!

Teal's said he was 102 in season four's "The Light" -- and that was six years ago, so he was at least 108.

Add the 50/60 years they spent in the time dilation field, Teal'c is NOW at least 158 years old.

And Teal'c IS now older than Bra'tac - Bra'tac was 137 years old in season five's "Threshold," so Bra'tac is now 142.

We've known the Asgard had health problems since season five's "Revelations," but still, that was a shocking way for the Asgard to go as a race. I understand their concern that their technological advancements were at peril of being plundered (as the Goa'uld plundered the technology the Ancients left behind when they ascended), so that does assuage some of the loss.

I loved Joel Goldsmith's music -- especially the cello piece -- for this episode.

I loved the whole bit in the gateroom at the end of the episode. The "beggars can't be choosers" exchange reminded me of the "don't run with scissors" exchange from "Urgo."

Thank you Stargate SG-1 for a wonderful ten years of entertainment and some very warm, fuzzy, happy, loving memories of a team of friends exploring the galaxy/universe (and themselves).

Morjana

[any_gopher]

THat would have made for great symbology

Ever seen The Boondock Saints? Heh heh.

[Aquarian Paladin]

As was argued elsewhere, maybe they had no desire to live life in a machine.. I mean wouldyou want that 'life'??

That is the life they live now. They are not living organisms. The only difference between an organic machine and a synthetic machine is that the latter is made of better materials. They don't have sex, they eat "astronaut food" for nutrition and not pleasure, they aren't emotional, and they don't enjoy physical activity. I think all they do is invent or improve stuff all day anyway. And with their new weapons they could have improved their own fleet and saved the galaxy before they ascended(hint:not self-suicide). That episode made absolutely no sense whatsoever, mostly do to the fact that it was rushed and hence awkward.

I agree with the series ending should have been a full on two hour episode... And i would have loved to see some cameos, from all our friends we have made.. Even if only in remenicing moments from the team..

Earth should have been attacked, a real human fleet(not just a 3 or 4) should have been revealed, the Ori should have been defeated with Asgard support(not completely, just the attack on Earth), and the world would finally know about the Stargate program. Then the Asgard could announce they are going to ascend, but not disappear right then and there. Earth could get some upgrades, the future could look bright, and it ends on a good note. I could have even fit the whole 50 years concept into the space fight, only it would have been 3-5 years and everyone would have remembered it.

SG-1 did not go out with a bang. That was a very anti-climactic episode that was sub average even for a regular episode. They could have just ended it with the episode "Bad Guys" which was a better episode in my opinion and just as "pointless"; Or "Dominion", but drawn it out into a 2 part episode. The new Asgard weapons could have just waited til the movie.

[SGalisa]

That was...interesting.

I did like that the series ended with SG1 going through the Stargate on another mission.

yes, that *was* indeed a very nice gesture - and hopeful of what's yet to come

I'm not going to mince words...That whole Daniel/Vala scene was so terrible; I was quite miffed when Vala didn't ***** slap Daniel into the next galaxy/century/made-for-tv-movie-on-sci-fi-channel!

Yeah, yeah, I DO get the whole Daniel-really-loved-Vala and was hurt that (he thought) Vala was having fun at his expense...

However...if you really DID love someone...would YOU really say what Daniel said to Vala -- and with so much animosity, hate, venom and ridicule?

This is the Daniel who fell in love with Linea/Ke'ra and defended her against Jack.

This is the Daniel who fought so valiantly to keep Reese alive and raged against Jack when Jack killed Reese.

This is the Daniel who so tenderly assisted Apophis' host as he died in "Serpent's Venom." Daniel even provided the funerary statue so that the funerary statue would take the host's last breath and carry his soul back to Egypt.

This is the Daniel that comforted Shyla at the end of "Needs," even after what Shyla did to Daniel and the rest of SG-1.

This is the Daniel who thought of a way of saving the alien race in "A Message in a Bottle," even though they had mortally wounded Jack and were in the process of destroying Earth.

This is the Daniel who loved Sha're so much that he accepted the responsibility for her child with Apophis, tried to protect him, and still speaks fondly of him.

This is the Daniel who forgave Teal'c for selecting Sha're as a host candidate for Amaunet. And forgave Teal'c for killing Sha're to save Daniel's own life.

No...that scene was very un-Daniel.

I can understand how many people would pick out certain segments and believe that it was not in Daniel's personality to have an outburst like he did, but I disagree - for the very reason that I have that type of personality. I know how easy it is to keep on forgiving umpteen zillions of times to people who you are close to and get hurt by.

However, Vala is probably the only person on that entire list who took advantage of practically everyone nearly every day she could and as often as possible, even tho (I think) she totally believed in her heart that *she* was doing the right thing or simply covering her tracks from her past one more time... Everyone else did evil things to Daniel, but their goals were usually single-minded and the same one every time. Vala tried multiple tricks. She's like a prankster child who manipulates mom and dad and everyone else around them, with every antic to see what they can get away with, and how many times will the border fence be enforced. That's how I see Vala's personality. She's an imp nearly from birth!

All the time thruout those earlier season 9 moments, Daniel gave in to Vala's schemes either by overriding command by the SGC, or from his own gullible nature; and now Daniel was stuck with her playing with his emotions, because she was bored, stranded, and tried pulling on his heart for that ultimate fling she's so desired from the beginning.

How would anyone in real life feel after going thru all that? I'd be miffed at feeling abused and used.. and there's a point where I hide my anger until it just boils over at probably the wrong person - my hubby - who I'll blurt out some hurting remark after so long of holding things in... yet to someone I'm working with, I let a certain situation go on for months and months and never said a word, and when I realized I needed to scream at this other person, I simply couldn't do it.

(maybe it's different when your attached to someone by more permanent relationship means than just a professional POV - which either side can always walk away from at any moment, and the feelings might be mutual.. but never become as close ever again. However, here - there was a long-term situation that neither of them could escape from, so it was going to go one way or the other. Daniel probably realized he ultimately had nothing else to lose at this point, and basically chose to lay everything out on the table so to speak, up front and personal, and get it *finally* out of his system, or he would have gone nutso.)

Most of the other characters Daniel interacted with, sure they spent time with him, and had their own evil sides with single purposed goals. Anyone remember Hathor? and how *Used* Daniel felt with Hathor? I mean, we're talking Daniel's DNA populating the universe there on a grand scale... Linea/Ke'ra got into Daniel's heart as did Shyla, but neither of them got under his emotional skin as much as Vala - and right from the get-go. Maybe it's different when you meet someone giving you bad vibes from the beginning, as opposed to someone who gradually deceives you. I know it is that way with me. Vala would be someone I'd most likely avoid - at all costs, whenever possible, and that's including during professional working moments!

anywho.. about Vala and Daniel? She was a *trip* to behold from the word GO (as I just mentioned about the type of personality type I personally prefer avoiding in real life). And Vala just kept hammering specifically teasing Daniel - and even said upon occasion that Daniel liked it, or let her do it... and Daniel just suddenly shut his mouth from saying something nastier in those moments - but probably from a lack of not knowing what to say to get her to actually shut up, so he'd win an argument.

anyway, Vala just kept hammering to push and prod and drive poor Daniel insane, probably because she knew she could ("get his goat"). She knew he was gullible to certain degrees, and as with any persistent con-artist, she took advantage of it beyond the norm of a normal (non-con-artist type of) person (but someone who likes to tease in general, yet knows when to stop). Now and then he'd spit back tidbits of his anger, but nothing like the fuse that's been building up within during that moment when she broke down in tears. He didn't see her tears at first - so he just kept on harping and harping and harping out his anger.

Then, when he finally realized she was crying, his compassionate side kicked in and - well, that's how it often happens in the movies. I was expecting it. But then again, maybe it was Daniel's indecisive (switching emotions from side to side now and then, and hating himself later if he made the wrong decision for it) personality. Some people consider that personality as a *paradox* because it changes when you least expect it (and because it's rarely understood in the usually slow to boiling anger, highly tolerant -to a certain point- mood types). At least with Vala, we knew from the start that she had a con-artist personality, so it'd carry her thruout most of the eps, until she toned it down - but mostly so she'd get her own way eventually anyway.

Vala wanted Daniel bad enough - in especially this particular moment, tho, that she let him rant on (because she knew she well deserved that scolding), but it still stung and hurt her deeply.

When she was able to get over her guilty conscience, she gave in to Daniel's compassion. Similar to the moment she felt after the Ori

Spoiler:

burned her to death and brought her back, etc.

I saw Daniel's compassion kicking in for almost the same reason after everything Vala put him thru prior in both of those scenarios.


and that's probably also why I've admired Daniel over these many years... because his personality is too much like mine, except he's got more scholarly IQ brains of knowledge and wisdom than I'll ever have.

[majorsal]

And why wasn't O'Neill on that last trip, there is no way Landry should have been there. A romance between O'Neill and Carter would have been much more satisfying and relevant than the fling Vala and Daniel had.

this is what i felt when i read your sentence!


carry on.





sally

[majorsal]

Is anyone else bothered by this??? What happened with Jack and Sam? No closure???

yes, i know.

i'm hoping, though, that it'll be handled in one of the upcoming movies!




sally

[beccabob593]

i agree about the jack and sam thing i always enjoy their romatic scenes

[Maxum]

First of all, Daniel's rant at Vala seem way out of character to me. I can't help but wonder if Mallozzi and Mullie wrote it, it would have been different. So I blame Cooper for that. Vala deserved an apology for what he said to her. Perhaps he did give her one. We never saw much of them as a couple. I'm glad they had fifty years together, but since no one remembered, I felt it was a slap in the face for us D/V shippers. When Daniel said "silence is golden," he might as well have been saying shut the hell up to her yet again. If they had remembered, I would have felt better about it. They only good part was their time on the ship leaves us with infinite possibilities for missing scenes.

Other than that, I was alright I guess. *shrugs*

I thought Daniel's reaction to Vala was perfectly justified and plausible. When I look at how Vala has treated Daniel in the two+ years she's known him, she has consistently treated him badly. She makes incessant sexual references to him, she deliberately tries to embarass him in front of his peers and colleagues. It was a constant game for Vala.

The big clincher is when Vala had sneaked into Daniel's room and got into his bed, Daniel chose that moment to let her know that he knew it was all just a game and that she didn't really care about him. Vala could have made Daniel realize that she DID have feelings for him, but instead, she made Daniel think she was playing him. She lays a sob story on him, which may or may not have been true, but Daniel had a sincere reaction to her story and went to apologize to her and console her, only to find out that it was just another game. For Daniel, that was the final straw in terms of trusting her again.

In Unending, once again Vala comes to Daniel's room, and she IS bored. She immediately goes for Daniel's pants (so much for being subtle), and Daniel QUIETLY tells her not to do that. He doesn't scream at her or yell at her. He knows (or thinks) it's another game, and he quietly pushes her away, and you can see the hurt on his face. It's not a game to Daniel. She, of course, has to ask if he "likes girls," which irks Daniel because once again, it's another slam against him. At this point, he's had enough, and he lets her have it with both barrels. She deserved it. Was it cruel? Yes, but Daniel wasn't the one playing the games for two years. Daniel wasn't the one making constant sexual inuendos and snide remarks. Like Daniel said to her, "You're doing all of this at my expense." That's how Daniel felt because THAT'S how Vala has made him feel.

It was only after he saw genuine tears and remorse on her face that he thought maybe he was wrong. If you notice, however, he still had his doubts about whether she truly cared for him. "You better not be playing me." Daniel doesn't play games. He doesn't jump into bed with women while notching his bed post. He takes relationships very seriously. Vala doesn't - or at least she didn't before Daniel.

I thought the scene was really well done, and I thought Daniel was 100% justified in his actions towards Vala. I don't think he was too cruel to her at all. She's the one who set the tone of this relationship. Daniel called her on it.

Also, Michael and Claudia were fantastic in that scene. Michael did a great job, imo, with being angry and emotional but not being too over the top. He played that scene perfectly, and Claudia was wonderful. The expression on her face in that final moment when Daniel realizes that she does like him and she's trying to hide her face from him. Perfect.

I loved the whole scene. Very well done.

[majorsal]

My only regret is we never saw Sam acknowlege Jack in any way. I would have liked to have seen her looking at picture of him in a longing way. At least he would have been acknowledged in the last episode.

i actually looked to see if sam was wearing a ring... maybe the movies?




sally

[prion]

First of all, Daniel's rant at Vala seem way out of character to me. I can't help but wonder if Mallozzi and Mullie wrote it, it would have been different. So I blame Cooper for that. Vala deserved an apology for what he said to her. Perhaps he did give her one. We never saw much of them as a couple. I'm glad they had fifty years together, but since no one remembered, I felt it was a slap in the face for us D/V shippers. When Daniel said "silence is golden," he might as well have been saying shut the hell up to her yet again. If they had remembered, I would have felt better about it. They only good part was their time on the ship leaves us with infinite possibilities for missing scenes.
Other than that, I was alright I guess. *shrugs*

Actually, it's not at all unexpected. it's stress. They've been stuck on the ship with nothing to do for three MONTHS. Vala has always displayed manipulative behavior in the past so why should Daniel expect otherwise, so he just snapped. It is a cheat that all they went through didn't exist (like an alternate universe story) which is why I thought Unending was okay, good but certainly not great.

i actually looked to see if sam was wearing a ring... maybe the movies?
sally

NOt until they want to end the series. And Jack quits.

[nccjones]

i actually looked to see if sam was wearing a ring... maybe the movies?




sally

Or, if she was looking at a picture....a wedding picture perhaps? That would have definately answered a lot of questions.