S10: Critique & Contemplation

[Silverwings]

Yup. There was a level of continuity and believability while RDA and MG were exec producing. Then it all flew out the window when they left. Was saddening.

I suspect there are good reasons why RDA alone was given an honorary award from the Air Force, not anyone else on the show's roster.

edited to add: Dur, that's from page 875 with my settings... and this is 883. Never mind the "late to the party" guy.

[suse]

I suspect there are good reasons why RDA alone was given an honorary award from the Air Force, not anyone else on the show's roster.

edited to add: Dur, that's from page 875 with my settings... and this is 883. Never mind the "late to the party" guy.

Still appropriate though.

Cheers!

suse

[jckfan55]

With Entity...

From what I remember from the episode, it saw Sam talking with Hammond and Jack in the control room, read her file, saw that she was their technical expert and perhaps reasoned that she was the most likely person on base to stop it. Then it saw her use the keyboard and realized that was how it could jump into her.

that is my take as well. I think the entity said something like "this one is important." We saw Hammond putting her on the job etc--clearly the "go to" person. Now if the shippers want to see "important" as important to Jack, well go for it...

you ever hear of Wernher Von Braun? the so-called "father of the us space program" was a Nazi who used Jews as slave labor in his work for the Nazis. He and other rocket scientists from germany were brought to the us and even given citizenship because of what they knew....who cared about the Nazi ties,

Perhaps. But would she be put on Earth's flagship team, as an equal unsupervised member? I beg to differ.

Yes. The SGC is an idealized military.

[Rac80]

I think what most of us are getting at is that Vala was a big risk with negligible gains, whereas Von Braun was a huge risk and we got far more than we could have ever imagined. The end didn't justify the means where she was concerned because many of us felt that in the grand scheme of things she contributed almost nothing of value to the program.

It's like comparing apples to oranges.

As for Japanese war criminals, weren't many of them prosecuted/hung? I have a very limited scope of knowledge regarding WWII, but wasn't there a big kerfluffle a few years ago about the USA trying to justify using water-boarding at Gitmo when we had tried and convicted many Japanese for doing it during WWII? Though, it is true that a few Japanese war criminals were absorbed into the biochemical warfare type reasearch in America and they were likely viewed in the same way as Von Braun, but again, I'm sure what they contributed was of far greater value than anything we got out of Vala. (Seriously, putting "biochemical warfare" and "greater value" in the same sentence kind of hurts. )

Forgive my lack of knowledge...it's been a while since I took a history course...which is in no way a valid excuse for not knowing my own history...

EDIT: Hung? Shot? I have no idea how criminal execution was handled then...

so you have no problem with dealing with Nazis and the like if we got enough info from them..... sorry I do! Vala is a much less ethically & morally dangerous proposition for me. But then it still is merely IMHO.

[Ashizuri]

so you have no problem with dealing with Nazis and the like if we got enough info from them..... sorry I do! Vala is a much less ethically & morally dangerous proposition for me. But then it still is merely IMHO.

I obviously have problems with war criminals and nazis, I'm just saying that if you want to use "the ends justifies the means" approach to why Vala was brought on board it doesn't work for me because Vala was morally and ethically dangerous and brought nothing of worth or value to the table, whereas Van Braun and my random example of the Japanese scientists brought in after WWII were morally and ethically challenged and they changed the world.

Does that absolve them of their past crimes? No, but it would certainly be the ends justifying the means.

-Ashizuri...who is not a Nazi sympathizer

[jasminaGo]

so you have no problem with dealing with Nazis and the like if we got enough info from them..... sorry I do! Vala is a much less ethically & morally dangerous proposition for me. But then it still is merely IMHO.

Vala kept an entire planet of people as slaves, she lied, stole, put people's lives in danger... for nothing more then personal gain. Her sense of moral is breathtaking. It actually brought a tear to my eye. The left one.

If you wanna go there.... She was in no way better then any Nazi, Japanese or whoever war or non-war criminal. They deserved to pay for their crimes (I agree with you on that), but so did she.

[RealmOfX]

so you have no problem with dealing with Nazis and the like if we got enough info from them..... sorry I do! Vala is a much less ethically & morally dangerous proposition for me. But then it still is merely IMHO.

You're getting away from the point. You tried to make comparisons between the situations with Vala and war criminals and seem to be ignoring those comparisons as in Vala had nothing of use to warrant her inclusion in any military effort. All she brought to the table was trouble in spades plus some not so useful information - none of which warrants her being put on the top team.

[Ashizuri]

Vala kept an entire planet of people as slaves, she lied, stole, put people's lives in danger... for nothing more then personal gain. Her sense of moral is breathtaking. It actually brought a tear to my eye. The left one.

If you wanna go there.... She was in no way better then any Nazi, Japanese or whoever war or non-war criminal. They deserved to pay for their crimes (I agree with you on that), but so did she.

I kind of wanted to point that out.

Vala was one woman, so she was no where near the threat the nazis were, but have her leading an army that had been indoctrinated into her season 8/9 morals/ethics/beliefs the way the nazis were with Hitler and I'd imagine she'd be considered just as horrible.

Though I think she'd have made for a better villian than the Ori...

[jckfan55]

Though I think she'd have made for a better villian than the Ori...

I think if they used her that way, in recurring role, I could have lived with her. On SG1, no.

[slurredspeech]

Vala kept an entire planet of people as slaves, she lied, stole, put people's lives in danger... for nothing more then personal gain. Her sense of moral is breathtaking. It actually brought a tear to my eye. The left one.

If you wanna go there.... She was in no way better then any Nazi, Japanese or whoever war or non-war criminal. They deserved to pay for their crimes (I agree with you on that), but so did she.

Perkiness can get you a long way, don't you know.

[Ashizuri]

Perkiness can get you a long way, don't you know.

Being very attractive also works wonders, and CB is exceptionally lovely.

[EvenstarSRV]

I think if they used her that way, in recurring role, I could have lived with her. On SG1, no.

Watching CB's chilling turn as Qe'tesh in Continuum made me wonder how season 9 and 10 would have played out if she'd become the major enemy instead of the Ori.

Instead of introducing the Ori in Avalon/Origin, you could have had the SGC discovering that Qe'tesh, maybe with Ba'al, were filling in the power vacuum left after Anubis was defeated. The Lucian Alliance could be a bigger player, with some factions siding with Goa'uld and others maybe wanted to resist them, and the Jaffa Nation could also get involved in fighting Qe'tesh and Ba'al's forces. No Sangraals or Arks or evil super babies, just good old Tau'ri verses Goa'uld battles at which Stargate has always excelled.

But then I much prefer the Goa'uld as an enemy to the Ori, they had an insidiousness to them that I felt the Ori lacked. The Goa'uld could be unpredictable, especially ones like Ba'al, while the Ori seemed to just be 'convert or die'.

[suse]

but that would destroy the New, Fresh, Different that they were going for. And it would make - if possible - even less sense for the gate virgin to lead an experienced team.

suse

[slurredspeech]

Being very attractive also works wonders, and CB is exceptionally lovely.

She's not my type (ooooh, I have a type of women now? who knew) but objectively, she's quite good looking, though in her case I think it's how she carries herself (which is SO far superior to just looks).

And voice, apparently? Well, my bf has a thing for her voice. *shrug*

Instead of introducing the Ori in Avalon/Origin, you could have had the SGC discovering that Qe'tesh, maybe with Ba'al, were filling in the power vacuum left after Anubis was defeated. The Lucian Alliance could be a bigger player, with some factions siding with Goa'uld and others maybe wanted to resist them, and the Jaffa Nation could also get involved in fighting Qe'tesh and Ba'al's forces. No Sangraals or Arks or evil super babies, just good old Tau'ri verses Goa'uld battles at which Stargate has always excelled.

This. Yes.

Personally, I wouldn't have minded the new enemy if they hadn't completely severed the ties to all the threats we've come to know, and, of course, if they'd given them layers. Ah, layers. Remember those? (Earlier seasons) Jack's especially used to keep me so warm.

[slurredspeech]

but that would destroy the New, Fresh, Different that they were going for. And it would make - if possible - even less sense for the gate virgin to lead an experienced team.

But with the New Enemy, he got there, took one look, snorted and, after little action in which he prevailed, went home and wrote Ori: The Manual and Seven E-Z Steps to Defeating the Ori (If You're Cameron Mitchell). Both were bestsellers.

And on the seventh day he rested.