Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread

[sclairef99]

The original 90 minutes was shown only once on SCIFI. I believe it's air date was Friday,Feb 13, a day before Valentines Day. TBTP said it was the shipper's Valentine gift

LOL, I didn't remember that and I hadn't seen that quote from TPTB. That's kinda cool. I remember watching Threads live as it played in it's 90 minute version and LOVING the ep as a shipper. I was so disappointed that when the DVD's came out they put the edited version in and that you had to actually had to write to get your real version of the ep.

I really do like the conference room scene, it's perfect for each of the characters. I so felt for Sam in that situation. I can't tell you how many times I was in a situation where I've kept getting called by a significant other while trying to do something and Sam's reactions were so dead on correct. And to add to her discomfort, the man that she really loves having to witness all of the bother and then her Dad stepping into the middle of her discomfort to add more pressure w/the flowers discussion. It was a really well written and acted scene.

I always get a little squee inside when I see that Threads is ready to play on my DVR, but then it goes away when I realize that it's the hour version. I don't waste my time watching the hour version. After seeing the 90 min version you just can't even compare....

Anyway...I've got to go catch up w/the rest of the discussion before I ramble on anymore....
s

[Aveo_amacus]

on the threads timing issue, it's original air in the UK on skyone was the full 90 minutes, don't know about repeats because we don't get skyone anymore..

on Sam's wedding, I'm sure she'd have called it off. She'd already gone to Jack's, sat in his drive way, had the meeting with Jacob, had doubts in general.
I think if Jacob hadn't died, he'd have said something. I mean you can tell by the end of the first meeting with Pete, he doesn't like him. He was pushing her in the conference room scene, he was just trying to get her to do it her way first before he stepped in. Personally I think if he hadn't stepped in during the infirmary scene there would have been another occasion. He knows about her feelings for Jack, and her doubts about the wedding.

[Devilish Me]

Thoughts on Threads and whether or not Sam would have called off the wedding:

I honestly am not sure if Sam would have called off the wedding or not. I know she was having doubts, but I get the feeling that maybe she had doubts about even getting engaged and yet she did. Jack got together with Kerry, I think, to move forward without Sam (because Sam was moving forward without him). The big factor is what caused Kerry to break up with Jack? She knew he had feelings for Sam, did she get that from a half a second look in the backyard? That would make her a shipper and since she was dating one half of the ship I don't think she would have noticed the subtleties. There's some scene we never see that explains it... or scenes. Maybe a picture? Maybe too many Sam related remarks?

Anyway, I think after seeing Kerry, if her father hadn't died, part of me wonders if she would have tried to push forward with Pete. She pushed forward with the relationship. She pushed forward with the engagement (remember, it took her two weeks and she quizzed Jack on "us")... why not the wedding too?

I'm not saying she would have for sure, but I think the possibility is there.

Hmm... you've got me thinking (and that's bad! ).

I would think that she would've canceled the wedding because of her doubts.

I think that she needed Jack to tell her that there's hope for them.

Yes, she had doubts about getting engaged, but she did ask Jack about them, and that cryptic answer... it just wasn't enough. She wanted a family, but you see she has doubts about it the way she rambles, and it's not that she's having doubts about having it but more about having it with Pete, I think that's the question that's also understood when she asks Jack 'and what about you (or was it us?). She wants to know do they have a future together.

We see from Grace that she is ready to quit the Air Force, he is willing to do it for them!
Of course, Jack doesn't know that (of course he would never ask her to, but he doesn't know that he means to her more than her work), and the answer he gives her in Affinity can be interpreted in so many ways. The lack of 'moments' between them is imho the result of their misunderstanding.
Regardless of the D&C ep, there wasn't any major confessions or grand gestures. I mean there was that 'stuck on a moon' but jack heard about that only in Grace. And even then I don't think he accepted it in the light 'she loves me as much as I love her,' but more like 'she would've done that for anyone,' or 'that was a long time ago.'

As much as they can share a look and know what the other is thinking, they're basically inept in conversations. And that sort of a thing can't be conveyed just with eyes.

Anyway... what was the topic? ... oh...

Imo, she had her answer in the observation room. Even though she knew now that Jack was with Kerry, when he said "Always," I think everything clicked for her. And that she would've canceled even if Jacob has miraculously gotten better.

And even if the whole conversation didn't happen, I'd like to think she'd do it simply because she realized (and she did realize) that she doesn't love Pete enough to marry him.

Am I rambling or what?

[Nynaeve506]

Hmm... you've got me thinking (and that's bad! ).

I would think that she would've canceled the wedding because of her doubts.

I think that she needed Jack to tell her that there's hope for them.

Yes, she had doubts about getting engaged, but she did ask Jack about them, and that cryptic answer... it just wasn't enough. She wanted a family, but you see she has doubts about it the way she rambles, and it's not that she's having doubts about having it but more about having it with Pete, I think that's the question that's also understood when she asks Jack 'and what about you (or was it us?). She wants to know do they have a future together.

We see from Grace that she is ready to quit the Air Force, he is willing to do it for them!
Of course, Jack doesn't know that (of course he would never ask her to, but he doesn't know that he means to her more than her work), and the answer he gives her in Affinity can be interpreted in so many ways. The lack of 'moments' between them is imho the result of their misunderstanding.
Regardless of the D&C ep, there wasn't any major confessions or grand gestures. I mean there was that 'stuck on a moon' but jack heard about that only in Grace. And even then I don't think he accepted it in the light 'she loves me as much as I love her,' but more like 'she would've done that for anyone,' or 'that was a long time ago.'

As much as they can share a look and know what the other is thinking, they're basically inept in conversations. And that sort of a thing can't be conveyed just with eyes.

Anyway... what was the topic? ... oh...

Imo, she had her answer in the observation room. Even though she knew now that Jack was with Kerry, when he said "Always," I think everything clicked for her. And that she would've canceled even if Jacob has miraculously gotten better.

And even if the whole conversation didn't happen, I'd like to think she'd do it simply because she realized (and she did realize) that she doesn't love Pete enough to marry him.

Am I rambling or what?

I definitely think the observation room gave her the answer. I guess I'm thinking that if that didn't happen (Jacob wasn't dying), then maybe she wouldn't have called off the wedding. She would have shown up at Jack's, left embarrassed because of Kerry (no phone call), and gone back to dear old Dad who probably wouldn't recommend her going off with her CO (death has a funny way of pushing people to encourage things they may not do so otherwise). Maybe he would have kept quiet. So then, I think Jack and Kerry would have broken up since their break up is independent of the whole Jacob storyline... but would Sam have called off the wedding? THAT is the 64 million dollar question... I'm not saying for sure she wouldn't have. I'm just saying that it's possible she wouldn't have....

[Devilish Me]

I definitely think the observation room gave her the answer. I guess I'm thinking that if that didn't happen (Jacob wasn't dying), then maybe she wouldn't have called off the wedding. She would have shown up at Jack's, left embarrassed because of Kerry (no phone call), and gone back to dear old Dad who probably wouldn't recommend her going off with her CO (death has a funny way of pushing people to encourage things they may not do so otherwise). Maybe he would have kept quiet. So then, I think Jack and Kerry would have broken up since their break up is independent of the whole Jacob storyline... but would Sam have called off the wedding? THAT is the 64 million dollar question... I'm not saying for sure she wouldn't have. I'm just saying that it's possible she wouldn't have....

I guess it is possible all that fork in the road stuff.

But in the words of Daniel,the defining event happened in both all realities, THE DEATH OF RA, which means... in the end, Sam and Jack must be together in all realities.

So, yes. She would've canceled the wedding.

Can I have my 64 million dollars now?

[JackandSamAddict]

I definitely think the observation room gave her the answer. I guess I'm thinking that if that didn't happen (Jacob wasn't dying), then maybe she wouldn't have called off the wedding. She would have shown up at Jack's, left embarrassed because of Kerry (no phone call), and gone back to dear old Dad who probably wouldn't recommend her going off with her CO (death has a funny way of pushing people to encourage things they may not do so otherwise). Maybe he would have kept quiet. So then, I think Jack and Kerry would have broken up since their break up is independent of the whole Jacob storyline... but would Sam have called off the wedding? THAT is the 64 million dollar question... I'm not saying for sure she wouldn't have. I'm just saying that it's possible she wouldn't have....

The fact that she went to Jack's (IMHO) is our answer. She wanted to tell him how she felt. I seriously doubt she would have ended up marrying another man when she was willing to tell the one she loved that she loved him. You can't be married to someone and in love with someone else. (I mean you can, but everyone involved is up for heartbreak in the future if you do).

Sam is a smart person. Although, not so smart in her love life; until that day in Threads when they were picking out flowers and cake flavors, and looking at a house that she had no say in whatsoever (it became too much, too real for her). I think she wised up in those moments. I think she was ready to take reigns in her personal life and not just settle with the first guy who comes along.

So that is why she went to Jack's house that day. To finally take control over the one thing she had had no control over whatsoever: her personal life. It shows that she had doubts about Pete. I think it was just a matter of time before she called off the wedding.

Also, speaking of Jacob...what father would let their 'little girl' marry someone that they knew in their heart of hearts that she didn't love? Maybe 'let' is the wrong word, but hopefully you all know what I mean. I mean to say that I don't think Jacob would have let things go unsaid between them. Even if he weren't dying.

What's the difference in him telling her that while on his death bed and him telling her that when he is alive and healthy? I mean sure, when you're dying you get to look back on your life and see things you might have done differently. But Jacob has never really had a difficult time in telling Sam what he thinks about her life (I'm thinking NASA here)...I don't know. Maybe I'm crazy. Hope this all made sense!

[gater62]

Hey Shippers

Good to see I'm not the only one who finds herself here on a Saturday night (of course, my husband is sitting next to me and we're watching football)...

I wish I had something profound to say about Sam/Jack, but I don't... so I'll shamelessly plug my latest fanfic I posted the other night

A Tangled Web

That's all I got.

I am loving this fic!!!!

[Sarai]

Just stopped back after a trip out to the local mini-zoo (don't ask ) and I just wanted to say a massive

GREEN

to absolutely everyone for todays discussion on Sam/Jack/Jacob/Kerry/P...P...Potato

*runs off to play with Gimp, yet again*

[Nynaeve506]

Sam is a smart person. Although, not so smart in her love life; until that day in Threads when they were picking out flowers and cake flavors, and looking at a house that she had no say in whatsoever (it became too much, too real for her). I think she wised up in those moments. I think she was ready to take reigns in her personal life and not just settle with the first guy who comes along.

So that is why she went to Jack's house that day. To finally take control over the one thing she had had no control over whatsoever: her personal life. It shows that she had doubts about Pete. I think it was just a matter of time before she called off the wedding.

Also, speaking of Jacob...what father would let their 'little girl' marry someone that they knew in their heart of hearts that she didn't love? Maybe 'let' is the wrong word, but hopefully you all know what I mean. I mean to say that I don't think Jacob would have let things go unsaid between them. Even if he weren't dying.

What's the difference in him telling her that while on his death bed and him telling her that when he is alive and healthy? I mean sure, when you're dying you get to look back on your life and see things you might have done differently. But Jacob has never really had a difficult time in telling Sam what he thinks about her life (I'm thinking NASA here)...I don't know. Maybe I'm crazy. Hope this all made sense!

I laughed at the bolded part because I totally agree - I guess it's true that one cannot be smart in all possible things LOL. But at least she came to her senses

I'm not opposed to the word "let" when it comes to talking about marriage. I totally talk about my dad "giving me away" at my wedding, despite having my college education and living on my own. I'm a daddy's girl through and through I think Sam would be that way too. Despite what she said in the first episode, I think Sam really turned out to be a... "classical" feminist (not sure if that's the right word) - you know equal pay for equal work, equal chances, the right to vote, the right to be respected and well-thought of - and believing in those things doesn't mean you have to disregard tradition either. You can see something beautiful in it - my dad didn't own me, but I respected him and he respected my husband and I think men have a protection instinct and in way it was like he was saying, I've cared for her, loved her, nurtured her, grown her, now she's walking to you, protect her, cherish her, love her. And I find nothing bad about that. After all, that's how community works - we watch out for each other to varying degrees depending on our closeness and... anyway, I don't if I'm making any sense, but I can see what you're getting at, I would like to think that Jacob wouldn't let his little girl marry a toad anyway.

[Nynaeve506]

I am loving this fic!!!!

Yay! I love when people enjoy my fanfic... even though for SG1 I as of yet only have two... but I'm working on another

[JackandSamAddict]

I laughed at the bolded part because I totally agree - I guess it's true that one cannot be smart in all possible things LOL. But at least she came to her senses

I'm not opposed to the word "let" when it comes to talking about marriage. I totally talk about my dad "giving me away" at my wedding, despite having my college education and living on my own. I'm a daddy's girl through and through I think Sam would be that way too. Despite what she said in the first episode, I think Sam really turned out to be a... "classical" feminist (not sure if that's the right word) - you know equal pay for equal work, equal chances, the right to vote, the right to be respected and well-thought of - and believing in those things doesn't mean you have to disregard tradition either. You can see something beautiful in it - my dad didn't own me, but I respected him and he respected my husband and I think men have a protection instinct and in way it was like he was saying, I've cared for her, loved her, nurtured her, grown her, now she's walking to you, protect her, cherish her, love her. And I find nothing bad about that. After all, that's how community works - we watch out for each other to varying degrees depending on our closeness and... anyway, I don't if I'm making any sense, but I can see what you're getting at, I would like to think that Jacob wouldn't let his little girl marry a toad anyway.

I totally agree! I love love talk! (I'm a daddy's girl too! Okay...so maybe a parents' girl) Parents always (well almost always) want what's best for their children. Even Jacob in is way he always wanted what was best for Sam (again I'm thinking of the NASA thing). He knew that Pete would never be the best thing...person for her. Jack would be the only man who could make her happy in her personal life...Jacob knew this, and thankfully he let her know before he died how he felt.

[Rachel500]

I definitely think the observation room gave her the answer. I guess I'm thinking that if that didn't happen (Jacob wasn't dying), then maybe she wouldn't have called off the wedding. She would have shown up at Jack's, left embarrassed because of Kerry (no phone call), and gone back to dear old Dad who probably wouldn't recommend her going off with her CO (death has a funny way of pushing people to encourage things they may not do so otherwise). Maybe he would have kept quiet. So then, I think Jack and Kerry would have broken up since their break up is independent of the whole Jacob storyline... but would Sam have called off the wedding? THAT is the 64 million dollar question... I'm not saying for sure she wouldn't have. I'm just saying that it's possible she wouldn't have....

Personally, I don't think the equation is as simple as Jacob dying = Sam/Jack together, or that Jacob not dying = Sam marrying Pete.

While I agree that Sam had pressed ahead with the engagement even with doubts, I believe she had felt she had resolved them by the time she said yes - primarily because her main doubt was really around whether there was a chance for her and Jack, and her belief after the disasterous conversation with him in Affinity that there wasn't.

I actually think Sam's true doubts about the wedding and marriage reappear when she meets RepliCarter and gets her own feelings for Jack pushed in her face by her double and told a few home truths that she was denying her real desires because she was scared and played by the rules.

From that moment on, for me, Sam is questioning her decision to marry Pete - and I think her doubts are the real reason why she's not keen for her father to meet Pete because she's scared her father's going to see the truth - that she's got doubts and isn't one hundred per cent happy to be marrying him - not really that her father will dislike him.

She's actively avoiding her wedding and while she pays lip service to Pete in telling him she wants to be involved, she so doesn't. She would much rather be doing anything than planning her wedding. When Pete faces her with the house, that for me is the moment of revelation for Sam that she can't do it; she can't marry him. The house - and the mention of the dog - is a major wake up call to her about the enormity of the mistake she's making.

For me, Sam had already decided that the relationship with Pete was effectively over at that point - which is why she goes to see Jack. Because she's realised why marrying Pete is a mistake; because she loves Jack more. And I think for once Sam decides that she needs to tell Jack that before she can rethink it or overanalyse it or question it; so she goes to tell him.

This is all before her father's collapse is known about.

So I do think even without Jacob's death, Sam had decided not to marry Pete. I think perhaps she might have requestioned her decision in light of Jack being with Kerry but ultimately I think she would have made the same decision not to marry Pete because she knew she still loved Jack more despite her attempts to move on with Pete, despite her agreement to marry another man, and to continue with the marriage would not have been honourable.

[SamJackShipper93]

Gee, why do you guys write so much when I'm not here?!? How RUDE!

Hehe, I can't stop watching that too short vid from Gatecon! *sigh* So nice!

Report from Gate Con Shippers:

On Tuesday, August 19, sugarshaker, LOL4JACK, SG1Poz and I, rented a car to sightsee in Vancouver. First stop, Jack's Cabin. We were thrilled to visit the Holy Grail so to speak of our favorite couple. After all when Jack persuaded Sam to come fishing in Threads episode, it marked the promise of a new chapter in the romance of Sam and Jack, a relationship.

Jack's Cabin is in a park. The cabin houses the park's caretaker and is not open to the public. We crossed over this bridge. An idyllic pathway to the Cabin...

spoiler tags for size

Spoiler:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y209/cilljill/gatecon/nellCabin1081908.jpg

I could imagine Sam walking up to Jack's cabin in 2010. Knocking on the door. Turning to walk to the side of the cabin and meeting up with him.

Spoiler:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y209/cilljill/gatecon/nellCabin2081908.jpg

A sign pointed the way to the park's pathway leading around to the back of Jack's Cabin.

Spoiler:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y209/cilljill/gatecon/nellCabin4081908.jpg

The four of us were imagining the fishing scene. We could feel the electric buzz of the moment the camera moved into the closeup.

Spoiler:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y209/cilljill/gatecon/nellCabin5081908.jpg

Thanks for all of the pretty pictures! I hope one day I can see it for myself!

Ok, heres the story. Jumble put this song in my head, I was thinking about the end of the summer... Sorry about this. Ok, not really

It was 2008 the thread was calm, some sang a song
some were thunking Rick, AT or Brad,
Some where posting cards, writing Joe, preforming art
It was summer-time in the Ship family thread

Splashing through the gutter, dancing by the camp fire,
It's the simple things in life like when and where
We were glad to have the internet, therefore we never will forget
The way we told TPTB we care.

And, we were trying different things we were smoking funny things
Having fun changing the lyrics of our favorite song
Shippy hints, there was no sorrow, looking foreward to tomorrow
Singing Sweet Home S/J Ship Thread all summer long
Singing Sweet Home S/J Ship Thread all summer long

Setting up our first WooHoodstock, telling Martin that he rocks
He'll forever hold a spot inside our souls
We discussed Ship and had some fun, waiting for reports from cons
In the meantime we were voting in the polls

While, we were trying different things we were smoking funny things
Making video's to match to our favorite song
Shippy hints, there was no sorrow, looking forward to tomorrow
Singing Sweet Home S/J Ship Thread all summer long
Singing Sweet Home S/J Ship Thread all summer long

Now nothing seems as strange as when the leaves begin to change
Or how we thought those days would never end
Sometimes I hear a song and I start to sing along
And think, Man I'd like to Squee for MOP again!
(Man I'd like to Squee for MOP again!)

And, we were trying different things we were smoking funny things
Making art while listening to our favorite song
Shippy hints, there was no sorrow, looking forward to tomorrow
Singing Sweet Home S/J Ship Thread all summer long!

LOL! I just heard that song and it's been in my head since yesterday! Great job!

Hey guys! Just had to drop by to say that I picked up little Carter today! He's a great little puppy. He's very smart and determined, like his namesake. I'll have pictures to post in the lounge in a few days. Oh and little Carter's grandpa's name is... Jack.

I don't hang around the lounge much but I guess I'm going to have to drop by to see him now!

But...unlike the deleted Trio scenes, the argument *can't* be made that the trimmed Threads scenes *aren't* canon. So at least there is that. And like my grandma used to say...the S/J ship is like a prairie windstorm...you look too hard and you get dust in your eyes...but there's plenty of ways to know its there.

This part made me laugh! Can so see Cam saying that!

[leiasky]

The original 90 minutes was shown only once on SCIFI. I believe it's air date was Friday,Feb 13, a day before Valentines Day. TBTP said it was the shipper's Valentine gift

I remember seeing it when it first aired. I think I cheered at the tv for hours afterword! LOL!

[leiasky]

Did someone mention a few pages back about there being something at DragonCon with AT and RDA? Was this a video or did he show up at DragonCon?!