Jack O'Neill/ Sam Carter - Part of a team, not a ship

[astronomicalchick]

It's like a hamster in a wheel. Sure, it's cute at first, but after a while you just have to think it's not really getting anywhere. Or running on a treadmill and the view never changes. In real life the relationship would have died a death from natural causes under that kind of stasis.

Friends did the same with Ross and Rachel; at least when Monica and Chandler hooked up, they picked a course and ran it, they didn't break up, get back together, break up again, marry, divorce, marry someone else, divorce and all that other crud.

I loved Ross and Rachel.. sorry, but I loved both characters so much...

er herm.. yes I probably would have lost interest. Partly because I have the attention span of a gnat and partly because I feel the earlier seasons were better. I lost interest in Babylon 5 after season 3 because it all went to h£ll...now I would much rather we had more of the Stargate and mythology and stuff!!!!

[Beta Candy]

You know how the ship could have worked? It bugs me every time shows mess it up because I'm not a TV writer and *I* can see how this would work.

If the two characters are adults, and they acknowledge and joke about their mutual attraction, it's funny. People can think it's romantic OR just silly, according to their taste. Have you ever been around two people who have no intention of dating, but enjoy flirting in a really over-the-top way? It's fun, it's silly... if you do it in fiction, people can imagine there's more to it, but they don't have to. If they'd done it right, the sidearm thing could have been a running joke. Instead, can you imagine Sam's reaction if Jack ever made a joke about that? Embarrassment, discomfort... painful to watch.

Argh. I still say Jolinar never really died and Sam's been under her control all this time. And Jack was never really attracted to Sam, but pretending to be was a convenient way to distract everyone from his true love... for Siler.

See? There ARE twist endings that could fix everything. Just kidding, no rotten tomatoes, please.

[Mr Prophet]

Argh. I still say Jolinar never really died and Sam's been under her control all this time. And Jack was never really attracted to Sam, but pretending to be was a convenient way to distract everyone from his true love... for Siler.

My theory is that Fifth creates a time machine and it turns out in Gemini that the Carter we've been seeing for the last two seasons is the Replicarter - a sort of soppy parody of our beloved tough chick, based on Fifth's adolescent fantasies.

[Lunar]

I'm very sorry if someone has already posted this here...
Have you heard the Moebius spoilers

Spoiler:

that suggest Pete may be in the episode?

.
If you've already heard, I apologise profusely for reposting it...

[Mr Prophet]

Problem solved. Replicarter can marry Pete and live happily ever; real Carter can come back and kick ass at the SGC. Jack can stop being all nervous and distant (you know he's scared of clingy Replicarter) and Daniel can actually do something again.

[xayeidemon]

I tried watching Divide and Conquer tonight. I decided that I must be a masochist if I voluntarily watched that episode after swearing never to watch the waste of 42 minutes again. Ever. So I just pretended Sam was Daniel, and everything was sane again.

Has anyone seen Jack apparently reciprocating Carter's "feelings" for him? It was quite painful to watch the you-know-what scene in Lost City. I mean, really...here I was thinking Sam was a grown woman, but she turns out to only be a 14-year-old 9th grader with a crush on her disinterested PE teacher. Sheesh.

I'm dreading the advent of the last half of season 8. I miss the real Sam.

[Jamaica03]

I think you guys may have finally converted me to an Anti-Shipper!

[ShadowMaat]

I think you guys may have finally converted me to an Anti-Shipper!

Welcome to the family!

[Beta Candy]

My theory is that Fifth creates a time machine and it turns out in Gemini that the Carter we've been seeing for the last two seasons is the Replicarter - a sort of soppy parody of our beloved tough chick, based on Fifth's adolescent fantasies.

Another good idea! By the way, your big long post before this one was fantastic! LMAO!

I think you guys may have finally converted me to an Anti-Shipper!

Yes, welcome!

I tried watching Divide and Conquer tonight. I decided that I must be a masochist if I voluntarily watched that episode after swearing never to watch the waste of 42 minutes again. Ever. So I just pretended Sam was Daniel, and everything was sane again.

Has anyone seen Jack apparently reciprocating Carter's "feelings" for him? It was quite painful to watch the you-know-what scene in Lost City. I mean, really...here I was thinking Sam was a grown woman, but she turns out to only be a 14-year-old 9th grader with a crush on her disinterested PE teacher. Sheesh.

I'm dreading the advent of the last half of season 8. I miss the real Sam.

Hey, I'll try that if I ever watch D&C again. ROFL! And no, I don't see Jack reciprocating, but I thought I was missing something. Then again, AT has said she'd like it if someone asked Jack what he really feels for her but knows it will never happen.

You know, when you consider some of the couples we've endured on SG-1, you've really got to wonder if they understand what "romantic" means. I mean...

Jack & Kynthia, the 31-day-old drug czar
Sam & Jonas Hanson (ugly dude from First Commandment)
Daniel & the younger, hipper mass-murderer Linnea
Jack & "I am TOO the boss of you" Laira

Etc.

[Mr Prophet]

Jack & Kynthia, the 31-day-old drug czar

Drugged - date rape seems to be pretty much in a day's work for the men of the SGC (Daniel/Hathor, Daniel/Princess chick).

Sam & Jonas Hanson (ugly dude from First Commandment)

I figure he got her at a particularly crappy time in her life. My assumption is that finding out Jonas was on the Stargate reactivation list was what made her so *****y in Children of the Gods.

Daniel & the younger, hipper mass-murderer Linnea

To be fair, she didn't know she was a mass-murderer, but basically rebound.

Jack & "I am TOO the boss of you" Laira

Laira...Yeah. Pretty much just happened to be there, and vice versa. Who says that romance is dead?

Actually, I think that the PTB seem to be working overtime to prove that romance is, if not dead, then at least on the critical list. Love isn't an empowering force in the Stargate universe, it's a horrible parasite that sucks out your spine and makes you into a drivelling parody of your usual self. Unfortunately for Sam, she's stuck 'loving' someone who is in the show every week, so she's now terminally short on backbone. Even Teal'c transforms into a big ol' slapper whenever the prospect of lurve rears its ugly head.

[Beta Candy]

Nice analysis there, Mr. Prophet. Great Nietzschian undertones.

[Mr Prophet]

Nice analysis there, Mr. Prophet. Great Nietzschian undertones.

Really? 'Cos I've never actually read Nietzsche.

[keshou]

Ships are like sharks - if they aren't moving, they're just so much unpleasant-tasting dead meat. It's a simple premise: if your leads aren't going to get it on in any sense, don't ship. LEave it to the subtext if anywhere. If they'd worked up to having an actual, clandestine, court-martialable relationship by Season 3, they might have made something interesting of it. I don't think it would have worked, myself, but we'll never know. As is, since the USAF would withdraw their support if that happened, they just circle madly and drive everyone insane, like wasps buzzing round a light just out of reach so you can't quite smash them to bits!

Wow, didn't reprint your whole post, but you gotta feel better getting that out of your system.

You know I can list several reasons I don't like the S/J ship (or better yet, I'll reprint Shadow's reasons ) but mainly I just don't enjoy watching it. I'm hoping the episodes that remain have enough meat to them that I can ignore the ship and think happy thoughts.

BTW, I think they're keeping the shark from moving because they want to keep it handy to jump over.

Has anyone seen Jack apparently reciprocating Carter's "feelings" for him? It was quite painful to watch the you-know-what scene in Lost City. I mean, really...here I was thinking Sam was a grown woman, but she turns out to only be a 14-year-old 9th grader with a crush on her disinterested PE teacher. Sheesh.

Well, to be honest, I did see RDA "trying" to express that Jack had strong feelings for Sam a few times, mainly in season 4. I thought he looked pretty crushed at the end of Beneath the Surface when he realized Sam wasn't going to be leaning her head on his shoulder anymore and he became "sir" again. But otherwise I don't think he's played it all that convincingly. On the other hand AT seems to be much better at this sort of stuff so it kind of comes across that Sam has stronger feelings than Jack (IMO, anyway). But lots of fans loved that scene in Lost City and if you listen to the commentaries so did the TPTB.

I think you guys may have finally converted me to an Anti-Shipper!

Welcome to the family!

We have a family? Well I don't think we're the inlaws, more like the "outlaws".

[DJFavorite]

I brought myself to watch D&C the other day (which ever day it was on...) I'm glad they didn't show Sam's retest. That way, I can take Jack's comments anyway I choose (which of cource is the anti-ship way).

One thing I enjoyed while watching it was the Freya kissed Jack (both times). If you really watch it, you can see that Jack is reciprocating the kisses. Do you really think he would reach up to her face or even let her get that second kiss in, if he really had feelings for Sam... Personally, I would think not (at least I have to believe that way to get any ship thoughts out of my head. )

Then the look on Sam's face when she shot and went to Martouf. You can tell she has feelings for him. Strong romantic feelings.



Jump several seasons to Chimera. I love the comment Sam makes to Pete about the guys she's dated have all died. I wouldn't say she dated most of the guys she was attracted to. But obviously she had enough emotional attachment to them to consider it dating. So why 'date' these other guys if she had feelings for Jack. I never would do that.



Just had to get my thoughts down (sorry if it seems a bit ramdomized.)

[Beta Candy]

Really? 'Cos I've never actually read Nietzsche.

Well, there's room for interpretation with Nietzsche, but he seemed to find relationships with women very draining, like it sapped his strength. Some people think he hated women... I just think he had some good points about the genders never 100% understanding each other, and how expecting to understand each other that well just drags you down.

But I digress. The point of the topic is that watching two people who don't understand each other all that well (I give their love affair 3 weeks, tops, if they ever actually did attempt to date) is sapping OUR strength, and we must fight back.

Maybe we could develop anti-ship goggles, specially designed to play scenes from the Simpsons whenever those two are alone in a room.

Or maybe we could submit to TPTB some alternative ships they might want to explore - potential couples with more chemistry than S/J, and a better chance of getting involved. Here, I'll start the ball rolling with a few examples:

Jack & Thor (c'mon, this one's hinted at at LEAST as well as J/S)
Jack & Maybourne (what was that "cabana boys" line in Paradise Lost?)
Hammond and one of the Jaffa women from Birthright (just sounds fun, ya know?)
Daniel & some girl he met at a grocery store
Walter & the chick that gave the "and we're walking!" tour in 2010
Pete & Major Wood

Anyone else have any ideas? If we bring in guest stars, the potential is almost limitless.