Sam Carter/Amanda Tapping Discussion/Appreciation

[LadyJeep]

At the risk of turning this into another ship thread (I'll stop in a minute, I swear), the (unhappy) thought had crossed my mind that episode 200 might contain various vignettes of "possible movie plots/scenarios" while the makers of the film consult with the SGC; wherein the SG-1 characters we know and love end up playing 'roles' in those various (fictional scenarios) born of the movie producer's script(s). Hence, we may end up with a Sam and Jack scene that isn't really a Sam and Jack at all, rather a movie!Sam/movie!Jack potential (unreal) scene, etc etc... so that the entire episode becomes a series of humor/innuendo/hollywood-ized "versions" of the upcoming movie X-Treme.

Ergo, Amanda's little spoiler tease could be taken quite literally. There really would be a two word, a three word and five word answer to the Sam/Jack ship question. It's one way I can think of that they can incorporate everything from "ship" to movies, to full-on marionettes with a one hour storyline. I'd hate it. But it'd be an easy reset, and would definitely be a well used, cliche method of making fun at one's self, whether overdone or not. Here's hoping I'm wrong ...

Just a little clarity on Amanda's spoiler on Sam/Jack Ship. When asked about Sam/Jack shippers having something to look forward to, she said there was a 2 letter answer and a three letter answer. Then said the answer was the three letter answer, yes. Then in passing she said, oh yeah there could have been a five letter answer, also. But her answer to the question was a definite yes

[Skydiver]

Now take a long deep breath Sky

See, I don't visit those threads and sites (Anti-Sam, Pro Daniel etc) so it doesn't bother me. I think if we all just played where we know we're accepted and comfortable, these wars wouldn't have been blown out of porportion. To each his or her own and everyone should remember, it's a tv show.

LOL

one reason things got kinda nasty was, many of hte more passionate daniel fans also ran a lot of the major sites. So when they decided that sam/jack was bad, they'd do whatever they could to eliminate the badness, and run the shippers out.

for some strange reason, from the pov of the shippers, this was kinda no fun.

so there were and are a lot of bad feelings, on both sides. There are still sites that discriminate against sam/jack (like a few archives where sam/pete, jack/sara, teal'c/ishta, etc ship fic is ok but sam/jack is not because it's not canon.....yeah, ain't even going there

Anyway, one nice thing abuot this thread is that we have folks that like sam in all her incarnations...and all of us are adult enough to accept others' differences

[Skydiver]

You know I just have to share something I found hilarious. Reading the Illustrated compaion for S4..... Divide & Conquer was actually supposed to "knock the Sam & Jack issue on the head"..... Bwahahahahahahahahahaha


Worst. Head. Knock. Ever.

[wanders off giggling at the silly TTTB]

yeah. another example of tptb miscalculating the fan response. If they truly wanted to put it to bed, they needed to ignore the ship, to downplay it or to give sam or jack other partners. by 'dealing with it' all they did was confirm that it existed

d&c kickstarted the shippers, it didn't downplay it

[Simhavaktra]

I never said anything about there being no hope for good Sam stuff

Ah.

Sorry.

I was taking...

If you remember back before s9, there were similiar things said and all it turned out to be was completely ambiguous things. Easily ignorable or interpreted another way if you wanted to. I have a feeling s10 will be the same.

...to refer to Sam spoilers in general, not just Sam/Jack spoilers, since I feel, examining the spoilers - with the 20/20 hindsight eyesight - that the Sam spoilers for season 9, as promulgated by TPTB-Continuum, turned out to reflect little about what actually appeared in the season's episodes, if said spoilers weren't passed through a promotional tesseract before one read them. Ambiguous, easily interpreted in multiple often contradictory ways, and probably best ignored in terms of actual informational content, that was the season 9 Sam spoilers, IMO.


(alas, that kind of spoilerage/inside ino doesn't make me personally more eager to watch a show, when the members of TPTB-Continuum who give out spoilers / info about upcoming seasons or eps do it in a cutesy manner, in phrases with infinitely reconfigurable connotations and denotations that conveniently obscure the actual informational content - it just tells me that playing with my head is more important to them than communicating withh me )

[SG1Poz]

LOL

one reason things got kinda nasty was, many of hte more passionate daniel fans also ran a lot of the major sites. So when they decided that sam/jack was bad, they'd do whatever they could to eliminate the badness, and run the shippers out.

for some strange reason, from the pov of the shippers, this was kinda no fun.

so there were and are a lot of bad feelings, on both sides. There are still sites that discriminate against sam/jack (like a few archives where sam/pete, jack/sara, teal'c/ishta, etc ship fic is ok but sam/jack is not because it's not canon.....yeah, ain't even going there

B]Anyway, one nice thing abuot this thread is that we have folks that like sam in all her incarnations...and all of us are adult enough to accept others' differences

Yeppers! There are some fine folk in here and they seem to accept me even though I don't write and hence, not considered a Samandan

[chocdoc]

actually, the issue has been there pretty much since the beginnig.

as far as many shippers are concerned, the chemistry was there in COTG. However things were usually kept low key, so the shippers woudl project, the anti-shippers (many of which are also jack/daniel friendship or relationship fans) would say no and it'd end up in a cease fire cause there'd never be any proof

then comes d&c and canon proof that jack cares for sam 'more than he's supposed to'

needless to say, after years of being told that they were full of it, the shippers had fun tossing the proof into the anti's faces, and the anti's feelings escalated from 'those annoying shippers' to something more passionate

thus begins the 'great shipper wars' which have pretty much continued ever since.

Things escalate with every 'ship' episode adn reached their worst levels during s6 when MS said that he was going to leave. Needless to say, for those whose enjoyment revolved around daniel and the jack/daniel dynamic, daniel leaving was quite a blow. many of the shippers really didn't care, at least not to the level that many of the daniel fans did

so during s6 - very generally speaking - the shippers enjoyed themselves, while the anti's became convinced that 'evil ship' destroyed thier show - a feeling that was only augmented when MS gave interviews that cited the rise in sam/jack and blamed it for him seeing a lessening of daniel and daniel's importance in the show

then comes s7 and daniel returns - after a 2 year long, VERY bitter campaign run by the daniel fans to get their actor back. They saw his return as a victory and 'proof' that tptb saw ship as a mistake and that jack and daniel would renew their frienship to a level that the daniel fans want (again, i do mean SOME of the fans, not all)

but that didn't happen. One thing - in my opinion - many of hte passionate daniel fans in thier fervor to get daniel back, promoted the slash aspect of the show...an aspect that both actors don't seem very comfortable with and, gain only in my opinion, something that may have to do with jack and daniel keeping thier distance from each other on the show

so, the long and short of it is, the ship/anti ship feelings have been there since day one. things jsut got really nasty in season 4, then in 5 and 7 and are evidentally headed back that way for s10

Wow, I guess these fans must not have been too happy with Daniel's role in much of season 7 and 8 then. Obviously, TPTB did ask MS back (and I hear MS also wanted to come back), yet kept on with the ship, among many other things--one of them being a good number of Sam-centric episodes.

I agree with SG1Poz---I think those who are so critical are just jealous that AT worked with and helped to nuture a role that is equal to both Jack and Daniel's role, even though Sam is not an original character from the movie. Sam has been able to hold her own on the show. SG-1 was not only about Jack and Daniel, although that is an important relationship. It was a show about the interactions between all the team members. Not sure what will happen now though---I'm worried all three originals will go into the background. If so, the show won't last, IMO.

AT/Sam really has been in the thick of controversy for a long time, hasn't she. (I would never have guessed this at all, but only know it because I am online). What amazes me is that some fans don't separate the actor from the character. I guess in this case, some blame AT for getting prominence in the show. It's not her fault. She was doing what she should be doing---her job very very well. From things I have read and heard about, AT gets all sorts of fanmail from folks that just simply watch the show. It is good too that she gets alot of appreciation at these conventions. And any actor that has fans of hers organize a convention just for that actor--well that's something special.

[SG1Poz]

yeah. another example of tptb miscalculating the fan response. If they truly wanted to put it to bed, they needed to ignore the ship, to downplay it or to give sam or jack other partners. by 'dealing with it' all they did was confirm that it existed

d&c kickstarted the shippers, it didn't downplay it

..and remember, following that was W O P which confirmed it further! What a kiss!

[majorsal]

Hi...I'm joining late in this conversation, but I needed to go somewhere where there were some positive things about Carter. Ever since it's been announced that RDA is coming back, poor AT and Carter have been dragged through the mud. It's almost sad.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to whatever they have planned, whether subtle or factual.

hi, ncc,

i saw what you were going through at the other place, so i'm glad to see you over here. i hope you stay.




sally

[majorsal]

To say TPTB handled it poorly would be a gross understatement... but it's what we have to work with. No solution would make anyone happy.

At this point, I think come S10, they just need to promote one of the two of them and get it over with. A lot of fans would be angry, but at least it would be settled.

and i have a feeling sam's going to be the loser in this. sam will never be given sg1 as her own again (my sad opinion), so i'm liking this co-leader thing. even if they start writing mitchell as a good leader, i'll still want sam leading. she earned it, ten fold. ONE HUNDRED FOLD.

i don't really have high hopes for the leadership issue to be handled the way that i, sam fan, will like. but i've come to live with it. (and it makes me resent mitchell)




sally

[LaCroix]

LOL

one reason things got kinda nasty was, many of hte more passionate daniel fans also ran a lot of the major sites. So when they decided that sam/jack was bad, they'd do whatever they could to eliminate the badness, and run the shippers out.

for some strange reason, from the pov of the shippers, this was kinda no fun.

so there were and are a lot of bad feelings, on both sides. There are still sites that discriminate against sam/jack (like a few archives where sam/pete, jack/sara, teal'c/ishta, etc ship fic is ok but sam/jack is not because it's not canon.....yeah, ain't even going there

Anyway, one nice thing abuot this thread is that we have folks that like sam in all her incarnations...and all of us are adult enough to accept others' differences

I know there are times when I'm a pain in-- neck. I hope that there are no hard feelings for any statement(s) that I've made today or in the past.

[Skydiver]

I agree with SG1Poz---I think those who are so critical are just jealous that AT worked with and helped to nuture a role that is equal to both Jack and Daniel's role, even though Sam is not an original character from the movie. Sam has been able to hold her own on the show. SG-1 was not only about Jack and Daniel, although that is an important relationship. It was a show about the interactions between all the team members. Not sure what will happen now though---I'm worried all three originals will go into the background. If so, the show won't last, IMO.

amanda also went from 'woman hired to fill a supporting role' to 'second in command of the show'....and she did that with her skill, ability and talent

[chocdoc]

it had entered my mind that they were setting up sam going off with jack (and the show too), because *for sam*, it was the end of the line *on this show*. i have a feeling they're pushing everyone BUT mitchell-vala off this show.

but if this is the end of sam being on this show, i can't think of a more fitting and beautiful way to send her off than to have her and jack getting together and having a family. NOT settle down (one's brain doesn't shut down just because they get married and/or have children), but settle into a new groove of life. i could see sam still working 'for' the sgc program, just not going through the gate on a mission-to-mission basis.

if they're going in this direction -IF- i could actually see the parallels between sam and amanda's lives. amanda put off having children because, basically, she didn't want to try to run both personal and career at the same time. she gave up waiting (because, like the goaulds, the threats=seasons didn't stop coming) and started having that family. i could see sam coming to the same conclusions. they got rid of the goaulds and replicaters, and another new bad guy came to take their place. it'll never end. should sam put her personal life on hold indefinitely?

if sg1 continues to a season 11, i'd love sam to be in it. BUT, if she's going to leave, i'd LOVE her reason to be because she's gotten together with jack and is now concentrating on having a family(life). if it's good enough for amanda, it's good enough for sam!

btw, sam can still have a family and be at the scg. just like amanda.




totally biased and yours,
sally

Good points and I respect your opinion, Sally.

I guess I just don't want AT pushed out the door if she doesn't want to leave. She doesn't deserve that -- none of the actors do. And I think if she wants to continue in season 11, then I don't see Sam and Jack having children. I would rather see Sam Carter in season 11, if they are fortunate enough to even get a season 11, and Sam would not have children and continue on SG-1. But I am not a shipper (but not anti either). I like Sam because of her military and science skills. I don't mind the subtle aspects of Jack and Sam, but I don't want it to be the main story arc for Sam (perhaps at the very end of the very end of the very end though).

[SunKrux]

Fair or not, Cameron and Vala are among the most visible changes to the show, so it is quite possible that they will be blamed if the show is cancelled, even though the best actor in the world can't do much with crappy writing.

Well then fans who go that way ... Aw, never mind. Most everyone here knows how I feel about the whole thing. I'll just sit over here and remember the awesomeness that is Amanda!

[majorsal]

You know, Daniel is my favorite character and always will be, but I liked all 4 of them together. They made a great team. I loved the slow friendship that was built over the years of Daniel and Teal'c. They have so much history and it wasn't easy for either of them. I loved the sister and brother relationship of Daniel and Sam. I loved the quiet friendship of Sam and Teal'c. And of course I loved the friendship from the moment Jack brought Teal'c onto the team.

They've each had a relationship build over the years amongst each other. It's not odd that out of any of those possibilities that more than friendship could happen. I think the way they handled Jack and Sam was good over the 8 years. It wasn't blatantly in your face. It was a hint here and there. No one complained when Daniel pined for years after Sha're. It was almost embarrasing to watch if you ask me. I know he loved her, but at least he was allowed to love her. But not Sam...how dare she have a relationship with anyone...it diminishes her. I can't figure that one out. She can still be a strong character and have a relationship.

that's what i think too! and i've been saying that for years



sally

[chocdoc]

amanda also went from 'woman hired to fill a supporting role' to 'second in command of the show'....and she did that with her skill, ability and talent

Absolutely! She has done this so well. I hope that producer John Smith's words at the convention last weekend were not just empty words. I know---they could very well be empty words, but I hope not.