Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Discussion Thread

[Rachel500]

The Other Guys

Generally

In many ways, exploring the "normal" characters or those of lesser ranks can be a good thing - ST:TNG did it very well. And the concept of this was interesting.

But I have to admit on first watching I found the whole thing rather "meh". I think part of it is that is I have no idea who Patrick McKenna is, have no nostalgic fondness for him, and so don't really enjoy Felger as a character. Coombes, on the other hand, I loved as the performance is much more understated.

In rewatching (several times now), I've grown slightly less irritated with Felger and actually can appreciate that Felger does show some redeeming features in the episode (all of which are pretty much undone by Avenger 2.0 but that's another story) - he's someone who does hero worship SG1, but who also has taken their values to heart and so bravely attempts to rescue them.

Still not keen on the episode and I have to admit that until Avenger 2.0 confirmed the final daydream scene was only of the medals and the kiss, I was with those who preferred to think that the whole thing was a figment of Felger's imagination.

Sam and Jack

There isn't much here but as last time I think there's a good in-story reason. This is ostensibly the first "action" mission we see SG1 embark on post-Abyss, and it involves trusting the Tok'ra who is pretending to be a Goa'uld to get information. That's a huge thing in terms of Jack's mental state. And for that reason I always think that the team has split up into buddy groups in this episode: Sam with Jonas, and Teal'c with Jack. Primarily because Teal'c can handle Jack if he suddenly collapses or goes nuts - after all, ostensibly they're being captured by a Goa'uld and the last time Jack was captured by a Goa'uld he was tortured to death several times so there is the possibility of flashbacks. So, I also think Jack needs the distance from Sam in order to ensure that he doesn't have flashbacks in regards to Sam/Shallen, to maintain his objectivity.

There are two moments for me though that stand out in terms of their interaction; one is in the scene where Jack is tortured by Herak - all of SG1 respond angrily but Sam looks alternatively absolutely furious at how Jack is targeted - and makes himself a target, and so very concerned for him.

The second moment is when Jack orders Sam to go with Jonas to get to the gate and dial home while he and Teal'c go back for Coombes. For a second, she just looks pissed that he's sending her off in the opposite direction to himself again. As though she suspects that his continually putting her with Jonas is for a more personal distancing thing rather than simple military tactics. But after that split second of annoyance on her face, she follows her orders.

[Cagranosalis]

Great review Toomi. I like this episode too because it's just fun and not meant to be taken too seriously.

I'm going to say that Jack does really look delightful in this episode!!! But while he and Sam share a few glances, there's not much interaction.

Oh doesn't he just! And the snark-o-meter is cranked right up to eleven.

Still not keen on the episode and I have to admit that until Avenger 2.0 confirmed the final daydream scene was only of the medals and the kiss, I was with those who preferred to think that the whole thing was a figment of Felger's imagination.

Well, if you subscribe to the opinion that the whole of the latter episode is also "it-happened-in-Felger's-mind-only" then you can still assume the whole thing never happened... although...ah, rats! Nope, the whole gate macro thing comes up in a later episode so that doesn't work! Sorry, it's real.

Personally, I have no problem assuming the whole thing is real up to the point of the kiss. I might even assume the medal ceremony happened and, at a push Sam gave him a peck on the cheek and he just "went there" with it in his head.

There isn't much here but as last time I think there's a good in-story reason. This is ostensibly the first "action" mission we see SG1 embark on post-Abyss, and it involves trusting the Tok'ra who is pretending to be a Goa'uld to get information. That's a huge thing in terms of Jack's mental state. And for that reason I always think that the team has split up into buddy groups in this episode: Sam with Jonas, and Teal'c with Jack. Primarily because Teal'c can handle Jack if he suddenly collapses or goes nuts - after all, ostensibly they're being captured by a Goa'uld and the last time Jack was captured by a Goa'uld he was tortured to death several times so there is the possibility of flashbacks. So, I also think Jack needs the distance from Sam in order to ensure that he doesn't have flashbacks in regards to Sam/Shallen, to maintain his objectivity.

I don't know about this. We don't really know how long after Abyss this episode is set but I think we can safely say there was a period of mental health assessment/therapy that followed. I can't imagine the psychiatric team at the SGC letting Jack out to do such a mission, where they know he'll definitely be confronted with the very thing he's recently been through, if he wasn't 100% ready to do it without flipping out; they just wouldn't take the risk. And I have to believe the mental health professionals that make those decisions are trained to see through the toughest of "I'm alright" hard-nosed exteriors. More than that I don't think Jack - a seasoned and professional soldier whose "been there" before with torture - would go back out into the field if he wasn't 100% sure of himself; he would not want to risk putting any of his team in jeopardy because he's not sure if he can handle it or not.

Although I do think his extra snarkiness in this episode is, perhaps, a hang over reaction from the events in Abyss.

There are two moments for me though that stand out in terms of their interaction; one is in the scene where Jack is tortured by Herak - all of SG1 respond angrily but Sam looks alternatively absolutely furious at how Jack is targeted - and makes himself a target, and so very concerned for him.

Oh yes, I love that look right there. "what do you think you're doing to my man!"
Seriously though, I do think youre right that Jack deliberately makes himself a target here and I think that might well be a reaction to his torture by Ba'al. He might be able to handle it but that doesn't mean he wants anyone else to face the same, least of all the people he cares most about.

The second moment is when Jack orders Sam to go with Jonas to get to the gate and dial home while he and Teal'c go back for Coombes. For a second, she just looks pissed that he's sending her off in the opposite direction to himself again. As though she suspects that his continually putting her with Jonas is for a more personal distancing thing rather than simple military tactics. But after that split second of annoyance on her face, she follows her orders.

Good spot! I need to rewatch, that one I didn't catch that.

[Rachel500]

<snip>
I don't know about this. We don't really know how long after Abyss this episode is set but I think we can safely say there was a period of mental health assessment/therapy that followed. I can't imagine the psychiatric team at the SGC letting Jack out to do such a mission, where they know he'll definitely be confronted with the very thing he's recently been through, if he wasn't 100% ready to do it without flipping out; they just wouldn't take the risk. And I have to believe the mental health professionals that make those decisions are trained to see through the toughest of "I'm alright" hard-nosed exteriors. More than that I don't think Jack - a seasoned and professional soldier whose "been there" before with torture - would go back out into the field if he wasn't 100% sure of himself; he would not want to risk putting any of his team in jeopardy because he's not sure if he can handle it or not.

Although I do think his extra snarkiness in this episode is, perhaps, a hang over reaction from the events in Abyss.

<snip>

Oh, I agree that from a medical perspective that the mission wouldn't have been allowed if he was suffering from any obvious signs of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and if Jack himself thought he was going to be a real danger to his team. He'd been OK'd for the mission to Kelowna after all and I believe there was an extensive period of recovery and treatment even before that.

But regardless of what everyone *believed* in terms of him being OK medically, for me the thing is until Jack was faced with a similar scenario nobody really knows how he would handle it for certain including Jack.

And the scenario is one that has to have pushed all of Jack's buttons: having to trust/put his life in the hands of the Tok'ra, ostensibly being captured by a "Goa'uld" even if it was faked, and later when they really are captured - being tortured again.

I do think given the way he does seem to have paired himself off with Teal'c, and Sam off with Jonas to a degree, that there has to be an underlying reason for that. Now maybe it was simply continuing to distance himself from Sam after Abyss brought up all his feelings again, and he preferred Teal'c rather than Jonas as his buddy. Maybe some of it was team rotation to get Jonas and Sam used to working together to some degree rather than Jonas always being with Teal'c. Maybe some of it was about giving Sam additional responsibility. And maybe some of it was to have the person most able to physically handle Jack beside him should Jack react negatively during the mission.

On the plus side, this mission though had to have proven to Jack that he could handle it in future and given him confidence that he really was recovered from his experience with Ba'al.

EDIT: It has just occured to me though - how much Jack's snarkiness with Herak in particular reminds me of how Jack is with Ba'al later in S8. Just a thought which I'm going to ruminate on.

[hedwig]

Still not keen on the episode and I have to admit that until Avenger 2.0 confirmed the final daydream scene was only of the medals and the kiss, I was with those who preferred to think that the whole thing was a figment of Felger's imagination.

It never occurred to me that any part of this episode, except the medal ceremony, might be a figment of Felger's imagination. And that's still the only part that I can stretch my imagination far enough to include. If the whole episode was his imagination, I doubt he would have imagined the scenes back at the SGC, with the other scientist talking to Hammond, and Hammond in the control room talking to Walter, or any other part of those scenes. And he would never have imagined that scene where Jack tells him and Coombs the whole thing was a set-up to get SG1 captured. The looks on the faces of Felger and Coombs was priceless.

Sam and Jack

And for that reason I always think that the team has split up into buddy groups in this episode: Sam with Jonas, and Teal'c with Jack. Primarily because Teal'c can handle Jack if he suddenly collapses or goes nuts - after all, ostensibly they're being captured by a Goa'uld and the last time Jack was captured by a Goa'uld he was tortured to death several times so there is the possibility of flashbacks.

Apparently my shippy glasses aren't imaginative enough to see things as described in this paragraph. I can see Sam being "assigned" to Jonas since he's still new and needs a guide, and Sam's a gentler guide than either Teal'c or Jack would be. I can't see anything beyond that in the group arrangement - except maybe the bolded part.

There are two moments for me though that stand out in terms of their interaction; one is in the scene where Jack is tortured by Herak - all of SG1 respond angrily but Sam looks alternatively absolutely furious at how Jack is targeted - and makes himself a target, and so very concerned for him.

Again, I'm not sure where I put my shippy glasses, because for me the other members of SG1 looked very stoic (is that the right word?), in that they showed little to no emotion over Herak using the pain stick on Jack. To show emotion would mean that Herak had gotten to them, and Sam and Teal'c (at least) are trained to not show emotion over something like this. (And I saw any annoyance as being from being restrained by the Jaffa and unable to do anything, as much as concern for Jack.) About the only thing I saw in her look was an "intenseness", which indicated to me that maybe beneath the surface she was seething over what was happening.

And having just watched this episode again, the only look of fury on Sam's face was in the few seconds after the failed escape attempt and she was being restrained by a Jaffa; not after Harak used the pain stick the first time. When Harak used the pain stick on Jack, we didn't see Sam at all; we saw Jonas the first time. The second or third time, when Jack was being sarcastic again and Harak was going to use the pain stick, Sam interrupted to say Jack was telling the truth about not knowing anything useful because all the information had died with Khonsu, and again (not surprisingly) there was some intensity in her response.

The second moment is when Jack orders Sam to go with Jonas to get to the gate and dial home while he and Teal'c go back for Coombes. For a second, she just looks pissed that he's sending her off in the opposite direction to himself again. As though she suspects that his continually putting her with Jonas is for a more personal distancing thing rather than simple military tactics. But after that split second of annoyance on her face, she follows her orders.

And, again, I just don't see what you are seeing in Sam's expressions.

What was shown was the group watching the gate to see how many Jaffa were around, and offscreen we hear Jack say "Carter, you and Jonas ..." (and something about one of the big guns), and Sam says "yes, sir". All this is offscreen; we don't see anybody's expression. Next, we see the group crouching behind trees. Then we see the battle with the various Jaffa and then the team arriving at the gate/DHD.

When Jack and Teal'c are about to go back to rescue Coombs, they step onto the ring platform and Jack says "Give us 5 minutes, then ... " and he gets cut off as the rings activate. The image switches to Sam's face, where she's squishing her face up due to the brightness of the light from the rings, and then she looks at Jonas. I don't see anything there that indicates annoyance.

So, again, maybe I've misplaced my shippy glasses (or they may be smudged from my cat poking her nose on them), because I just don't see what you've seen. But then sometimes I see something others don't, so I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder?

[Rachel500]

Well it would be kinda boring on the thread if we all agreed with each other all of the time, hmmm?

[hlndncr]

Nice Review Toomi.

I like this episode OK for the fun of it. I don't mind Felger, but I think he was more fun with Coombs and I like Avenger 2.0 much less than The Other Guys partly for this reason.

I love Patrick McKenna since I saw him as Harold on The Red Green Show all those years ago and when I saw him in SG-1 I was really excited. He plays a hero worshipping bumbling scientist and he suits this role so well.

I LOVE The Red Green Show. It's been so many years since I've watched it; I forgot all about Harold. (Duct Tape Forever is a classic in my book.)

I'm going to say that Jack does really look delightful in this episode!!! But while he and Sam share a few glances, there's not much interaction.

I'm going to say that Jack is his best looking ever in season six IMHO, (and I shall save the rest of my drooling for Allegiance and Jack's really big gun. ) I don't see how Sam managed to resist dragging him into the nearest storage closest and having her way with him. Clearly she had reasons for keeping her interactions to a minimum.

There are two moments for me though that stand out in terms of their interaction; one is in the scene where Jack is tortured by Herak - all of SG1 respond angrily but Sam looks alternatively absolutely furious at how Jack is targeted - and makes himself a target, and so very concerned for him.

The second moment is when Jack orders Sam to go with Jonas to get to the gate and dial home while he and Teal'c go back for Coombes. For a second, she just looks pissed that he's sending her off in the opposite direction to himself again. As though she suspects that his continually putting her with Jonas is for a more personal distancing thing rather than simple military tactics. But after that split second of annoyance on her face, she follows her orders.

I can't say that I ever saw even any shippy looks in this episode, but after reading Rachel's comments (and others' responses) I watched very carefully to see if I could see anything.

I did see the first look, when Jack has been zatted and is on the ground and Harak picks up the pain stick. The camera flashes to Sam, who looks very distressed to me. She knows Jack is the one that's been taunting Harak and he's going to bear the brunt of his anger. I think she is afraid of what it might do to him. And when she speaks up, telling Harak they really don't know anything, I do see some measure of desperation to protect Jack from further torture.

I didn't really see the second look. I do see her look over at Jonas right after Jack and Teal'c ring away with something akin to resignation, like she would expect him to do put himself in harm's way to save an innocent.

As to Jack's mental state, I think his snarkiness is at fever pitch here and it does feel artificial, like he's trying to cover something up or hold something back. I mean he even goes so far as to ask Sam what she thinks of his resume joke. To me it feels like he needs to keep up the act, even just in front of his team.

I don't think he's mentally unstable or unprepared for the mission, but I do think Jack might be questioning himself, whether he can keep doing this or if he even really wants to, especially when the mission goes south. I really like the moment when Felger tells them "his plan" that involves taking out about a dozen Jaffa at the gate. Jack is reluctant, but then Felger says, "It's what you do." It's like Jack takes a moment there to look inside himself and then he says, "right." It's like his decision is made; this is what he does and he isn't going to let the events of Abyss change that. After that moment, I see a different Jack, particularly as he goes back for Coombs without hesitation and even takes a brief moment to taunt Harak one last time before going back through the gate. He's back, and he's still got it.

[lastrequest]

Hi all, just dropping in here to ask if anyone wants to contribute to my discussion at

http://forum.gateworld.net/threads/7...n-Sam-and-Jack

I'm wanting to get opinion from both shippers and non-shippers about the frat.regs, so would appreciate anything anyone wants to add

[mara-anni]

Just dropping this in, for anyone how may be interested

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6220245/...rst_Hand_Touch

[iiradned]

Just dropping this in, for anyone how may be interested

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6220245/...rst_Hand_Touch

Very nice!!

[Petra]

So I got a bit wordy...

Banner by Josiane

Synopsis: Fleeing from Anubis the Tok’ra led by Malek and Jacob arrive at the Alpha Site, where soon tensions rise between them and rebel Jaffa. Jack with help from Jacob and Bra’tac tries to maintain peace and avoid escalation of the conflict, but meanwhile people start to die, including, as it seems, Bra’tac. It turns out that the assassin possessing technology to make himself invisible, an Ashrak sent by Anubis, is responsible. Sam, Jacob and Malek come up with a way to make him visible and in the end he’s killed by not-so- dead-after-all Bra’tac, who then uses his death to unite the Jaffa, the Tok’ra and the Tau’ri..

Favourite line: Jack: I’m sure he’s sorry.
Jaffa: I’m not.
Jack: On the inside.

Favourite scene: argument after the funeral, including Sam’s news about the Tok’ra not liking their temporary quarters. The “we can make the invisible guy visible again” exchange.

Generally:

Season 6 is my favourite season of SG-1 and Allegiance is one of my favourite episodes of that season – it should give you some idea of how much I adore it. Before I proceed let me just have my moment of regret that Jonas had to “sit this one out” and a moment of glee at seeing Jacob and Bra’tac working together, in the same episode – and even being in the same frame – for the first time ever. As a fan of the Tok’ra and the Jaffa episodes I get a double treat here, made even sweeter by leader!Jack, Janet and other SGC personnel's presence.

The teaser’s one of my favourite ones in the series. It’s chaotic, people are running, Janet and her medic staff are saving lives, Jaffa and the SGC personnel are guarding the Gate, Jack’s overseeing everything and at first you don’t know what’s going on and where the heck are they? A little tense moment between the Jaffa and the Tok’ra over Za’tarc detectors is easy to dismiss as battle induced adrenaline surge and yet it foreshadows Jaffa/Tok’ra problems to come. And then with the arrival of Pierce and Jacob we finally start to get some answers. It’s the Alpha Site where the Rebel Jaffa and the Tok’ra seek refuge. And Jack seems to be in command; I’m not sure how does it work logistically, being in command of SG-1 and off-world base at the same time, but I love it and he’s damn good at it.

The funeral scene continues to show mounting tension between the Jaffa and the Tok’ra, offering us a glimpse into Tok’ra culture (and you know I’m a sucker for such stuff) and Jack’s leadership capabilities. Due to Kanan’s betrayal he suffered at Baal’s hands only 2 episodes earlier so his distrust, anger and possibly hatred for the Tok’ta are still fresh and yet he’s able to put them aside for the sake of his command and act as a peace keeper, not taking sides. However you can see his heart is clearly with the Jaffa and when pushed by Malek he slips and makes a barb about the Tok’ra not having much success in their fight. Interestingly, he immediately apologises, realizing that as the base CO he needs to set an example and can’t let his personal feelings dictate his actions, but he does allow himself a little honesty and luxury of venting his frustration to first Sam and then Jacob in The Talk – the only talk he’s ever had onscreen about his feelings and attitude towards the Tok’ra post-Kanan. It speaks volumes about the huge trust and faith he has in Jacob.

As the events unfold, people start to die and the hostility between the Tok’ra and the Jaffa escalates, Jack too starts to lose patience. Jacob was right saying that it’s all because of history (and I love how it is acknowledged and how neither side is painted as the bad guy; it really is all about overcoming thousands of years of history and not ill will) but understanding it doesn’t make the animosity magically disappear. I absolutely adore how Jack, Jacob and Bra’tac work together to keep things from escalating and how the older two defer to Jack’s leadership – how in fact everybody does. Note that in the scene when Teal’c’s choking Malek he lets go only after Jack backs Jacob up, meaning it. And it’s a trust well deserved, because really, Jack shines here. He shows himself, as I mentioned, as a great leader willing to put aside his own emotions and make hard decisions, he gets to be a smart tactician when he guesses the culprit would want to leave the crime scene and later when he sees the Ashrak’s ruse to draw people away from the gate for what it is, for once he doesn’t suck at diplomacy, is quick to apologise and acknowledge his own prejudicies and is unusually attuned to the people’s emotions (like when he lets Teal’c break the news about Bra’tac’s death). Heh, I’m totally fangurling his leadership skills in this ep.

Bra’tac and Jacob work together as well as can be expected, both of them being the oldest and wisest of their people, with unusually open minds and determination to keep their people together and focused on the common goal. I love how Jacob helps Bra’tac come up with a reasoning to convince the Jaffa to undergo Za’tarc testing. And yes, I’m talking about Jacob and not Selmak because even the Tok’ra talk to him and not his symbiote (when he’s shot in the teaser Malek cries “Jacob!”, not “Selmak!”)

I think Teal’c’s journey throughout the episode is really interesting, although very subtle because he’s not a major player here. He starts out as a peacekeeper like Jack and Bra’tac, during funeral stands with the Tau’ri (as a side note, I found it interesting that Jack wanted to know what was being said and didn’t wave off T’s translations like he usually did with Daniel’s), during that Jaffa-Tok’ra stand-off he tries to initially diffuse situation but when weapons get drown he joins the Jaffa and after Bra’tac’s alleged death he openly chooses Jaffa side. The end shot of the Jaffa during Bra’tac’s speech shows him with his people; Sam, Jack and Pierce standing in a separate Tau’ri group and the Tok’ra with Jacob in another group. I’m not sure what I think about it, just throwing it out here.

Then there’s Janet and Sam, often paired together which is always nice to see. I can’t think of any reason why Janet would be on the Alpha Site and not at the SGC, but having her here works.

I guess the weakest element of Allegiance is the plot itself. No matter how much I love the ep, I can’t help but roll my eyes at Bra’tac being dragged off into the bushes and then showing up at the very end to save the day with quite pompous speech because this one time Ashrak didn’t kill his victim, leaving him alive for reasons unknown (other than to let himself be killed later, that is). Malek’s paralysis at the crucial moment doesn’t help either. He’s the Tok’ra base commander, you’d think he’d have more of a backbone and courage (but I still adore his character).

Finally, there’s the scene with Jack and his Huge Honkin’ Gun. What I’m about to confess will probably cost me my membership in the Jack Fans’ Club, but…I’m not crazy about that scene. In the episode already filled with awesomeness that is Jack this is a little OTT, IMO. And for the life of my I can’t figure out why he draws his knife at the end instead of just shooting the damn thing.

Sam and Jack implications:

I didn’t write much about Sam in the General section because frankly her role is minimal. Sam/Jack ship/friendship is aplenty, though strangely underplayed given that it’s the only other episode of the series featuring Za’tarc testing or mentioning the events of D&C in relation to Jack and Sam. It’s a lot like the force scene from The Sentinel underplaying its implications and connection to the force field scene in Upgrades/D&C. But first things first.

It’s interesting that in the episode that is very much about divides between people Sam and Jack are usually – all the time actually, except when Sam is off with her father and the funeral scene - standing and framed together, to stress their unity. And yes, it’s probably because of them both being Tau’ri, but if you want to read something more into it, who can stop you? In the teaser they are standing side by side, working together even while talking, with Jack asking questions and Sam offering explanations and answering Malek’s queries. And I adore the scene in which she informs him about Tok’ra objecting to their quarters, Jack kinda loses it for a second and she’s just standing there seemingly amused, waiting for him to pull himself together, which he does. And this little scene kinda shows her role: she’s diffusing tension, placating all sides but especially Jack, who always calms down when Sam intervenes, by offering her logical perspective and cold facts.

What I also find interesting, is that Jack orders Sam to be present during the young Jaffa (didn’t catch his name, sorry) testing but then they both seem uncomfortable with reminding anyone of their own history with Za’tarc technology. Sam sneaks a look at him when she mentions that the technology may give false readings and Jack offers a tight little smile and that’s it. On the one hand I can understand it: they are in the middle of very serious situation which may have interracial consequences and Jacob is present in the same room – not exactly ideal circumstances for a trip down memory lane. But otoh sometimes I wish there was something more.

Finally, there is their cute interaction in the woods, when Teal’c is choking Malek and Jack backs Jacob up only after a pointed glare from Sam, and then she’s all impatient when he cuts her explanation off with “that’s all I need”. I just love how comfortable they are together and how well they know each other.

[hedwig]

So I got a bit wordy...

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/m...allegiance.jpg
Banner by Josiane

Spoiler:

Synopsis: Fleeing from Anubis the Tok’ra led by Malek and Jacob arrive at the Alpha Site, where soon tensions rise between them and rebel Jaffa. Jack with help from Jacob and Bra’tac tries to maintain peace and avoid escalation of the conflict, but meanwhile people start to die, including, as it seems, Bra’tac. It turns out that the assassin possessing technology to make himself invisible, an Ashrak sent by Anubis, is responsible. Sam, Jacob and Malek come up with a way to make him visible and in the end he’s killed by not-so- dead-after-all Bra’tac, who then uses his death to unite the Jaffa, the Tok’ra and the Tau’ri..

Favourite line: Jack: I’m sure he’s sorry.
Jaffa: I’m not.
Jack: On the inside.

Favourite scene: argument after the funeral, including Sam’s news about the Tok’ra not liking their temporary quarters. The “we can make the invisible guy visible again” exchange.

Generally:

Season 6 is my favourite season of SG-1 and Allegiance is one of my favourite episodes of that season – it should give you some idea of how much I adore it. Before I proceed let me just have my moment of regret that Jonas had to “sit this one out” and a moment of glee at seeing Jacob and Bra’tac working together, in the same episode – and even being in the same frame – for the first time ever. As a fan of the Tok’ra and the Jaffa episodes I get a double treat here, made even sweeter by leader!Jack, Janet and other SGC personnel's presence.

The teaser’s one of my favourite ones in the series. It’s chaotic, people are running, Janet and her medic staff are saving lives, Jaffa and the SGC personnel are guarding the Gate, Jack’s overseeing everything and at first you don’t know what’s going on and where the heck are they? A little tense moment between the Jaffa and the Tok’ra over Za’tarc detectors is easy to dismiss as battle induced adrenaline surge and yet it foreshadows Jaffa/Tok’ra problems to come. And then with the arrival of Pierce and Jacob we finally start to get some answers. It’s the Alpha Site where the Rebel Jaffa and the Tok’ra seek refuge. And Jack seems to be in command; I’m not sure how does it work logistically, being in command of SG-1 and off-world base at the same time, but I love it and he’s damn good at it.

The funeral scene continues to show mounting tension between the Jaffa and the Tok’ra, offering us a glimpse into Tok’ra culture (and you know I’m a sucker for such stuff) and Jack’s leadership capabilities. Due to Kanan’s betrayal he suffered at Baal’s hands only 2 episodes earlier so his distrust, anger and possibly hatred for the Tok’ta are still fresh and yet he’s able to put them aside for the sake of his command and act as a peace keeper, not taking sides. However you can see his heart is clearly with the Jaffa and when pushed by Malek he slips and makes a barb about the Tok’ra not having much success in their fight. Interestingly, he immediately apologises, realizing that as the base CO he needs to set an example and can’t let his personal feelings dictate his actions, but he does allow himself a little honesty and luxury of venting his frustration to first Sam and then Jacob in The Talk – the only talk he’s ever had onscreen about his feelings and attitude towards the Tok’ra post-Kanan. It speaks volumes about the huge trust and faith he has in Jacob.

As the events unfold, people start to die and the hostility between the Tok’ra and the Jaffa escalates, Jack too starts to lose patience. Jacob was right saying that it’s all because of history (and I love how it is acknowledged and how neither side is painted as the bad guy; it really is all about overcoming thousands of years of history and not ill will) but understanding it doesn’t make the animosity magically disappear. I absolutely adore how Jack, Jacob and Bra’tac work together to keep things from escalating and how the older two defer to Jack’s leadership – how in fact everybody does. Note that in the scene when Teal’c’s choking Malek he lets go only after Jack backs Jacob up, meaning it. And it’s a trust well deserved, because really, Jack shines here. He shows himself, as I mentioned, as a great leader willing to put aside his own emotions and make hard decisions, he gets to be a smart tactician when he guesses the culprit would want to leave the crime scene and later when he sees the Ashrak’s ruse to draw people away from the gate for what it is, for once he doesn’t suck at diplomacy, is quick to apologise and acknowledge his own prejudicies and is unusually attuned to the people’s emotions (like when he lets Teal’c break the news about Bra’tac’s death). Heh, I’m totally fangurling his leadership skills in this ep.

Bra’tac and Jacob work together as well as can be expected, both of them being the oldest and wisest of their people, with unusually open minds and determination to keep their people together and focused on the common goal. I love how Jacob helps Bra’tac come up with a reasoning to convince the Jaffa to undergo Za’tarc testing. And yes, I’m talking about Jacob and not Selmak because even the Tok’ra talk to him and not his symbiote (when he’s shot in the teaser Malek cries “Jacob!”, not “Selmak!”)

I think Teal’c’s journey throughout the episode is really interesting, although very subtle because he’s not a major player here. He starts out as a peacekeeper like Jack and Bra’tac, during funeral stands with the Tau’ri (as a side note, I found it interesting that Jack wanted to know what was being said and didn’t wave off T’s translations like he usually did with Daniel’s), during that Jaffa-Tok’ra stand-off he tries to initially diffuse situation but when weapons get drown he joins the Jaffa and after Bra’tac’s alleged death he openly chooses Jaffa side. The end shot of the Jaffa during Bra’tac’s speech shows him with his people; Sam, Jack and Pierce standing in a separate Tau’ri group and the Tok’ra with Jacob in another group. I’m not sure what I think about it, just throwing it out here.

Then there’s Janet and Sam, often paired together which is always nice to see. I can’t think of any reason why Janet would be on the Alpha Site and not at the SGC, but having her here works.

I guess the weakest element of Allegiance is the plot itself. No matter how much I love the ep, I can’t help but roll my eyes at Bra’tac being dragged off into the bushes and then showing up at the very end to save the day with quite pompous speech because this one time Ashrak didn’t kill his victim, leaving him alive for reasons unknown (other than to let himself be killed later, that is). Malek’s paralysis at the crucial moment doesn’t help either. He’s the Tok’ra base commander, you’d think he’d have more of a backbone and courage (but I still adore his character).

Finally, there’s the scene with Jack and his Huge Honkin’ Gun. What I’m about to confess will probably cost me my membership in the Jack Fans’ Club, but…I’m not crazy about that scene. In the episode already filled with awesomeness that is Jack this is a little OTT, IMO. And for the life of my I can’t figure out why he draws his knife at the end instead of just shooting the damn thing.

Sam and Jack implications:

I didn’t write much about Sam in the General section because frankly her role is minimal. Sam/Jack ship/friendship is aplenty, though strangely underplayed given that it’s the only other episode of the series featuring Za’tarc testing or mentioning the events of D&C in relation to Jack and Sam. It’s a lot like the force scene from The Sentinel underplaying its implications and connection to the force field scene in Upgrades/D&C. But first things first.

It’s interesting that in the episode that is very much about divides between people Sam and Jack are usually – all the time actually, except when Sam is off with her father and the funeral scene - standing and framed together, to stress their unity. And yes, it’s probably because of them both being Tau’ri, but if you want to read something more into it, who can stop you? In the teaser they are standing side by side, working together even while talking, with Jack asking questions and Sam offering explanations and answering Malek’s queries. And I adore the scene in which she informs him about Tok’ra objecting to their quarters, Jack kinda loses it for a second and she’s just standing there seemingly amused, waiting for him to pull himself together, which he does. And this little scene kinda shows her role: she’s diffusing tension, placating all sides but especially Jack, who always calms down when Sam intervenes, by offering her logical perspective and cold facts.

What I also find interesting, is that Jack orders Sam to be present during the young Jaffa (didn’t catch his name, sorry) testing but then they both seem uncomfortable with reminding anyone of their own history with Za’tarc technology. Sam sneaks a look at him when she mentions that the technology may give false readings and Jack offers a tight little smile and that’s it. On the one hand I can understand it: they are in the middle of very serious situation which may have interracial consequences and Jacob is present in the same room – not exactly ideal circumstances for a trip down memory lane. But otoh sometimes I wish there was something more.

Finally, there is their cute interaction in the woods, when Teal’c is choking Malek and Jack backs Jacob up only after a pointed glare from Sam, and then she’s all impatient when he cuts her explanation off with “that’s all I need”. I just love how comfortable they are together and how well they know each other.

Sneaks in briefly to point out in the last paragraph to add the bit of that scene where Jack is blatantly checking Sam out right in front of Jacob just before she glares at him for cutting her off.

Sneaks back out (but planning to come back later) ...

[Rachel500]

Allegiance

Generally

I have so much love for this episode because:

(a) Jacob

(b) Bra'tac

(c) Jacob and Bra'tac together!!

Plus Jack really getting to show his leadership skills which is just very cool. Not to mention he looks hot. I will say though, as impressive as it is when Jack goes all Alpha!Jack and picks up the BIG gun, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever because as everyone hits the deck, well wouldn't you too if you were the Ashrak?? In an episode which otherwise showcases Jack's abilities, this really in hindsight is a puzzler. But, hey: he looked cool! And hot!

Sam and Jack

They do have some nice scenes but there are a couple of moments that standout.

One where they do reference the za'tarc results and both of them look suitably disturbed and awkward yet sympathetic.

And the second for me is how it is Sam who gets Jack to get Teal'c to stop with a look. In the exact same way she later gives him a look in Continuum to get him to pay for lunch. Jack reacts to Sam as though she already is his partner even back in Allegiance - which of course in his heart she is even if she isn't officially at that point in time.

[hlndncr]

Plus Jack really getting to show his leadership skills which is just very cool. Not to mention he looks hot. I will say though, as impressive as it is when Jack goes all Alpha!Jack and picks up the BIG gun, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever because as everyone hits the deck, well wouldn't you too if you were the Ashrak?? In an episode which otherwise showcases Jack's abilities, this really in hindsight is a puzzler. But, hey: he looked cool! And hot!

Amen and amen.

This ep and Paradise Lost are favorites if for no other reason than Jack's total hotness. The big honkin' gun is worth it just for a slo mo 360 of The (gorgeous) Man! *drools*

I will be back later with more serious comments (if I can get past the short in my brain whenever I think of Jack and his hotness in this ep ).

[josiane]

First up, fabulous review of Allegiance, Petra! I'm totally with you that this is a great episode for all the reasons that you have listed so well there - not sure there's really anything I can add much to that.

The funeral scene continues to show mounting tension between the Jaffa and the Tok’ra, offering us a glimpse into Tok’ra culture (and you know I’m a sucker for such stuff) and Jack’s leadership capabilities. Due to Kanan’s betrayal he suffered at Baal’s hands only 2 episodes earlier so his distrust, anger and possibly hatred for the Tok’ta are still fresh and yet he’s able to put them aside for the sake of his command and act as a peace keeper, not taking sides. However you can see his heart is clearly with the Jaffa and when pushed by Malek he slips and makes a barb about the Tok’ra not having much success in their fight. Interestingly, he immediately apologises, realizing that as the base CO he needs to set an example and can’t let his personal feelings dictate his actions, but he does allow himself a little honesty and luxury of venting his frustration to first Sam and then Jacob in The Talk – the only talk he’s ever had onscreen about his feelings and attitude towards the Tok’ra post-Kanan. It speaks volumes about the huge trust and faith he has in Jacob.

That's a really nice point

Finally, there’s the scene with Jack and his Huge Honkin’ Gun. What I’m about to confess will probably cost me my membership in the Jack Fans’ Club, but…I’m not crazy about that scene. In the episode already filled with awesomeness that is Jack this is a little OTT, IMO. And for the life of my I can’t figure out why he draws his knife at the end instead of just shooting the damn thing.

Yeah, there's not really much point there, tis true, but I do so love it

Sam and Jack implications:

I didn’t write much about Sam in the General section because frankly her role is minimal. Sam/Jack ship/friendship is aplenty, though strangely underplayed given that it’s the only other episode of the series featuring Za’tarc testing or mentioning the events of D&C in relation to Jack and Sam. It’s a lot like the force scene from The Sentinel underplaying its implications and connection to the force field scene in Upgrades/D&C. But first things first.

I do like the very tiny acknowledgement that we get though - as Rachel says, the way they look right after the "we've seen it before" line.

It’s interesting that in the episode that is very much about divides between people Sam and Jack are usually – all the time actually, except when Sam is off with her father and the funeral scene - standing and framed together, to stress their unity. And yes, it’s probably because of them both being Tau’ri, but if you want to read something more into it, who can stop you? In the teaser they are standing side by side, working together even while talking, with Jack asking questions and Sam offering explanations and answering Malek’s queries. And I adore the scene in which she informs him about Tok’ra objecting to their quarters, Jack kinda loses it for a second and she’s just standing there seemingly amused, waiting for him to pull himself together, which he does. And this little scene kinda shows her role: she’s diffusing tension, placating all sides but especially Jack, who always calms down when Sam intervenes, by offering her logical perspective and cold facts.

I always see this as Sam's role in this episode, she's very much supporting Jack. Everyone else has allegiances (heh) elsewhere - Teal'c with the Jaffa and Jacob with the Tok'ra - and Janet is occupied elsewhere, so Sam really acts as Jack's support. This may just be my shippy interpretation, but I tend to think that Jack would have struggled a lot more in this episode without her there. His leadership skills are great, but he's always a little less fabulous on the diplomatic skills front, tbh Sam here very much keeps him grounded, IMO.

What I also find interesting, is that Jack orders Sam to be present during the young Jaffa (didn’t catch his name, sorry) testing but then they both seem uncomfortable with reminding anyone of their own history with Za’tarc technology. Sam sneaks a look at him when she mentions that the technology may give false readings and Jack offers a tight little smile and that’s it. On the one hand I can understand it: they are in the middle of very serious situation which may have interracial consequences and Jacob is present in the same room – not exactly ideal circumstances for a trip down memory lane. But otoh sometimes I wish there was something more.

Yes, exactly

Finally, there is their cute interaction in the woods, when Teal’c is choking Malek and Jack backs Jacob up only after a pointed glare from Sam, and then she’s all impatient when he cuts her explanation off with “that’s all I need”. I just love how comfortable they are together and how well they know each other.

I love this too And the checking out thing that hedwig mentioned

And the second for me is how it is Sam who gets Jack to get Teal'c to stop with a look. In the exact same way she later gives him a look in Continuum to get him to pay for lunch. Jack reacts to Sam as though she already is his partner even back in Allegiance - which of course in his heart she is even if she isn't officially at that point in time.

Yeah I was going to draw this parallel too It's a very 'coupley' moment, and is one of the things that gives me that general feeling of how Sam is grounding and supporting Jack throughout this episode as I mentioned above.

[Cagranosalis]

Amen and amen.

This ep and Paradise Lost are favorites if for no other reason than Jack's total hotness. The big honkin' gun is worth it just for a slo mo 360 of The (gorgeous) Man! *drools*

I will be back later with more serious comments (if I can get past the short in my brain whenever I think of Jack and his hotness in this ep ).

On the bolded... yeah, that. I'm sure it's a great epsiode but ... that. I really can't remember much beyond the gun.

*ahem*

Seriously now, great review Petra. No the gun scene is complete thunk-for-thunk's-sake but it's still gorgeous! I'm not kicking you out the Jack Thunkers club just yet. I do believe TPTB saw how good RDA was looking during this season and thought they just had to showcase that.
Good point that this episode plot is somewhat rubbish when you strip away the dressing but it's such a good example of how even the most blah of stories can be made into something special if done right. Essentially it's an exercise in showing the disparity between the two main allies of the SGC in the fight against the goa'uld, and how this can be overcome for the greater good. Except, later, we find out it can't. Not so much anyway. Oh well.

I have nothing else to add to your excellent post that hasn't already been said.