S5: Critique and Contemplations

[Southern Red]

this is why that although I have the set (got at a very very deep discount...not paying full price for that crud!) I refuse to watch the extras. MG is everywhere and the man is just too icky for me!

If that's how you feel, stay far far away from the Brainstorm extras and commentary. If you're looking for the good parts, the special on Michael is great. Connor really appreciates the fans. And of course I can't say enough about anything involving Vegas.

[ponycake]

MG's has written some very good scripts, but I think he is particularly good at talking himself up. Since Brainstorm had, shall we say, a mixed reaction in fandom, and because of his heavy investment in the McKeller romance, I would be interested to hear what he had to say, if just to play amateur psychiatrist.

On another note, it doesn't surprise me in the least to hear that TPTB promised more Teyla while we ended up with less - what's told and what's shown doesn't always add up in the stargateverse. Not that I'm cynical or anything. *coughs*

[A_PophisandhisFran]

I'm still in one piece...sorta, but I was ready for a straight-jacket after Irresistable. Lucius drove me to the edge.

*****But anyway...

I disagree on the necessity of secondary characters. In Atlantis they are important because it's not just about Colonel Sheppard's team. It starts out as being about the expedition going to the city of the Ancients, and thus secondary characters round off the whole and create a sense of reality. There really is an expedition with all these people (scientists, military, medical, technical, ...) and they come from all around the globe (or close to). They don't have to be around all the time, but in a way they complement the main characters. They fill holes in a story, and shouldn't be treated like neglictable material because they're most certainly not in my opinion. They're an essential part.

Oh yes of course, I agree that there needs to be secondary characters, I worded myself badly again. What I was trying to say was that not many people are going to be turning off the show if specific secondary characters don't get screentime in a specific episode or in a season. Yeah, Chuck adds to the show, but not many people are going to turn the show off if he doesn't get shown. As much as most of us love Zelenka, most of us are ok with it if there are 2 or 3 episodes in a row without him.

I just watched Whispers... ouch, definately the worst of the season so far. I've never been a fan of horror, and it seemed weird to not include most of the team in the episode. The all-female team was... I don't know, I know what they were going for I suppose but it still seemed a little off. I didn't hate it mind you, I thought it was "ok", but I definately wouldn't want too many episodes like this in a season.

[Skydiver]

to be fair guys, as to rachel's time in season 5. she was pregnant, she had to leave the show 'early' so to speak because she had her child. and her pregnancy adn reduced availability no doubt effected her storyline for s5

[Skydiver]

ok, what episode are we up to now?

let's see if we cn get some organized discussion going instead of random tangents

[ponycake]

to be fair guys, as to rachel's time in season 5. she was pregnant, she had to leave the show 'early' so to speak because she had her child. and her pregnancy adn reduced availability no doubt effected her storyline for s5

Is that fanon, or has Luttrell actually said something to this effect? I only say this because I hear this repeated all the time in fandom, but I've never seen any official statement along those lines. And not to undersell the rigours of pregnancy and dealing with a new baby (and not knowing RL's personal circumstances) I have known enough women who have gone back into the workplace soon after - it's not as if she was battling a horrible long strung out affliction that caused her to need to be largely absent from work for a year.

There is obviously an unavoidable biological double standard, but there also seems to be an inbuilt social double standard - Hewlett and Mamoa were new parents around that time too - I certainly don't remember McKay getting less lines.

[Skydiver]

what i definitely remember is that there was a day taping one episode and - maybe it was a blog entry of joe's - where he had a pic of a very pregnant rachel and that 'this was her last day filming' and that they'd finish the rest of the season without her

she wasn't there for all of it, just like amanda wasn't there for all of the end of s8 (like full alert, all she did was run a fax machine because she had a dr's appt so they cut her scene short) and she missed the first 6 of s9 since she had her baby in march - after they started filming.

I also know, in continuum, qetesh's role was diminished a bit because claudia was under doctor's orders to limit her on set time

Days on the set can often run 12-14 hours or longer, which is dang hard to do when you're 9 months pregnant.

I don't know all the details, nor is it totally any of our business, but i do know for a fact that rachel's time on the set was shorter than others because she finished before they did to start her maternity leave

[ponycake]

I might be wrong on my timeline but didn't RL have the baby at the end of Season Four well before Season Five started filming where she ended up clocking up the least amount of lines - if the stats are correct the pregnancy itself can't necessarily be blamed then on why Teyla's screentime was reduced so much over Season Four AND Five. I suspect that was more of a creative decision on the writers part than bourne (haha) out of necessity.

[fumblesmcstupid]

My daughters b-day is the day after Baz, David's son, Rachel had Caden 2 weeks after Baz and that was in October.

I think that they started shooting for season 5 in March...so that is Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, March almost 6 months that Rachel had to deal with a newborn.

Now last time I looked it takes TWO to make a baby and Lloyd, Rachel's hubby has as much as responsibility as Jane, Katherine and Lisa do with in raising their children with Joe, David and Jason!

So Rachel just had a baby.....is well a lame excuse as to why she was whittled down in arcs and dialog

[Irish Eyes]

I'm still in one piece...sorta, but I was ready for a straight-jacket after Irresistable. Lucius drove me to the edge.

*****But anyway...

I disagree on the necessity of secondary characters. In Atlantis they are important because it's not just about Colonel Sheppard's team. It starts out as being about the expedition going to the city of the Ancients, and thus secondary characters round off the whole and create a sense of reality. There really is an expedition with all these people (scientists, military, medical, technical, ...) and they come from all around the globe (or close to). They don't have to be around all the time, but in a way they complement the main characters. They fill holes in a story, and shouldn't be treated like neglictable material because they're most certainly not in my opinion. They're an essential part.

Darlin', you just summed up what I loved about this show when it started. Too bad they veered away from this. I liked the team eps, but loved the eps that had the entire expedition involved. In season 5, I suppose I would consider S & R and The Shrine as expedition eps. Not sure there are any more. Team eps suffered as well since they kept splitting them up and then half the team usually disappeared for the rest of the episode.

[Stormtrooper]

So Rachel just had a baby.....is well a lame excuse as to why she was whittled down in arcs and dialog

Would JS/Keller be sidelined in similar circumstances? I'm not so sure.

[slurredspeech]

So Rachel just had a baby.....is well a lame excuse as to why she was whittled down in arcs and dialog

I honestly haven't read the interviews and such regarding this topic so I'm writing purely hypothetical here, but. Rachel might have very well prefered it that way, really there's no telling. Just because one mother will go back to normal hours the next week after having a baby doesn't mean the other will feel as ready or, well, able perhaps.

That said, there certainly are ways to make character vital for the story even with limited hours. The writers were just lazy and thought that having Teyla stay behind and babysit the city or the kid was good enough.

[Skydiver]

that is a very valid point. rachel may have wanted/needed time off.

My point is, to play the devil's advocate, rachel's/teyla's lessened time in season 5 just MIGHT have been a grand conspiracy by the writers to sideline her and promote Jewel. And it's just as likely to have been the result of an actress negotiating less time and shorter days on the set so she could spend time with her son.

We don't know and likely never will. So, in situations where there is no absolute answer, we should all remember that there's likely more to the story than meets the eye and move onto other things.

[maxbo]

I don't believe Rachel wanted time off in Season 5 for two reasons - first, because none of the writers ever mentioned this, despite repeated criticisms that they had sidelined Teyla more in Season 5 than in Season 4, when Rachel was pregnant, and, second, because Rachel never mentioned requesting or wanting time off.

IMO, if Rachel had requested a reduced Season 5 schedule, then from what I've read of Mallozzi and Co., they would have quickly and repeatedly made that known. Because, not only would that have let them off the hook, but it would have also deflected some of the criticism that they took away some of Teyla's screentime to make way for Keller and McKeller.

[Jonas43]

By now many have the season five set and I'm one that does like to listen to the commentary of each episode.Very disappointed that most of the actors were not on it if any at all.And this is a day late and a dollar short but most of us do not care about the tech jargon that it took to film it.Am I the only one out there that feels the same way?Having the actor(s)and director comment for the episode add to it.Maybe MGM did'nt want to pay extra for it or was rushing the production of it.