More Wraith character development

[Platschu]

Some unanswered Wraith related queston:

1. What do they think about the Iratus bugs and the Unas type Wraiths (see Elia or transformed Sheppard)?

2. How, where and how long did the Wraith evolution begin?

3. What society do the Wraith have? Are there different classes?

4. How could they build hives?

5. Do they believe in ascension or God or whatever?

6. Why do they need human followers and worshipers?

etc.

[Scyld]

Those who have a choice and still choose to kill an innocent person cannot be forgiven.
I do not claim that the Wraith are innocent but we have no right to wipe out an entire race only because of its eating habits. We're not gods...

Icarium

I dunno, I feel pretty godlike.

Seriously, I don't understand the dilemma here. They eat us. They have no other food source. Therefore, they must be destroyed. Carthago delenda est, as it were. It's not about whether they are evil or not. They could be fine, upstanding and moral creatures, but they still eat people. They could be downright philosophical about it, but they still eat us.

Lacking large amounts of Applied Phlebotinium or some convenient Green Rocks, we therefore have two options:
1 - Allow them to continue to eat people
2 - Destroy them

I pick option number two.

[dasNdanger]

I dunno, I feel pretty godlike.

That explains a lot.

Seriously, I don't understand the dilemma here. They eat us. They have no other food source. Therefore, they must be destroyed. Carthago delenda est, as it were. It's not about whether they are evil or not. They could be fine, upstanding and moral creatures, but they still eat people. They could be downright philosophical about it, but they still eat us.

Lacking large amounts of Applied Phlebotinium or some convenient Green Rocks, we therefore have two options:
1 - Allow them to continue to eat people
2 - Destroy them

I pick option number two.

So - finding a way for the Wraith to metabolize normal food is NOT an option? I think it is the BEST option...and if humans devote their lives to find cures for cancer, and AIDS, and other life-threatening problems, why not spend their lives finding a way for the Wraith to eat normal food, and thus save BOTH species?

das

[Icarium]

Lacking large amounts of Applied Phlebotinium or some convenient Green Rocks, we therefore have two options:
1 - Allow them to continue to eat people
2 - Destroy them

When you have two options, choose a third one. There must be another way... We don't want the show to be predictable, do we?

Icarium

[Scyld]

So - finding a way for the Wraith to metabolize normal food is NOT an option? I think it is the BEST option...and if humans devote their lives to find cures for cancer, and AIDS, and other life-threatening problems, why not spend their lives finding a way for the Wraith to eat normal food, and thus save BOTH species?

das

Such a solution is beyond the bounds of possibility, again, lacking a convenient plot device. You can't just swoop in and alter the essential nature of a species without inverted tachyon beams, maybe a multi-phagic retrovirus or two, a neutrino pulse-wave (double points if at some point the characters are required to reverse its polarity), and, of course, a rerouting of the flux capacitor through the forward deflector array.

Furthermore, it is somewhat amusing to note that the Wraith themselves would likely be offended at the very thought of the human-cattle trying to 'domesticate' them. O_o

[WereWraith06]

Wraith must kill us to live. How often? Well, we don't know exactly. We've seen them go months without food, but it appears they like to feed more often than that. Still, for the sake of this illustration, let's assume that they need to feed at least once per month. This means that every year a wraith lives requires that it kill twelve of us unless it is in hibernation. How many years has it been since the Ancients left the Pegasus Galaxy? Ten thousand or so? If this is the case, then using the 'one feeding per month' projection, each of those watchers who were left awake to tend to those that slept required the deaths of 120,000 human beings in order to continue their lives. Given another 10,000 years, and each of those Wraith, if they are not otherwise killed, will take another 120,000 human lives. Kill that Wraith now, and those are 120,000 people it won't be able to murder over the course of the next 10,000 years.

120,000 for 1 Wraith over 1,000 years???? When you think about it, it isn't really that much..... It's a small protion of the millions of people that have lived on each of the ?100s? of Planets in the PG.

I'm going to have to side with Scyld on this.

[Scyld]

Again, I am not claiming that the Wraith are evil, nor do I make any claim to hate them. I simply recognize that it is foolish for a prey-animal to actively sympathize with the thing that wants to eat it. Even if that prey-animal is one of those strange, godlike animals that we call 'sentient.'

[dasNdanger]

Such a solution is beyond the bounds of possibility, again, lacking a convenient plot device. You can't just swoop in and alter the essential nature of a species without inverted tachyon beams, maybe a multi-phagic retrovirus or two, a neutrino pulse-wave (double points if at some point the characters are required to reverse its polarity), and, of course, a rerouting of the flux capacitor through the forward deflector array.

Furthermore, it is somewhat amusing to note that the Wraith themselves would likely be offended at the very thought of the human-cattle trying to 'domesticate' them. O_o

This IS fiction, right? ANYTHING is possible.

I would not want to see the Wraith altered in any way except to give them the ability to eat - and gain nourishment from - normal food.

This is not beyond the realm of possibilities, because they can eat normal food as children. Something changes in them at puberty - just like a diabetic's body stops being able to metabolize sugar. This indicates that there IS a medical solution to the Wraith's dietary needs.

And yes, the Wraith may not like the alternative. That's why such a solution would be perfect. Some Wraith choose the new way, and survive on normal food. They do not, however, lose their craving for humans, just like an alcoholic craves a drink, or an addict craves a fix. But these Wraith decide to suppress that desire because living at peace with humans is important to them.

On the other hand, some Wraith refuse to eat normal food, and continue to feed on humans. This way, people like you can have your Wraith worth killing, and people like me can have my Wraith worth saving.

And then we'd all be happy.

But the bottom line is this - Wraith can eat regular food as children, but for some reason their bodies stop absorbing nutrition from it. So, there is a possibility for the writers to use that little 'fact', and work their sci fi psuedo science magic to discover why they stop getting nutrition from regular food, and find a 'cure'.

VERY simple to do, and certainly the less bloodthirsty compared to your two options.


das

[dasNdanger]

Again, I am not claiming that the Wraith are evil, nor do I make any claim to hate them. I simply recognize that it is foolish for a prey-animal to actively sympathize with the thing that wants to eat it. Even if that prey-animal is one of those strange, godlike animals that we call 'sentient.'

So, the idea of finding an alternative food source doesn't work for you? The only option is death?

I have great sympathy for these characters. But then again, I have sympathy for anyone - or anything - that is starving. For a fellow human, or an animal, I would try to feed it. For the Wraith, if something like that existed in the real world, I would want scientists to find a way to solve their food source problem. That would be the best option for me. Not just killing an entire species without trying first to find an alternative.


das

[Jumper_One]

from JM's blog

Rachel writes: “Todd is my best friend’s absolute favorite character (he’s a close second to McKay for me); will we be seeing him again at all in Season 5?”

Answer: Yes, Todd will be making an appearance in season 5.

[Guest]

from JM's blog

Rachel writes: “Todd is my best friend’s absolute favorite character (he’s a close second to McKay for me); will we be seeing him again at all in Season 5?”

Answer: Yes, Todd will be making an appearance in season 5.

Fantastic stuff

[dasNdanger]

Let's hope it's more than 'an' appearance...but SEVERAL appearances. If he's in The Last Man, as is assumed, then we can assume he's also in the season opener...which may be the episode he gets killed in. So, yeah - he'd be in S5 - but barely.

I just hope they keep him around for a long while. Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing James Lafazanos come back as a Wraith - that man simply NAILED the Wraith he portrayed. Very good in this role - with his little mouth and eye expressions that really made the characters come to life. Loved his work.

das

[ciannwn]

Crimes can be forgiven. Nature cannot.

If you're going to bring Nature into it you've got to accept that from a 'natural perspective' there's nothing special about us. We're animals and we're edible. The end.

Seeing as TPTB designed the Wraith to be an intelligent species with technology and a society it would be very interesting to learn more about these aliens. Presenting them as nothing more than targets in black trenchcoats is on the lines of having the bug-form Replicators in SG1. Watching Ronon dispose of them with his magic gun gets really boring. I might as well go to one of the arcades on the sea front and watch someone playing a shoot 'em up video game.

[garhkal]

The most logical thing is to find a 'cure'. Humans have tried - but maybe they need to work WITH the Wraith, instead of against them, to find the ultimate cure.


das

Now that would make a sweet three to 6 episode arc. Especially if either Michael (not likely), Todd (very possible) or that wraith from condemmed (could work) were to propose it.

Oh, that makes absolutely no sense at all. A murderer has a CHOICE - he can choose to kill, or not to. Wraith have NO CHOICE...they have no control over their nature. I can easily forgive Wraith for what they are, much more than I can forgive a cold-blooded murderer who kills simply for the sake of killing.

Same here. A murderer is imo far worse than a wraith as NO murder is necessary.

The Murderer has a choice, and can also choose otherwise. A Wraith cannot choose to do otherwise, and therefore cannot be forgiven; it is not a matter of forgiveness at all, but of survival. There is no moral component to a Wraith's actions.

I will give you that part. Especially since we have seen how some wraith lavish the joy when they feed.

5. Do they believe in ascension or God or whatever?

I would actually love to know the answer to this one..

Furthermore, it is somewhat amusing to note that the Wraith themselves would likely be offended at the very thought of the human-cattle trying to 'domesticate' them. O_o

True dat. See what happened with Michael.

120,000 for 1 Wraith over 1,000 years????When you think about it, it isn't really that much..... It's a small protion of the millions of people that have lived on each of the ?100s? of Planets in the PG.

True.. And when you take into account we have killed a heck of a lot more fellow humans than that just this years with all the violence we have here on earth, it is strange we are saying kill the wraith cause they kill us..

If you're going to bring Nature into it you've got to accept that from a 'natural perspective' there's nothing special about us. We're animals and we're edible. The end.

Very true. but i can easily see why some advocate killing anything that preys on us humans.. Speciesism. Where they favor humans over anything else.

[ciannwn]

Very true. but i can easily see why some advocate killing anything that preys on us humans.. Speciesism. Where they favor humans over anything else.

Speciesism brings about some very lopsided thinking on the lines of "Nature gives humans the right to kill Wraith in order to survive because Wraith have no right to feed on humans. It's OK for humans to eat cows, sheep and pigs, though, because these creatures are 'inferior' to us so don't count".

The 'Selfish Gene' idea shows the Pegasus galaxy situation in a different light. Human genes had human bodies as survival machines and Iratus bug genes had Iratus bug bodies. The two sets of genes met up and evolved a shared survival machine between them - the Wraith. If Wraith were genetically altered to eat normal food, both human and bug genes would have a survival machine which is vastly superior to their original models. At the moment, the big drawback to their shared machine is vulnerability due to an over specialised diet.

PS: From 'The Selfish Gene' -

http://www.rubinghscience.org/memeti...kinsmemes.html

Fundamentally, the reason why it is good policy for us to try to explain biological phemomena in terms of gene advantage is that genes are replicators. As soon as the primeval soup provided conditions in which molecules could make copies of themselves, the replicators themselves took over.