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**nogigglingmajor** · 03 May 2007, 11:30 PM

Just a cute little fic I found. http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3521424/1/

**dana** · 03 May 2007, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by SazZat View Post

*huge snip*
So, it's likely we'll still get things like that and JM will still not see it as Ship, but really it is ship. JM just has this more obvious version of what ship is...His sort of ship is obvious stuff like Sam and Pete.

Anyway, morning everyone

Morning! And I agree, Saz! As for the bolded part....EWWWWWWWWW.

Just a cute little fic I found. http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3521424/1/

Hee, I read it half an hour ago.

And while we are at fic recs, I encourage everyone to read The sound of color if you haven't read that already.

**Celcool** · 03 May 2007, 11:38 PM

Saz, that would be true if Torri wasn't recurring, just the amount of time we'll see her on the show will influence the ship. Not sure we can say that all will be the same as in the previous 3 seasons because the recurring status is a big change, especially if the number of episodes she's gonna appear in is as low as it is at the moment. Otherwise I'd totally agree with you.

About what I said earlier, that JM doesn't make any sense, one time he's saying fans don't have any influence and the other that they do. Now I understand what he means, when they hear something from fans that they don't want, then they ignore but when they like something, they do it for themselves anyway so... I don't see how fans influence the show in any way really. They "influence" only when what fans want suits them. For example, they supported the Save SG-1 campaign, naturally, but they don't let the fans of Carson or Elizabeth campaigns influence much (we have yet to see about that). Sure Carson will be back but it's obvious they intended that to happen anyway, he even said it on his blog. Now I'm curious if what Carson fans are planning in LA after Sunday is aired in USA, will bring Carson back full time. This will show if their campaign is really taken as seriously as it seems it is by tptb, if they have any say in Carson's fate at all.

Sorry for OT.

Now back to Sparky. Aren't they pretty?

Spoiler:

**nogigglingmajor** · 03 May 2007, 11:39 PM

Did the quiz and I got...

I'm glad cause that is my favourite moment so far. It's so cute, like tow teenagers who just discovered that they like the other. John given her a resent is like the first 'thing' between them. I can't really explain it...it's just beautiful. Ok i know, has anyone here seen My Girl? Well this scene reminds me of the same 'specialness' that Tom's ring has to Vada. How she always wears it.

**Celcool** · 04 May 2007, 01:12 AM

Originally posted by SazZat View Post

Anyway where is that interview from?

Oops, missed this before. Go here to download it.

http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=43653

It's interesting

Spoiler:

Spoilers tags for OT.

**Anuna** · 04 May 2007, 01:53 AM

Those focus groups still bother me. Why doing them if you don't want to knowwaht people would like to see? And if viewers like something that kinda influences how popular the show is, and I believe that in this money driven world it's pretty important that a large show like SGA has / and keeps it's fans / audience. I'm sitll puzzled about who exactly doesn't agree about certain focus groups results. Producers? Writers? Sci Fi people?? Hmmm.

Anyway, i'm feeling cranky, it's ugly weather putside and I'm at work. I won't be seeing you a lot this weekend bc my mum comes to visit. I hope nice and cute new fics come up and all of you guys have fun, and not just this S4 flavoured discussion... I know we can0t avoid it, but let's try being positive and having fun. That'swhat TV shows and ship should be about, and just like Lizabeth said, if we don't like something, then we just stop watching. Simple as that.

**dana** · 04 May 2007, 01:56 AM

Took the test...

Spoiler:

*giggles*

**peterl** · 04 May 2007, 03:24 AM

Originally posted by Celcool View Post

Saz, that would be true if Torri wasn't recurring, just the amount of time we'll see her on the show will influence the ship. Not sure we can say that all will be the same as in the previous 3 seasons because the recurring status is a big change, especially if the number of episodes she's gonna appear in is as low as it is at the moment. Otherwise I'd totally agree with you.

About what I said earlier, that JM doesn't make any sense, one time he's saying fans don't have any influence and the other that they do. Now I understand what he means, when they hear something from fans that they don't want, then they ignore but when they like something, they do it for themselves anyway so... I don't see how fans influence the show in any way really. They "influence" only when what fans want suits them. For example, they supported the Save SG-1 campaign, naturally, but they don't let the fans of Carson or Elizabeth campaigns influence much (we have yet to see about that). Sure Carson will be back but it's obvious they intended that to happen anyway, he even said it on his blog. Now I'm curious if what Carson fans are planning in LA after Sunday is aired in USA, will bring Carson back full time. This will show if their campaign is really taken as seriously as it seems it is by tptb, if they have any say in Carson's fate at all.

Sorry for OT.

Now back to Sparky. Aren't they pretty?

Spoiler:

As I have said before I think the shows producers egos get in the way.They don't want to listen to fans in case they their opinions clash with the TPTB's own.

**Southern Red** · 04 May 2007, 04:38 AM

I felt the need to comment on JM's blog about his interview and the comments regarding Sparky. He seems to think that shippers want all ship, all the time. I told him that we like the way things have been going and want it to continue. Oh, and expressed pleasure that he now acknowledges us.

But I don't think anything at this point will change anything else because they seem to be like concrete...all mixed up and set.

Took the quiz. Got that scene from Echoes. *smiles*

**SazZat** · 04 May 2007, 05:03 AM

Spoiler:

spoilers for s4

Spoiler:

Originally posted by dana View Post

Took the test...

Spoiler:

*giggles*

*giggles also* awww.

Originally posted by peterl View Post

As I have said before I think the shows producers egos get in the way.They don't want to listen to fans in case they their opinions clash with the TPTB's own.

spoiler for OT reply

Spoiler:

I think it's more problematic than that. For a start if they listened to the majority of fans then it would mean we would get no ship at all because the anti-shippers out number the shippers.

If they listen to one fan group then another will get upset. They'll always be someone who isn't happy. For every person who doesn't like a decision, they'll be people who support it. In terms of ship, this is why I think SG has stayed pretty much well away from it appart from the subtle friendship/ship/i care for you sort of moments. Or when they have done ship it has been in an alternate time line/reality format so it has no effect on the real characters and plot.

It's unfair to the minority if the larger part of a fanbase gets what they want. Plus, shippers never see the bigger picture. We see our ship. We don't normally see beyond the ship and what effects it will have on the overall plot.

Ther pinions are always going to clash with the fans, whatever they do. Say they did decide to do the Jack/Sam ship because it's the majority ship. Those shippers would be happy. What about the Sam/Daniel shippers and the Sam/Vala slashers? Would they just be told to just deal with it because they are the minority and so their opinion is less important?

They'll always be people who clash with their opinions. So it's probably for the best that they stay relatively away from the fans opinion of ships in particular because it is dangerous waters...and it's not even a big part of the show. Sure fair enough listen to the fans when it comes to the sci-fi aspect of the show, but ships just isn't important. Most shippers ship for fun really anyway. I think some people forget that sometime.

I don't know. As a fan of Stargate from the beginning, I know they'll never be proper ship. I just take what I can get and learn to enjoy the subtlety. Sometimes it's about compromise as well. It's selfish for us to expect TPTB to do what we want because we are the dominating fan ship of Atlantis, because what would that mean to the fans of the other ships? Just because there are less people who support it doesn't mean that their opinion of what they see is any less there.

I don't know. I guess what I'm trying to say is that there are lots of sections of fandoms and they can't all be happy at once. Decisions sometimes have to be made. We all don't like the obvious one that has been made, but if people want to try and change it then that is fine. Go for it. There is nothing wrong with that. But we can't just go around saying 'PTB don't listen to the fans and that is a bad thing' because really the decisions they've made probably would have been no different if they had just listened to the fans because there are also fans who agreed for the decision to be made.
We can't think so selfishly in our own area of fandom. We are entitled to dislike decisions that are made and we are entitled to try and campaign to get them changed, but we're not really in the position to judge how TPTB run the show. All they can do is keep it as well rounded and multi-fandom friendly as possible, and that is no mean feat.

Anyway. This discussion about TPTB and focus groups is OT for this thread and there is probably somewhere better to discuss it.

So back to Sparky:
pic spam...pics from ToR

Spoiler:

**dana** · 04 May 2007, 06:30 AM

Originally posted by SazZat View Post

E: And what has made you think that you are pretty?

*ded*

His reaction:

Spoiler:

**Pocus** · 04 May 2007, 08:11 AM

Originally posted by SazZat View Post

spoilers for s4

Spoiler:

*giggles also* awww.

spoiler for OT reply

Spoiler:

I think it's more problematic than that. For a start if they listened to the majority of fans then it would mean we would get no ship at all because the anti-shippers out number the shippers.

If they listen to one fan group then another will get upset. They'll always be someone who isn't happy. For every person who doesn't like a decision, they'll be people who support it. In terms of ship, this is why I think SG has stayed pretty much well away from it appart from the subtle friendship/ship/i care for you sort of moments. Or when they have done ship it has been in an alternate time line/reality format so it has no effect on the real characters and plot.

It's unfair to the minority if the larger part of a fanbase gets what they want. Plus, shippers never see the bigger picture. We see our ship. We don't normally see beyond the ship and what effects it will have on the overall plot.

Ther pinions are always going to clash with the fans, whatever they do. Say they did decide to do the Jack/Sam ship because it's the majority ship. Those shippers would be happy. What about the Sam/Daniel shippers and the Sam/Vala slashers? Would they just be told to just deal with it because they are the minority and so their opinion is less important?

They'll always be people who clash with their opinions. So it's probably for the best that they stay relatively away from the fans opinion of ships in particular because it is dangerous waters...and it's not even a big part of the show. Sure fair enough listen to the fans when it comes to the sci-fi aspect of the show, but ships just isn't important. Most shippers ship for fun really anyway. I think some people forget that sometime.

I don't know. As a fan of Stargate from the beginning, I know they'll never be proper ship. I just take what I can get and learn to enjoy the subtlety. Sometimes it's about compromise as well. It's selfish for us to expect TPTB to do what we want because we are the dominating fan ship of Atlantis, because what would that mean to the fans of the other ships? Just because there are less people who support it doesn't mean that their opinion of what they see is any less there.

I don't know. I guess what I'm trying to say is that there are lots of sections of fandoms and they can't all be happy at once. Decisions sometimes have to be made. We all don't like the obvious one that has been made, but if people want to try and change it then that is fine. Go for it. There is nothing wrong with that. But we can't just go around saying 'PTB don't listen to the fans and that is a bad thing' because really the decisions they've made probably would have been no different if they had just listened to the fans because there are also fans who agreed for the decision to be made.
We can't think so selfishly in our own area of fandom. We are entitled to dislike decisions that are made and we are entitled to try and campaign to get them changed, but we're not really in the position to judge how TPTB run the show. All they can do is keep it as well rounded and multi-fandom friendly as possible, and that is no mean feat.

Anyway. This discussion about TPTB and focus groups is OT for this thread and there is probably somewhere better to discuss it.

So back to Sparky:
pic spam...pics from ToR

Spoiler:

I must say that you have put into words my exact thoughts on the TPTB and fandom and ship and lots of other little things. Thanks for that!

**Anuna** · 04 May 2007, 09:32 AM

Just a short comment. unlike Saz's mom, mine doesn't watch any sci fi shows I watch. She saw a wallpaper on my desktop today (it's Sparky of course, and Saz is the author); and her first comment on John/JF was "Wow, he looks like Richard Gere!" Gotta love my mom, she sees things I usually don't

I wonder what she would say if she watched certain episodes, like "Before I sleep". Bet she would become a shipper

EDIT - my next anaylisi will be from "Before i sleep", but I can't do it right now

Just watched that... OMG what a beautiful episode.

**SazZat** · 04 May 2007, 10:39 AM

*squee* Before I Sleep is an amazing episode

I so love it. Can't wait for your analysis.
I watched it again a few nights ago..I had forgotten how angsty it was and I actually teared up over it

but in my defence I was in a very hormonal mood at the time, so it couldn't be helped.
That is one of my favourite episodes though of season 1 *fangirls*

**A.L.** · 04 May 2007, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by Anuna View Post

Those focus groups still bother me. Why doing them if you don't want to knowwaht people would like to see? And if viewers like something that kinda influences how popular the show is, and I believe that in this money driven world it's pretty important that a large show like SGA has / and keeps it's fans / audience. I'm sitll puzzled about who exactly doesn't agree about certain focus groups results. Producers? Writers? Sci Fi people?? Hmmm.

JM seems like a "creative" kind of guy where as focus groups would be more of a "business" type concern. Hold focus groups to see if the show is working for the fans and if it's worth keeping on the air.

I think he's offering mix messages as well but I think we all do that sometimes. I don't like it but I understand it. I wouldn't mind seeing Sparky on a date and yet I get the feeling it would come off wierd if we try. I'd settle for the "declarations" made in the show about Jack/Sam. They've never been out and they've never said they're in love with each other but they had their moments with each other as well as with others that for all intense and purposes says "We're in love. Everyone knows we're in love. End of story."

AL

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