Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[michelleb]

Was at the supermarket this morning and I bought the LOST TV Guide (W/ the Atlantis cards in them). Now, on the back of Teyla's card it says under 'ally': "Lt. Col. Sheppard, who keeps an eye on her. Sometimes two."

OH PLEASE! I am so SICK of hearing stuff like this. You know what? His eyes may be on Teyla, but his heart belongs to Elizabeth!

edit: I have an extra TV Guide that has the Elizabeth Weir card in it. If anyone wants it, PM me.

These are the same cards that claim Sam is happily single. Pah, what do these cards know? They're just bits of pulped wood. They know nothing of ship

[Finnstardust]

I think it's too late to change the ship to sheyla without ruining the show for many of us. See, if they went with Sheyla from the beginning, like they were obviously trying to do, and didn't give us all any clues about sparky, we would all be happy sheylas. But they did give us loads of clues, they did use the natural chemistry between John and Elizabeth (Torri/Joe?) to push the ship even further, they did give us ALL the reasons to believe that this is the ship they are going with.
And, if suddenly, after all that, they did a sheyla, wouldn't you feel heartbroken? I know I would. It would be like seeing your ex bf that you love, with another girl.

but yes, they should just settle on one ship and stop playing games with us.

Agreed. For me it comes down to the simple fact that Sheppard and Teyla haven't really had any scenes together since Conversion (TLG excluded here because I don't know what to think about that one). I can't understand how anyone expects us to see chemistry between two people who are not doing anything together!
Also, I love the way Sparky has been built from the beginning, with small baby-steps, dealing with friendship and trust and some power struggles. If TPTB went with Sheyla now it would just make no sense because this ship has no clear milestones of growth, like Sparky does.

See, I have already posted twice today...

[Southern Red]

I'm not totally sure why, but watching Epiphany left me depressed. So much wasted potential.

Spoiler:

The cave portion could have been so much more with the flashbacks JF originally talked about and a little more angst on his part. The hippies added nothing. N.O.T.H.I.N.G. Yeah his interaction with the kid was cute but all too brief, and it was fun watching him try not to fall asleep, but Teer was totally unnecessary. Anything she added by way of plot exposition could have been done by the brother or the kid. She wasn't even all that attractive, and he didn't show much interest in her even after she jumped him. How could he have said no after she explained that it was a foregone conclusion? And it looked like he was just waiting for her to make the first move because after agonizing so long over his friends' abandonment, just when he discovers they've sent supplies for him he loses all interest and goes along with whatever Teer wants. Odd. Does this man have no control whatsoever over his libido? And is he unaware that sometimes he can choose the woman? He doesn't have to wait for them. This may explain a lot in relation to the Teyla/Weir situation. If we look at this ep as character development for Shep I, for one, don't like the outcome. He looks immature, petty and has some definite issues that maybe Heightmeyer needs to deal with. Again notice how at the end of this one he has the same reaction as at the end of TLG. It's over. Forget it ever happened. Don't want to talk about it. You can throw in Conversion also. Don't give it another thought. And something tells me he won't.

The big question is why are TPTB doing this to Sheppard? Some of us are beside ourselves with frustration over the way they've taken the noble, honorable hero from S1 and turned him into a joke. His personality even seems different.

Spoiler:

I loved his little speech at the table to the hippies about living your life. But it doesn't seem he takes his own advice. If he believes you have to live life to its fullest then why hasn't he acted on his supposed attraction to Teyla.

Do TPTB just plan on telling us once in awhile in interviews, etc that J/T have an attraction but forget about it on the actual show? And what's all this with the obvious chemistry with Weir? Are they yanking our chain thinking that getting various ships excited will increase viewership? Are we setting ourselves up for a huge letdown? Two words. Sam. Jack.

So far we have a wide variety of fans on various threads and even on other forums saying the same things. Sheppard needs more character development and the, for lack of a better term, Kirking has to stop. There is almost universal agreement on these two things. We will see how S3 goes, but it's already too late to salvage S2. It's hard to enjoy the Sparky moments when you know they may just ignore the whole thing. Sorry. Rant over.

[Athenaktt]

*rolls eyes* And the Sheppard card? Under ally it says: "Doctor Weir, who not only respects him but cares for his welfare." I won't be at all surprised if Ronon's lists Teyla as his ally.

I am so sick and tired of these bloody games. They're not good publicity. They make TPTB look childish, because they're screwing around with fans instead of PICKING ONE and STICKING WITH IT.

Bah, besides the cards are pretty lame. I just bought them for the pretty pictures.

Besides Elizabeth's card says her Allies are "The entire Atlantis expeditionary force," which the conclusion MsPooh and I came with is that equals to John.

Because he is both military and smart enough to be scientist. So John is the ideal package deal.

Besdies these cards say that Daniel's Ally is (possibly spoiler I'm not sure just tag it in case.)

Spoiler:

the pregnant intergalactic thief Vla Mal Doran. Now i haven't read any spoilers for SG-1, but Vala pregnant?! When did this happen? Or did they misunderstand Vala's joke in one of the previous episodes?

Besides this is TV guide, Rodney is one of he main casts of Atlantis, who probably has more lines than anyone else. And he was left out of the card collection, guess poor Rondey just wasn't "pretty" enough.

Anyways I reach the point where anyone can say what they want. I see what I see on screen, and that is a LOT of Sparky.

[SGLAB]

I'm not totally sure why, but watching Epiphany left me depressed. So much wasted potential.

Spoiler:

The cave portion could have been so much more with the flashbacks JF originally talked about and a little more angst on his part. The hippies added nothing. N.O.T.H.I.N.G. Yeah his interaction with the kid was cute but all too brief, and it was fun watching him try not to fall asleep, but Teer was totally unnecessary. Anything she added by way of plot exposition could have been done by the brother or the kid.

Spoiler:

You know I think the kid would have been a better choice use for the exposition. Teer was dull and unnecessary.

Spoiler:

She wasn't even all that attractive, and he didn't show much interest in her even after she jumped him. How could he have said no after she explained that it was a foregone conclusion? And it looked like he was just waiting for her to make the first move because after agonizing so long over his friends' abandonment, just when he discovers they've sent supplies for him he loses all interest and goes along with whatever Teer wants. Odd. Does this man have no control whatsoever over his libido? And is he unaware that sometimes he can choose the woman? He doesn't have to wait for them. This may explain a lot in relation to the Teyla/Weir situation. If we look at this ep as character development for Shep I, for one, don't like the outcome. He looks immature, petty and has some definite issues that maybe Heightmeyer needs to deal with. Again notice how at the end of this one he has the same reaction as at the end of TLG. It's over. Forget it ever happened. Don't want to talk about it. You can throw in Conversion also. Don't give it another thought. And something tells me he won't.

The big question is why are TPTB doing this to Sheppard? Some of us are beside ourselves with frustration over the way they've taken the noble, honorable hero from S1 and turned him into a joke. His personality even seems different.

Spoiler:

I loved his little speech at the table to the hippies about living your life. But it doesn't seem he takes his own advice. If he believes you have to live life to its fullest then why hasn't he acted on his supposed attraction to Teyla.

Do TPTB just plan on telling us once in awhile in interviews, etc that J/T have an attraction but forget about it on the actual show? And what's all this with the obvious chemistry with Weir? Are they yanking our chain thinking that getting various ships excited will increase viewership? Are we setting ourselves up for a huge letdown? Two words. Sam. Jack.

Odd is a good word to use. Not to mention boring. And emotional fallout? What's that? I had no doubt Shep had some issues that Heightmeyer could help with, but what we've seen isn't it.

So far we have a wide variety of fans on various threads and even on other forums saying the same things. Sheppard needs more character development and the, for lack of a better term, Kirking has to stop. There is almost universal agreement on these two things. We will see how S3 goes, but it's already too late to salvage S2. It's hard to enjoy the Sparky moments when you know they may just ignore the whole thing. Sorry. Rant over.

Good rant SR.

[michelleb]

Besdies these cards say that Daniel's Ally is (possibly spoiler I'm not sure just tag it in case.)

Spoiler:

the pregnant intergalactic thief Vla Mal Doran. Now i haven't read any spoilers for SG-1, but Vala pregnant?! When did this happen? Or did they misunderstand Vala's joke in one of the previous episodes?

continuing spoiler

Spoiler:

yes, when she comes back, she's preggers, but its not daniel's. however, either they had plot info far in advance (considering when these cards would have had to be printed) or yes, they misunderstood the joke)

i think concentrating on the pretty pictures would be a good idea. (Concentratig on daniel looking v. sexy was the only thing that got me throuhg affinity...)

[Suzotchka]

*rolls eyes* And the Sheppard card? Under ally it says: "Doctor Weir, who not only respects him but cares for his welfare." I won't be at all surprised if Ronon's lists Teyla as his ally.

You're a psychic! Under Ally for Ronan it says: "Teyla, his sometime sparring partner."

See - Ronan/Teyla!

Sparky all the way~

[SGLAB]

continuing spoiler

Spoiler:

yes, when she comes back, she's preggers, but its not daniel's. however, either they had plot info far in advance (considering when these cards would have had to be printed) or yes, they misunderstood the joke)

i think concentrating on the pretty pictures would be a good idea. (Concentratig on daniel looking v. sexy was the only thing that got me throuhg affinity...)

Concentrating on Daniel looking V. sexy was the only thing that got me through Chimera.

I'm not a S/J shipper just a fan of Sam. Bad ep. for her imo.

[Bama]

Agreed. For me it comes down to the simple fact that Sheppard and Teyla haven't really had any scenes together since Conversion (TLG excluded here because I don't know what to think about that one). I can't understand how anyone expects us to see chemistry between two people who are not doing anything together!
Also, I love the way Sparky has been built from the beginning, with small baby-steps, dealing with friendship and trust and some power struggles. If TPTB went with Sheyla now it would just make no sense because this ship has no clear milestones of growth, like Sparky does.

See, I have already posted twice today...

OMG. I don't mean this to sound cruel but guys, you would have to be an absolutely clueless and emotionally stunted man or incredibly immature in views regarding relationships not to recognize the total lack of anything in sheyla as opposed to the potential and real substance in Shep/Weir. The only thing that bothers me is that I truly wonder sometimes if these people in charge are truly so naive as to believe that they can tell an audience what to see and the audience will be big enough sheeps to buy it. Tptb need to look around. The audiences don't 'buy' sheyla and never have. They talk about how 'smart' the sci-fi audiences are. Well, yeah, I think on the whole they're correct. But that doesn't just stop entirely at understanding sci-fi plots guys. We're a smart enough set to understand human behavior and to recognize human potentials with dynamics that work as well. I just hope that the people in charge are as smart as their audience. Mel made a good comment above-sheyla at this advanced point would be bad writing. How true! It would illogical based on the totality of everything given thus far. I still say tptb are a smart group that are still trying to use sex to sell the program to people who've not tuned in yet or have tuned in casually -thus the teyla references and they're not tipping their hand yet and still tossing out comments to remain vague and confusing. Note to tptb: Show some guts. Piss or get off the pot. I'd prefer a straightline 'no' ship stance as opposed to unending games and intentional confusing statements that contradict what we're being given on screen.

[Athenaktt]

continuing spoiler

Spoiler:

yes, when she comes back, she's preggers, but its not daniel's. however, either they had plot info far in advance (considering when these cards would have had to be printed) or yes, they misunderstood the joke)

i think concentrating on the pretty pictures would be a good idea. (Concentratig on daniel looking v. sexy was the only thing that got me throuhg affinity...)

I kind of figured it was either a spoiler. Which annoyed me, since I've been pretty unspoiled for SG-1. But I think it's more due to very far in advance info. Because in Mitchell's they talk about his enemies being

Spoiler:

Lucian Alliance

and the name does not ring a bell. Not yet at least.

As for Ronon's ally, I figured it would either be Sheppard or Teyla. Bur mostly Teyla since have the most scenes together and there is actually plenty of chemistry between Spanky.

Besides I'm still sticking to my conclusion that "The entire expeditionary force" is AKA John Sheppard. It makes life easier if we keep to that conclusion.

[gwenhwyfar]

*sigh* i watched Epiphany last night. You know, it's really sad when an episode of Atlantis reminds me of an Outer Limits episode, a ST Voyager episode AND a SG-1 episode.
I like to think that

Spoiler:

John didn't sleep with the Space Sl- Teer. But when I watched it it seemed like he did.
His scenes with the kid were cute. Showing once again that he's good with kids

(Good news for far in the Sparky future perhaps?)

Spoiler:

I loved Linguist!Liz. It's about time she got some more time out of Atlantis!

I did notice that she did not seem all that upset about Teer flirting with John in the final scene. Of course the camera was on John with Teyla in the background most of the time.. I like to think that once they got back to Atlantis Elizabth told him that three times with the SS are his limit and if he does it one more time she'll get really mad. But that's just my opinion.

[Chrysalis]

Personally, I think it'd be idiotic to try to ignore the obvious chemistry of Shep/Weir and Ronon/Teyla, especially when Teyla seems so dull around Sheppard but really comes alive as a character around Ronon, but if they want to do something else, that's their prerogative. They run the show, after all. But whatever they're doing, they ought to pick one course and follow it, rather than screwing around. They can't possibly please everyone with this, so it's best to do something and stick with it. Whatever it is, they'd at least have my respect for getting off the fence.

If they go with Sheyla, they're just going with what they WANT people to want. Not what they know people want, or what works on screen. It's like saying "we picked Sheyla as our ship, and damn you people, you're going to like it!"
It doesn't work. Joe and Torri are amazing together. John and Elizabeth are perfect. Move on! It's like there's some residual stubborness that won't allow them to go, okay, we tried it, it doesn't quite work, John works better with Elizabeth, Teyla works better with Ronon.

[Vicky]

If they go with Sheyla, they're just going with what they WANT people to want. Not what they know people want, or what works on screen. It's like saying "we picked Sheyla as our ship, and damn you people, you're going to like it!"
It doesn't work. Joe and Torri are amazing together. John and Elizabeth are perfect. Move on! It's like there's some residual stubborness that won't allow them to go, okay, we tried it, it doesn't quite work, John works better with Elizabeth, Teyla works better with Ronon.

I really hope they'll open their eyes.
Just a quick thought: haven't they notice that there are more Sparky shippers than Sheyla?

[Bama]

If they go with Sheyla, they're just going with what they WANT people to want. Not what they know people want, or what works on screen. It's like saying "we picked Sheyla as our ship, and damn you people, you're going to like it!"
It doesn't work. Joe and Torri are amazing together. John and Elizabeth are perfect. Move on! It's like there's some residual stubborness that won't allow them to go, okay, we tried it, it doesn't quite work, John works better with Elizabeth, Teyla works better with Ronon.

I like the way you put that Alyssa-"residual stubborness". I truly wonder if that's not what it is. I mentioned a few weeks back about how important pride can be to a man. The creators of this show see SGA as their vision and their brainchild. And they may be so locked into that mindset that the wishes of the audience and what's best for the characters and show be damned.

[Chrysalis]

I really hope they'll open their eyes.
Just a quick thought: haven't they notice that there are more Sparky shippers than Sheyla?

There's no way they couldn't notice. Just look at the difference here. I'm sure it's the same everywhere. Then again, if they looked at fanfiction sites, I'm sure they'd come across wraithbait where all the fic is pretty much Shep/McKay Slash
Not liking that at all!!!!