Originally posted by Scary Kitty
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Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostI watch The Mentalist also, and yes, the woobie face is universal when you've lost a loved one. He doesn't remind me of John in any other way though because I think Jane is a bit wacko, but anyway.And I'm praying they don't hook him up with Lisbon.If you want to be reminded of John, watch Hell on Wheels from the beginning.
Pretty much everyone agrees that John lost his devil-may-care spirit when he lost her, even if they don't ship them. In fact I know that at least one other shipper group blame the writers for focusing on that loss and neglecting to show the wuv twoo wuv between John and someone else who shall remain nameless who is not Teyla.
I honestly don't think these writers have a clue what they did. Maybe they don't know all the romance tropes. Maybe they never in their lives watched a show with a will-they/won't-they arc. Maybe they don't read books or watch movies with any romantic angles. All that would have to be true for them not to have seen the symbolism in, for example, him carrying her in his arms to the infirmary or the dozens of other little things that showed their connection. But aside from all that, we've got the total lack of a similar connection with any other character.
Well okay you might say, he kissed Teyla. But consider the circumstances. That would have been like Dracula biting the neck of some random female who wandered up...outside influences. And she was obviously offended and relieved not to talk about it. Now, I'm no expert, but that signals the end of it to me. Saving her life numerous times, which the writers themselves held up as an example of him caring for her? WTF? He saved Jennifer's life and almost died, plus almost every other principal character at least once. They were just clueless about their own writing. We used to speculate that there was an editor who was secretly Sparky and was editing the show to play up that angle.
A comment I saw yesterday about Vegas and the field medic he loses - the person thought this was deliberately added to show how the loss of Elizabeth to our John has affected him. I had to just laugh because, while it's an absolutely true statement, was no doubt completely unintended by the writers.
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Originally posted by JT-2 View PostYeah, I've run across some people of another John ship who truly think the writers were trying to portray Sparky even after Elizabeth was kicked off the show.
A comment I saw yesterday about Vegas and the field medic he loses - the person thought this was deliberately added to show how the loss of Elizabeth to our John has affected him. I had to just laugh because, while it's an absolutely true statement, was no doubt completely unintended by the writers.(This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostI watch The Mentalist also, and yes, the woobie face is universal when you've lost a loved one. He doesn't remind me of John in any other way though because I think Jane is a bit wacko, but anyway.And I'm praying they don't hook him up with Lisbon.If you want to be reminded of John, watch Hell on Wheels from the beginning.
Pretty much everyone agrees that John lost his devil-may-care spirit when he lost her, even if they don't ship them. In fact I know that at least one other shipper group blame the writers for focusing on that loss and neglecting to show the wuv twoo wuv between John and someone else who shall remain nameless who is not Teyla.
I honestly don't think these writers have a clue what they did. Maybe they don't know all the romance tropes. Maybe they never in their lives watched a show with a will-they/won't-they arc. Maybe they don't read books or watch movies with any romantic angles. All that would have to be true for them not to have seen the symbolism in, for example, him carrying her in his arms to the infirmary or the dozens of other little things that showed their connection. But aside from all that, we've got the total lack of a similar connection with any other character.
Well okay you might say, he kissed Teyla. But consider the circumstances. That would have been like Dracula biting the neck of some random female who wandered up...outside influences. And she was obviously offended and relieved not to talk about it. Now, I'm no expert, but that signals the end of it to me. Saving her life numerous times, which the writers themselves held up as an example of him caring for her? WTF? He saved Jennifer's life and almost died, plus almost every other principal character at least once. They were just clueless about their own writing. We used to speculate that there was an editor who was secretly Sparky and was editing the show to play up that angle.
I always suspected there was someone pulling his weight to restrain the more enthusiastic sheyla shippers on that writing team. Because sometimes it seems someone was sabotaging them. TPTB would pay lip service to the pairing and then go and write sparky anyway, lol. How else do you explain that as hard as they tried to push that pairing they never went all out. Sure, there were some anvils, though I think they're mostly at the very beginning of the series. I know you've said they tried to push sheyla in seasons 4 and 5, but I don't see it, at all.
But when they had the chance, they'd finally gotten rid of their main obstacle, they could have made John the father of Teyla's baby *hands you a barf bag* and they obviously didn't care much about what fans wanted. So what stopped them? I think either there were still people being the voice of reason and fighting to protect the characters integrity or there was some serious self-sabotage and unawareness going on.
Originally posted by JT-2 View PostYeah, I've run across some people of another John ship who truly think the writers were trying to portray Sparky even after Elizabeth was kicked off the show.
A comment I saw yesterday about Vegas and the field medic he loses - the person thought this was deliberately added to show how the loss of Elizabeth to our John has affected him. I had to just laugh because, while it's an absolutely true statement, was no doubt completely unintended by the writers.
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Originally posted by Luz View Post
Buahahaaa! Who? Come on, don't leave me hanging. I'm racking my brain and I can't think of anyone else, besides maybe Ronon.
You mean he attacked Teyla, it's always made me extremely uncomfortable when I see people using that image in signatures and icons like it's supposed to be romantic. And if tptb did this in an attempt to show us a shippy moment then no wonder they don't understand how romance tropes work. They probably tried the "aliens made them do it" but got it all wrong. First, it only works when both parts are willing participants and second, one of the characters being grossed out and scared out of her mind kind of sucks the fun out of it.
I always suspected there was someone pulling his weight to restrain the more enthusiastic sheyla shippers on that writing team. Because sometimes it seems someone was sabotaging them. TPTB would pay lip service to the pairing and then go and write sparky anyway, lol. How else do you explain that as hard as they tried to push that pairing they never went all out. Sure, there were some anvils, though I think they're mostly at the very beginning of the series. I know you've said they tried to push sheyla in seasons 4 and 5, but I don't see it, at all.
But when they had the chance, they'd finally gotten rid of their main obstacle, they could have made John the father of Teyla's baby *hands you a barf bag* and they obviously didn't care much about what fans wanted. So what stopped them? I think either there were still people being the voice of reason and fighting to protect the characters integrity or there was some serious self-sabotage and unawareness going on.
And they always claimed they never wrote Sparky, not even a little bit for one single moment. Why, she's his boss. They can't...omg.
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostNot Ronon but another male.
Did you ever watch the commentary for Conversion? That's exactly what they thought, and they also thought she liked it and wanted more. But then JF says something about the scene not coming out like he expected, and we never learn what he means because Marty Gero just keeps talking and talking and talking.
As I understand it, Paul Mullie nixed the John as baby daddy idea because he didn't think 2 members of the team having a secret affair was right.
And they always claimed they never wrote Sparky, not even a little bit for one single moment. Why, she's his boss. They can't...omg.Last edited by Luz; 11 June 2013, 11:12 AM.
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Originally posted by Luz View PostMcKay? For a moment I thought another player had shown up late in the game. McShep was a juggernaut but it amazes me that there are people who thought tptb would take it seriously.
EW. Figures. Of course, it's a perfect representation of how little respect they had for their female characters. If they thought she liked it then they really are blind to anything that doesn't reinforces their twisted views, it's like bizarro world with these people.
I'm surprised about Mullie, I always thought there was someone keeping Mallozzi under wraps but I expected it to be someone else. See, this is why that whole movie idea would have never been made, at least not the idea Mallozzi had in mind. He might have been the biggest sheyla shipper, but he wasn't the only person in the writing room. There would always be someone around trying to keep the crazy under control.
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Originally posted by Luz View PostMcKay? For a moment I thought another player had shown up late in the game. McShep was a juggernaut but it amazes me that there are people who thought tptb would take it seriously.
EW. Figures. Of course, it's a perfect representation of how little respect they had for their female characters. If they thought she liked it then they really are blind to anything that doesn't reinforces their twisted views, it's like bizarro world with these people.
I'm surprised about Mullie, I always thought there was someone keeping Mallozzi under wraps but I expected it to be someone else. See, this is why that whole movie idea would have never been made, at least not the idea Mallozzi had in mind. He might have been the biggest sheyla shipper, but he wasn't the only person in the writing room. There would always be someone around trying to keep him under control.
Originally posted by Southern Red View PostBingo. Didn't you realize it was meant to be?
Gero even said he thought about his mother with that scene and wondered if she would think it was too violent. And yet, he went ahead with it the way it was done. Wow. And then there was a lot of male snickering from all of them.Visit SGArising.com to read our virtual continuation of the Atlantis series!
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Originally posted by Eri13 View PostIn a way, they sort of self-sabotaged. Consider Carl Binder. Someone did not feed him the official SGA Kool-Aid, or something, because while most of the writers threw in moments we consider 'Sparky', he sort of went above and beyond. See Lifeline; Ghost in the Machine.
Did *any* of the female characters get any kind of respect, in SGA that is?sigpichttps://www.fanfiction.net/s/7450657...-World-Goes-On Sparky story SGA https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10177037/1/Bad-Moon-Rising Teen Wolf fanfic story https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10573271/1/Skyfall Thor fanfic story
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostGero even said he thought about his mother with that scene and wondered if she would think it was too violent. And yet, he went ahead with it the way it was done. Wow. And then there was a lot of male snickering from all of them.
I don't know anything about Mullie, but I know I love him for this. I don't think JM was the only crazy. Brad Wright said much the same thing at ComicCon right before S5. I guess they overlooked the part where they wrote Teyla as being pregnant with another man's child. The lack of continuity is mindboggling. And they chose to completely overlook the massive juggernaut that was the Sparky shippers.
Originally posted by Eri13 View PostIn a way, they sort of self-sabotaged. Consider Carl Binder. Someone did not feed him the official SGA Kool-Aid, or something, because while most of the writers threw in moments we consider 'Sparky', he sort of went above and beyond. See Lifeline; Ghost in the Machine.
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Originally posted by Luz View PostI'm going to try to catch up, but I'm terrible at watching in chronological order. I keep watching random episodes here and there. But I really want to watch them in order.
Originally posted by Luz View PostThough it's easier to watch them now because I have SGA-R to cleanse my palate. And it hasn't been so bad, I forgot how much I loved all the characters, so I try to focus on them instead of how much I miss Lizzie.
Originally posted by Luz View PostThey gave everyone, except Sheppard, a significant other. And this only made Sheppard's loneliness, and the void Elizabeth's absence left in his life stand out.
Originally posted by Luz View PostThey shipped one pairing but they created a narrative that turned Elizabeth into the most significant person in Sheppard's life. To the point that her loss turned him into a shadow of himself.
Originally posted by Luz View PostAnd I look at John, without Elizabeth, and he behaves like a widower.
Originally posted by Southern Red View PostWell okay you might say, he kissed Teyla. But consider the circumstances. That would have been like Dracula biting the neck of some random female who wandered up...outside influences.
Originally posted by JT-2 View PostA comment I saw yesterday about Vegas and the field medic he loses - the person thought this was deliberately added to show how the loss of Elizabeth to our John has affected him. I had to just laugh because, while it's an absolutely true statement, was no doubt completely unintended by the writers.sigpicsig by Erin Atlantis Rising: The Virtual series Thank you so much for "Primum Movens"
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But weren't John and Elizabeth under the influence of Thalen and Phebus when they kised?sigpichttps://www.fanfiction.net/s/7450657...-World-Goes-On Sparky story SGA https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10177037/1/Bad-Moon-Rising Teen Wolf fanfic story https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10573271/1/Skyfall Thor fanfic story
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/1168823...here-Was-Light Crimson Peak story sig by yamiinsane
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