Why does everyone seem to dislike Enterprise????

[nx01a]

I think you missed alot.

Spoiler:

The Xindi desire to destroy Earth was because of a century of manipulation by the Sphere Builders, both into trusting them and into believing that Earth would destroy the Xindi in the future. As for the Vulcans, that was another case of outside influence [reunification, anyone?]as well as misinterpretation of Surak's teachings. They weren't acting Vulcan, they were acting like a self-centred, paranoid species that look alot like Vulcans.

[Col. Newman]

I really Enterprise except for the fact that it violated A LOT of canon.

[nx01a]

B&B tweaked some canon. Liberally, but I can't remember them outright destroying anything major stated before. What did they destroy?

[DigiFluid]

B&B tweaked some canon. Liberally, but I can't remember them outright destroying anything major stated before. What did they destroy?

Off the top of my head...

Ferengi: Were first encountered by Picard in the Stargazer, and not again until TNG's 'The Last Outpost'. B&B's copout answer for having them in ENT was that they never mentioned their species name, but I have a hard ****ing time believing that in the 230 years between then and TNG, Starfleet Intelligence would be so completely inept as to have not realized the connection.

Borg: Q, the omnipotent and omniscient being, said that humanity had no idea what was out there waiting for them, and shot Picard's Enterprise out to first encounter the Borg. If the Borg had been encountered 230odd years previously, Starfleet (not to mention the future Section 31) would have been fully aware of the threat, and Q as an omniscient (all-knowing) being would have been quite aware of that and there would have been no need for the events of 'Q Who?'.

The Gruesome Twosome had already started to ignore this fact in voyager by suggesting that a couple of scientists on Federation permission went looking for the Borg, and now their apologists claim an alternate timeline because of First Contact. Except that no Borg went to the surface in FC. And the Sphere was near-vapourized by quantum torpedoes. And it was destroyed over Montana, not the Arctic. And any debris (not to mention BODIES, oh god that made me mad) would have burned up on atmospheric entry, completely and utterly precluding any possibility of 'Regeneration'.

Phasers & Photons, Viewscreens & Cloaks, oh my: It was explicitly stated in 'Balance of Terror' that first war with the Romulans was fought with primitive nuclear weapons. It also explicitly stated that no-one had ever seen a Romulan because viewscreens had not yet been invented at the time of the Earth-Romulan War. Yes, this is because they were the most advanced weapon at the time of TOS' making. But if you're going to make a prequel, you need to pay attention to your source material, not dismiss it because it's inconvenient.

The same TOS also made it quite clear that a cloaking device was something new and terrifying, which had never been encountered before. This was also willfully ignored by ENT.

Hand phasers (phase pistols ) as well. TOS made use of hand phasers, but in the pilot episode 'The Cage' (having taken place several years before TOS proper), it was explicitly stated that they used lasers; meaning that Starfleet had made the transition from laser-based weapons to phasers some time in the interim. This episode is considered by some to be apocrypha, but its inclusion in TOS' 'The Menagerie' two-parter, as well as never being decanonised by Gene, make it quite clear that the events of 'The Cage' are canonical Trek history.



I can accept the Akiraprise, I can accept that there are races never before mentioned in any Trek series. But I will not accept blatant disregard of the hard work of 35 years of writers and writing teams from people who (at least one) willingly stated that he had never seen an episode of TOS (Braga). As far as I am concerned, Enterprise is not factual or canonical Trek. Were Paramount to for some unfathomable reason place me in charge of the Trek franchise, my first act would be an announcement to that end.

[nx01a]

Mmm...
The Ferengi I wasn't happy about, thanks for reminding me. The Borg not stating their name was a horrid copout. Had they been damaged from the cold and not working very well, yet still able to modify, etc., sure. AND, of course, never actually being SEEN by the NX crew. Phlox's ability to defeat the nanoprobes was O_o, too. I remember trying to remember what the cloak situation was, remembered it being new and shocking in TOS. The primitive nuclear weapons... Not so much, really. Their attack drones were kind of like that, it really WAS long distance. Though the holographic simulator skin that's 200+ years more advanced than anything we've seen, even in VOY, was a shock.
I don't mind a mild tweaking of things as the years go by. The phasers I could live with. The Romulans keeping their identities a secret for tactical reasons makes sense, too. TOS ships were supposed to be faster than subspace communication, right? The beacons and instant communication with Starfleet left me a bit... ugh.

I understand the frustration you feel about this stuff. I'm quite sick of comics retcons myself, esp the ones ignoring 40+ years of history, AND writers who seem almost happy to say they have little or no familiarity with the characters they're using, much less the company paying them to write said adventures.

Sorry to make you rant, Digi.

[DigiFluid]

Oh hey...I wasn't ranting at you or anything

Just thinking of that show gets me all worked up and angry at B&B all over again, is all.

[nx01a]

I know you weren't. I just mean rant in general. Gets the blood pumping, and the hands ready to strangle stupid people in positions of sci-fi power.

[kmiller1610]

First I don't hate Enterprise. If I ignore all other TV Science Fiction I have ever seen and just turned on the TV, I would say cool, science fiction. But Enterprise was the LAST (to this point) Trek Science Fiction series, so you are forced to compare it to everything that came before it. If you can ignore all other Trek, then none of this applies.

However........

1) The show tries to be a prequel and a sequel at the same time. This is a lost opportunity. If you are going to do a prequel, go primitive. Do Cochran after First Contact. Do the genetics wars. There are plenty of gaps and untold stories that would make a good TV series. But the producers and writers just got lazy. They didn't do their homework. They didn't try to build on the previous series. Enterprise could have been Firefly: fresh, original and still fit perfectly in the Trek Universe

2) Production values: Lighting, FX, set dressing, all at least 3 steps below Ds9, 2 steps below Voyager, 1 step below TNG. The show screams cheap cheap cheap.

3) Derivative (see step 1)......

Hoshi almost saves the show through sheer, raw sex appeal. Flox is wonderful as another excellent doctor. The others are just OK. But the blame mainly rests with the LAZY LAZY LAZY producers and writers who put the show together.

[farcue]

...because there was no Dean Stockwell to make Scott Bakula bearable.

I liked it, for the most part, probably because it's the ST show that I've seen the most of... not that I'm saying it's any better than the others, probably still the worst ST series, but I enjoy it.

Not true! there was an ep with stockwell in, and did anyone else notice his handheld thing looked a LOT like ziggy?

"Ziggy says theres a 100% probability you're here to rescue this show from branon braga sam"

[Angela V]

Not true! there was an ep with stockwell in, and did anyone else notice his handheld thing looked a LOT like ziggy?

"Ziggy says theres a 100% probability you're here to rescue this show from branon braga sam"

You beat me to it! If I remember correctly Stockwell played a not so nice guy?

I liked Enterprise. Watched it from the beginning. I LOVED season 4 except for that weird finale. It's too bad Manny Coto didn't get on sooner. I think he would've saved the show.

I'm actually someone who couldn't stand Trip. Couldn't stand Paris either in Voyager. DS9 it was that weird holodeck Vic singing guy. I actually ff through a lot of his stuff. I liked everyone on TOS and TNG (yes even Wesley Crusher though I was a teenage GIRL when TNG came on so that explains everything )

[HyperCaz]

Surely you can't bring out the firing squad just coz I've only seen five episodes

[Bytor]

Seriosly why doe everyone seem to hate enterprise it's one of if not the best Startrek show and a very good scifi show.

because it sucks

[Bytor]

Spoiler:

I'll watch Enterprise because it's Star Trek

this statement gives me stomach pains

[farcue]

(yes even Wesley Crusher though I was a teenage GIRL when TNG came on so that explains everything )

Theres a word for teenage girls who like wesley crusher. That word is lesbian.

God i HATE him the whiney little maggot! He was unbareable!

Rant over, you're not a lesbian, i just hate wesley with a passion.

That said, wil wheton(sp?) was actually a really good actor. I hated wes so much i assumed it was just because wheaton was a prat but i saw him in the film stand by me (an adaption of stephen kings the body) and he was actually really good! I guess its just the wesley character i dont like.

I didnt like trip very much, although i do like micheal in SGA, so again i think it was a case of disliking the character not the actor.

EDIT: And yes. you're right Stockwell played the commander of some prison camp.

[Jeffala]

Spoiler:

I'll watch Enterprise because it's Star Trek

this statement gives me stomach pains

Why?

With all of its faults, Enterprise was still better than a lot of the other junk on television and I like every bit of Trek. I just have varying degrees of "like".