Misc tech questions

[Gladius77]

I thought we've established that since gates only go one way, nothing can go the other way (which would be the case here...).

[Seastallion]

The iris isn't part of any design for the gate, so it'd be a far stretch to assume that SGC found an "undocumented feature" which would just happen to work (though logically it shouldn't). And unless the metal used to make the iris had the properties which would allow it to bend (just the opposite is indicated), the fixtures that hold it in place would logically give way before the iris itself expanded. The end result would be the same anyway; the iris wouldn't hold. The whole iris as it is presented is impossible anyway; it expands from literally nothing to cover the whole circle. But this is another issue altogether, heh.

Are you forgetting the Atlantis Stargate? It has a shield, which does the same exact job as the Iris on Earth. Also, several Goa'uld have had shielded stargates. We know that Apophis did, at least once. Sokar managed to defeat his shield the same way Sokar defeated the Iris. We also know that Anubis had the Stargate on his primary base planet shielded as well. The Iris isn't a new idea at all... just a slightly less technically advanced version.

As I understand it, the vortex isn't necessary but will occur when there is sufficient space for it to do so. We know that the stargate on "100 Days" was able to open a wormhole without a vortex, because the molten rock hardened just above the event horizon. There seems to be spacial factor involved with the creation of the vortex. It is possible to stick your arm into the event horizon and withdraw it and you'll be fine. The event horizon isn't always dangerous, it is only in the unstable vortex that it becomes lethal. If there isn't enough space, the event horizon simply forms along the inner rim of the gate. If the gate is completely buried (i.e.-the space where the event horizon would normally be is covered up), the wormhole won't connect.

In any case, the vortex (while dangerous) can be useful. We saw how again in "100 Days", after they used a particle beam to melt a small space above the event horizon. They then reactivated the gate, and the vortex having enough space to form pushed further into the hole creating a cavity that was then used to unbury the gate on the otherside. The event horizon only becomes dangerous in its unstable vortex form, but the vortex will not occur if there isn't enough space for it do so. It will simply expand outwards until it is attached to the inner rim of the gate, becoming stable without the vortex. When the space in front of the event horizon is free and open the vortex forms likely because it is like a grappling hook. The wormhole 'threads the needle', expands then pulls back locked onto the gate. |---> then |---<, and finally |-|. I'm sure people have seen grappling hooks that fly towards their targets, then expands upon impact locking the hook into place. It is a similiar priniciple with the vortex and the gate. If there isn't any space to expand into however, then the event horizon just expands outwards to the inner rim of the gate, once again establishing a lock anyways.

As to why something doesn't come all the way through the Iris. That is rather simple. An extremely small part of it does, but not nearly enough of it to do too much damage, to an Iris composed of Titanium and Trinium. It would be like trying to run through a wall, you might leave behind a little blood, but you won't get through. The SGC has been able to identify the objects impacting the Iris as organic, and even a specific radioactive signature. So, extremely small parts of the objects do in fact materialize... just not enough to cause damage. Too little mass, and not enough velocity. In the case of the wormhole, microscopic particles do get through, but the rest is simply lost in transit as unreconstituted matter (atoms) particles floating around in space. We know for a fact that matter can interact with normal space while in transit through a wormhole. We saw it when a wormhole passed through a star, causing it to redshift as a result of interacting with the wormhole and nearly killed the inhabitants of that world. Fortunately the Asgard secretly were able to repair the damage.

Anyways, maybe this will help.

[Gladius77]

I've never seen Atlantis, and since it's a separate show, I don't think it should apply backwards to SG-1. I've also only seen the first two seasons of SG-1, so I'm basing my conclusions based on what I've seen thus far. I guess some of this stuff becomes clearer later on (or even less clear, hehe).

The vortex not forming when there isn't enough space around it doesn't make sense to me... I mean, isn't the whole point of the vortex forming to clear the way in front of the stargate? Which would make pretty much its entire purpose to clear blocked space in front of the gate. I guess your "grappling hook" theory would work, but if the event horizon forms regardless of it, why bother having it at all? Obviously not to have it clear the way in front of the stargate, when this can be easily disabled by something like an iris.

As for your last explanation, yea, that'd work, but we're back to the heavy thuds you hear of matter splattering against the iris. With your theory, so little matter would form that NOTHING should be heard impacting the iris. Certainly not thuds sounding as heavy as if whole people were splaterring against it. I guess you could put this down to being done for dramatic effect, but I don't see the point, considering it's a big irregularity.

[Perriman33]

Ive just seen the film again, after so many years. They have two anubis guards quite clearly splattered on the stone cover, that the egyptians put up. As far as i could make out the stone was flush with the gate, so nothing should have formed. Just thought I'd mention it.

[Hudson]

Ive just seen the film again, after so many years. They have two anubis guards quite clearly splattered on the stone cover, that the egyptians put up. As far as i could make out the stone was flush with the gate, so nothing should have formed. Just thought I'd mention it.

erm, you sure that isnt an engraving?

[Col. Newman]

I thought we've established that since gates only go one way, nothing can go the other way (which would be the case here...).

The Matter would go back in the event horizon but it wouldn't come out the other side,its not like there is a shield on every signal gate so that things can only enter on 1 side of the worm hole

[6thMonolith]

I thought we've established that since gates only go one way, nothing can go the other way (which would be the case here...).

In A hundred days, the 'gate is facing upward. When the MALP was sent through, it fell back through the gate backwards. It was just destroyed, and the episode didn't go into any more detail. Gate travel is one way, but matter entering an event horizon is not.

[_Owen_]

I'm sorry to nitpick, I usually try not to mention it, but please do not refer to the horizontal emission from the stargate at the time of activation and creation of the wormhole, as the "Kawoosh." It is called a Vortex, in the show it was given a name, please use it. I appoligize for nitpicking.

As far I can tell, some people still don't understand, if I have missed a post, I appoligize, I didn't read them all.

The reason the vortex does not destroy the iris, is because like any matter traveling through the stargate it is created by the event horizon, the only plausible way for it to not vaporise the iris is for it to not have enough room to materialize, there is no other possibility, if you think you have found one please by all means post I would be interested to see what you have come up with.

Owen Macri

[Gladius77]

In A hundred days, the 'gate is facing upward. When the MALP was sent through, it fell back through the gate backwards. It was just destroyed, and the episode didn't go into any more detail. Gate travel is one way, but matter entering an event horizon is not.

Aaah, now that's something else entirely. Thanks for the explanation.

[Seastallion]

I've never seen Atlantis, and since it's a separate show, I don't think it should apply backwards to SG-1. I've also only seen the first two seasons of SG-1, so I'm basing my conclusions based on what I've seen thus far. I guess some of this stuff becomes clearer later on (or even less clear, hehe).

My friend... I truly feel bad for you. However, you are in no shape to be concluding anything if you've only seen 2 seasons. There are 8 whole seasons, plus a ninth on the way. Also, Atlantis is NOT a seperate show, it is an extension of Sg1. It is the same universe, where the same rules apply. The same people are making both shows, so of course anything seen on Atlantis should apply backwards to SG-1. Heck, not to throw a spoiler in your face, but after Atlantis was started with their Puddlejumpers... guess what? Last season SG-1 got a Puddlejumper..! Why? Because both shows are part of the same universe (i.e.- NOT seperate shows), and in both shows the Ancients built Puddlejumpers. Atlantis was first mentioned on SG-1, and then a new show was created to exploit the story possibilities of the Lost city of Ancients. The shows aren't two entirely seperate entities, rather they are part of each other. They simply tell two different stories within the same exact universe. Whatever applies to one, at least in some way applies to the other. The Dadealus was first mentioned on SG-1, and now it is going to Atlantis. SG-1 found a ZPM on Earth, and now they are sending it to Atlantis. The shows are undeniably connected.

That's just my take on it.

[Gladius77]

Heh, well, when a technology is being used from practically day one and there's no sensible explanation for it by the end of season 2, something's amiss. Not to mention that even all the theories presented here are just that, no one has any definite answers.

Atlantis is an extension of SG-1, exactly. Considering that SG-1 has been going on for 10 years, you can't seriously expect me to have to go looking to an extension of this show to make some sense of the iris, which has been present in SG-1 right from the beginning. That's my point. I shouldn't have to go see Atlantis for something in SG-1 to make sense.

I know well enough that there's a strong connection between SG-1 and Atlantis, but that's not my point.

[Seastallion]

If your only being specific to the Iris, then no. Your right. Atlantis doesn't have a metallic Iris, but it does have an energy shield that does the exact same job. The event horizon forms within the shield without the vortex, just as it does with the Iris in place on Sg1. The event horizon itself isn't harmful, it is only the unstable vortex that is lethal. Once it has stabilized it is virtually harmless. You could stick your hand in and be fine. I wouldn't stick my head in... because the brain signal needed to pull it back out wouldn't be able to get back to your body. Thus, you'd be effectively stuck unless someone pulled you out. You could also stick your hand into an incoming wormhole and still be ok. However, if you walk through it, you won't be transported... you'll just have your atoms dispersed everywhere between the planet you left and the origin point of the wormhole itself, and not be reconstituted on the other side. The gate was specifically designed to only work one way at a time. All the stargate does, is provide an anchor for the mouth of the wormhole to stay in our dimension long enough for travellers to go through it. To get a lock, the mouth of the wormhole has to connect with the inner rim of the gate. Whether it does that by creating a vortex and latching on, or by simply spreading out until it reaches the unobstructed inner rim, it will lock. IF, however, the inner rim where the event horizen is attached is blocked for any reason, the wormhole will not lock.

[the Fifth Race]

What is the Earth Iris made of Sea?....Is it some kind of trinium/naquadah enhanced composite?.

[immhotep]

1st one was tritanium, pure, the second was a trinium/titanium alloy.

[Gladius77]

If your only being specific to the Iris, then no. Your right. Atlantis doesn't have a metallic Iris, but it does have an energy shield that does the exact same job. The event horizon forms within the shield without the vortex, just as it does with the Iris in place on Sg1. The event horizon itself isn't harmful, it is only the unstable vortex that is lethal. Once it has stabilized it is virtually harmless. You could stick your hand in and be fine. I wouldn't stick my head in... because the brain signal needed to pull it back out wouldn't be able to get back to your body. Thus, you'd be effectively stuck unless someone pulled you out. You could also stick your hand into an incoming wormhole and still be ok. However, if you walk through it, you won't be transported... you'll just have your atoms dispersed everywhere between the planet you left and the origin point of the wormhole itself, and not be reconstituted on the other side. The gate was specifically designed to only work one way at a time. All the stargate does, is provide an anchor for the mouth of the wormhole to stay in our dimension long enough for travellers to go through it. To get a lock, the mouth of the wormhole has to connect with the inner rim of the gate. Whether it does that by creating a vortex and latching on, or by simply spreading out until it reaches the unobstructed inner rim, it will lock. IF, however, the inner rim where the event horizen is attached is blocked for any reason, the wormhole will not lock.

Ok, some interesting info there (and making sense, finally!). But I'm guessing none of that is really made clear in SG-1?

Edit: Also, this still leaves the heavy thuds impacting the iris unexplained, I believe.

Also, another question. Where is the person/object during the time it takes to enter into the gate on one side? Because logically they can't start breaking down until they're actually INSIDE the gate already... but that means already being like 1m beyond the event horizon...