jacks "ZPM" gould tech

[Mio]

You are exactly right, we should be using the device right now, except when they came back from the alternate reality they apparently left it there for unknown reasons and did not ever elaborate on this. It was pretty stupid seeing as the device would have worked, possibly hundreds of millions of times more, barring any accidents, such as someone dropping it.

Owen Macri

Maybe it burned out? It was only ever meant to be used once.

[_Owen_]

It is entirely possible, if it was meant for long term use, O'Neill probably would have made it look even cooler!

Owen Macri

[Lightsabre]

I have just discussed this with Crazedwraith, it is not a violation of the Consevation of Energy. Please read the last couple of pages.

Owen Macri

I gotta say Owen, that your explanation seems to be the least likely, to me at least.

Why would you make a device that gathers up ambient energy and shoves it into another dimension to increase the potential energy yield of a substance within the dampening field?
That makes no sense to me. Use the ambient energy.

It just doesn't make sense, man.

[_Owen_]

You know what, I agree with you, it has a whole function that isn't needed, by our limited perspective, there are reasons that the Ancients could have had for using this technology that we can't understand.

It is the most complicated explination, I like complicated, and it would theoretically work.

Owen Macri

[Lightsabre]

You know what, I agree with you, it has a whole function that isn't needed, by our limited perspective, there are reasons that the Ancients could have had for using this technology that we can't understand.

It is the most complicated explination, I like complicated, and it would theoretically work.

Owen Macri

Theoretically, yes. But it's needlessly complicated.
ANd rather pointless.

I'd like to hear some of these reasons the ancients would make it needlessly complex.
You can talk about our limited perspective all you like, but at the end of the day, your explanation just doesn't make sense.

[_Owen_]

Actually my explination makes perfect sense, you either refuse to except it or don't understand it, take your pick.

Owen Macri

[YodaMate]

It really does seem out of character for SG-1 to simply leave a highly advanced (Ancient designed, no less) device in a place where they can't get to it.

Two possibilities spring to mind : perhaps Jack thought they would be maintaining relations with the other SGC (helping them rebuild, swapping notes, etc) and simply didn't anticipate that Hammond would order the destruction of the quantum mirror.

That also leaves open the question, why on earth did Hammond take such unilateral action and destroy the mirror ? I'm sure Carter could have come up with a way to block unwanted travellers.

Has it been established roughly how far off the Pegasus galaxy is ? Asgard hyperdrives usually make for speedy travel. Yet even with a ZPM powering up our one, it still takes a couple of days. It's possible that the Ancients wanted to put as much distance between themselves and the contaminated Milky Way as possible.

If Pegasus is on the other side of the universe, relative to the Milky Way and Ida galaxies, then perhaps they still do have Jack's device, they merely determined (offscreen) that it wasn't capable of reaching that far and turned to the ZPM for a solution.

[_Owen_]

It was not very smart, however it could have been broken by accident.

Pegasus isn't on the other side of the universe, in the atlantis premier, Daniel stated "It's a dwarf galaxy in a local group."

Owen Macri

[YodaMate]

Hmm. Well, i'm sure Hammond is kicking himself right now. Do you know how far off Ida is ? If it's closer than Pegasus, then the power capability of the Jack device might still have been inefficient.

[_Owen_]

In theory, the way the device was created it could have produced enough energy to go to the other side of the univese.

Owen Macri

[Lightsabre]

Actually my explination makes perfect sense, you either refuse to except it or don't understand it, take your pick.

Owen Macri

Please don't condescend to me. I read your theory. It would work, but it's, as I said, needlessly complicated and completely pointless.
It doesn't make a lick of sense to build a device that way, unless there was anther reason for it. A reason both Crazedwraith and myself have asked you to provide and you responded by implying that we couldn't understand you.

If you have some, I'd love to hear them.

[_Owen_]

I am sorry, I wasn't trying to be condescending. It is not completley pointless, the point of it is to provide more power where normaly it is not available.

It doesn't make sense to us, it might have made sense to Jack, and the Ancients.

There could be a billion reasons that he built the device that way, but I don't know what they are, I am not pyscic. One of the reasons is saftey, the device could have been built overly complicated in the hopes that we would never understand it, and possibly use it as a weapon to blow ourselves up, Jack had all of the Ancients' knowledge in his brain, this is the order he would think in:

1) Way to get to Othalla
2) Don't blow up Earth
3) Help with information and technology that could be used for defense of Earth or defeat of the Goa'uld.

He succeded in number one and two, and he got started on number three, he helped Sam get off of the planet, and he gave them the new formula to claculate gate adresses faster, then he also gave them a seprate library of gate adresses the Goa'uld hadn't marked on the Cartouche. But notice that with all of the Ancients wisdom it is more likley that he would be thinking of protecting Earth, by not allowing them to blow themselves up before he wanted to give them useable technology. This is a very logical assumption. If fact it would be more likley the list would go like this:

1) find a way to Othalla and don't blow up Earth in the procces.
2) Help Earth with technology that can defend Earth and possibly defeat the Goa'uld but don't give them technology or information that they could use to blow themselves up.

Owen Macri

[Lightsabre]

I am sorry, I wasn't trying to be condescending. It is not completley pointless, the point of it is to provide more power where normaly it is not available.

It doesn't make sense to us, it might have made sense to Jack, and the Ancients.

There could be a billion reasons that he built the device that way, but I don't know what they are, I am not pyscic. One of the reasons is saftey, the device could have been built overly complicated in the hopes that we would never understand it, and possibly use it as a weapon to blow ourselves up, Jack had all of the Ancients' knowledge in his brain, this is the order he would think in:

1) Way to get to Othalla
2) Don't blow up Earth
3) Help with information and technology that could be used for defense of Earth or defeat of the Goa'uld.

He succeded in number one and two, and he got started on number three, he helped Sam get off of the planet, and he gave them the new formula to claculate gate adresses faster, then he also gave them a seprate library of gate adresses the Goa'uld hadn't marked on the Cartouche. But notice that with all of the Ancients wisdom it is more likley that he would be thinking of protecting Earth, by not allowing them to blow themselves up before he wanted to give them useable technology. This is a very logical assumption. If fact it would be more likley the list would go like this:

1) find a way to Othalla and don't blow up Earth in the procces.
2) Help Earth with technology that can defend Earth and possibly defeat the Goa'uld but don't give them technology or information that they could use to blow themselves up.

Owen Macri

Well, that's a good reason.
However!
Jack's subconcious is doing all the work. Remember, he doesn't conciously know what he's doing when he write the math, the machine code or builds hte device. I think it's pure survival instinct. Jack's mind knows it's shutting down, it does what's needed to save him. But I doubt he had a logical thought process and given that the SGC's main standing orders are to get advanced tech, I think that he would have tried to build something that could be used again.

As to how it works, it just still doesn't fit. All the shoving energy from one dimension to another, but the potential for blowing the planet up is worse, since you then have a device that's sucking in energy as well as putting it out. what happens if it suddenly CAN'T shove taht energy through?
Big explosion, that's what.

As to the reason's jack built an overcomplex device, you advanced the theory and defended ti with the premise there were reasons to do it that way. IF you can't give a sound one, then it's fairly obvious there aren't any and so it wasn't built the way you suggest.

[_Owen_]

It was Jacks' subconcious but the ancient data was being writen in, so it was largley effecting his thought procces, simply because he was still himself, only knowledge was being downloaded not another personality. It seems as though the ancient put all of thier knowledge into the repositories, they would have also included logic into it, thier knowldege of logic, etc.

As for your second point it would be worse than an explosion, if energy either stopped being tranfered in or out, one universe would have to much energy and one would have to little, this would be a violation of the conservation of mass and energy, we have no idea what would happen.

As for a reason, there probably was one, but I don't know it, you don't know it, Jack doesn't know it. There are reasons for things that we don't know or can't understand, like why did the ancients put thirty-eight symbols on the stargte, why not six?

Just because somthing doesn't make sense to you and me, doesn't mean that it didn't make sense to the person who came up with it and built it.

Owen Macri