'Twin Destinies' (212) General Discussion

[TheRandomOne]

Telford now has Tiger Blood since he is back home

[Kilgharrah]

Another crack-pot theory for fun. The Destiny crew that disappeared in the stargate were sent to earth so far back in time that they end up helping the ancient Egyptians over throw RA and bury the stargate.

Hasn't SG- 1 already done that in Moebius?
What's the point of sending them back there other than ruining everything that SG- 1 did?

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Awesome ep for me best of season 1 and 2 so far.

I hate the fact I still don't understand the time line usually I get the time travel ones. I think someone needs to spell out (slowly ) the time line of the ep.

[The Destiny]

Awesome ep for me best of season 1 and 2 so far.

I hate the fact I still don't understand the time line usually I get the time travel ones. I think someone needs to spell out (slowly ) the time line of the ep.

I was about to post my lengthy breakdown, but then I realised you already saw it in that other thread

[howwow]

Hi all.

One of the BEST episodes of SGU, no doubt, like most of you felt too!

With so many responses, mine is definitely going to have some similarities so bear with me!

Definitely have to watch all over again to catch those parts or details I missed!

- Star Trek Voyager did it (duplicated ship, Harry Kim and baby died…), Enterprise did it with her duplicated "generations" ship in the Xindi territory

- But somehow SGU's Twin Destinies seem darker, less hopeful… and yet the end, left us with questions… at least for me… We still don't quite get Rush… what is he up to, what is he thinking

- When they are duplicates, they won't last longer than an episode, normally, one of them has to go. What brilliant way, and what sudden abrupt way to kill off Telford, I didn't expect that

- I like the scene where the rest of the people saw the other crippled Destiny, until then, they were all in the Gateroom probably very impatient, wondering why they aren't dialling the gate yet.

- Yes, when you have a duplicated ship, you'll have spare parts. Script/Story solved… the ship will not die, and their mission can continue…

- At least this is a good way, of "once and for all", shut down the idea of dialling the gate in a star while recharging, to try and get back home. Perhaps now they can concentrate on surviving the mission, and really explore what's out there.

So this is truly really fully sad, that the show is cancelled.

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

SGU [212] Twin Destinies


18 March 2011 xxxevilgrinxxx


The wrong people in the wrong place. That was the premise when this whole thing began. Bit by bit, episode by episode, that initial belief has been chipped away as the story unfolded and everyone had a place, a part to play. Destiny was no longer simply a name but had a deeper meaning.


In and of itself, the idea of destiny isn't a bad one and if we were anything but who we are, maybe that would be enough. But people aren't content to leave everything up to some unnamed, unseen force, no matter what it gets called in the end.


The force of human choice, of free will, comes from what would probably be an unlikely source, if we hadn't seen him insist on choice, time after time. While Rush is willing to ask for volunteers, if it came down to a matter of force, I have no doubt that, as he has suggested once before, he would have people rounded up at gunpoint. No, it is through the military, through Col. Young, that the choice is given strength.


After all this time, all this adversity, to choose to stay and complete the mission, to support the others, changes the survivors into something more than simply stranded. The mission becomes theirs.


Of the choice itself, having Young be the first to stand beside Rush, after all that has happened between them, was a deeply moving act. It is quite clear that Rush was surprised and touched, first by Young's agreement to stand beside him and lend his authority when he addressed the crew and, most potently, when Young was the first to volunteer to stay, as though there were never anything else he would do. Rush acknowledges this aloud when he states in a quieter voice that Young stood by him all the way. Such an experience would have to be rare for Rush who, with his acerbic nature, has kept so many at arm's length.


There was some awkwardness when Rush addressed the crew as “my friends”, but there was no outward display of derision. No one laughed, no one snorted, and no one shouted him down, as was done on one other occasion when Rush addressed the whole crew.


In the storyline, if this choice had been made earlier, I can't imagine very many people choosing to stay. I don't think it would have been believable. This is where the strength in building these characters over all this time really pays off. With everyone that stepped forward, I knew why they chose to stay and with each person that crossed that line, I had a lump in my throat, as though their choice was mine.


In contrast to the choice to stay was Telford's opposition, which also felt completely natural. Opposition to the idea in general and to Rush in particular. This opposition would have carried a great deal of weight at one point and I believe that Telford would have had no problem at all using whatever force he could – by rank, threat or gun – to try to enforce his will, but no one seems to be giving him much heed. Greer sums it up succinctly with a “good luck with that”.


There has always been something distasteful about the way Telford has thrown his weight around and his actions in this episode cement this. Telford doesn't lead, he orders. Furthermore, even though he began the episode as trapped as any of them, I never doubted that when the going got tough, that Telford would find a way to get himself out of it, and everyone else be damned. This tendency was shown once before, when dialling within a star was first attempted. He ran and left the Destiny crew to their death and it didn't surprise me at all that Telford was the only one that managed to make it back to Earth.


There was an interesting snippet of dialogue that came between Telford and Rush in relation to both of these events: about Rush not being above sabotaging ships and that it had possibly occurred at other times. Is this where the heart of the animosity between them lies? I wonder if we will find out more about that before the end of this season or if that storyline is lost forever?


The double Rushes not only made for some great dialogue but also presented Rush with a vision of how his destiny very well could have unfolded, with himself watching from the front seat. Rush has always had issues with his anger and he has butted heads, literally and figuratively, with all sources of authority. Further, his arrogance has resulted in the deaths of people like Riley and it could be said that, in stranding them all aboard Destiny in the first place, that he is directly responsible for the deaths of everyone, whether he had a hand in it or not.


The difference with the death of Telford is that it comes directly at Rush's hands, and that it wasn't something Rush was able to control. Despite the anger between the two men, it is clear that Rush didn't want to kill him. Rush is a man of reason with a terrible problem, one that unfolded right before him, a vision of himself, of what he could be. It would be very easy to explain away as something the “other” Rush did but there is no way that Rush will believe that and knowing that he has the capability to kill people will hopefully change his character for the better.


There is one other character – or perhaps a character trait – that has been changed for the better and that is found in Eli's simple guilt about the effects wrought by his creations. This is rare in a genre which has generally been very easy on the sometimes cataclysmic aftereffects of great scientists. Whole worlds, whole people, have been wiped out with scarcely a nod to the ideas that birthed the act so it is really something to see Eli take responsibility for the alternate destiny and inevitable death that could have ensued.


In thinking of twin destinies, I can't help but think of the initial lottery, back in season one. Like the lottery, there are two preselected to go, this time: Rush and Young, who had excluded themselves from the first lottery. Here they are first to stay. There is a set number they are reaching for (although they would happily take more). About to go into the star to their certain deaths, they are assembled once again in the gate room, being addressed from the stairs. But in this lottery, rather than being chosen to leave, they are choosing to stay.


Dark humour continues to develop among the crew, especially between Brody and Volker, although the two Rushes have quite a few witty lines of dialogue. The hands on, amateur nature of the repairs comes off as completely real and I'm pleased that they haven't mastered the technology, although they have managed to make do. Using the second ship for salvage was brilliant and comes across as more believable than coming across a magic crate of parts or some font of knowledge aboard Destiny that would make everything happen easily. This has been a very human effort, all the way. No technobabble, no aliens. Just us.


Lastly, a word on the lighting during this episode. The Destiny set is easily the most beautiful set I have ever seen for this type of show. It has a depth and texture that doesn't simply present a setting but provides an atmosphere. The lighting during the “sun” sequences only increases this air, raising the visual experience to the level of exquisite. The lighting upon the cast and the set is the same, making the actors a part of the Destiny, instead of simply people standing before set pieces. It isn't simply a backdrop. It is this beautiful light that has me place “Twin Destinies” alongside “Darkness” and “Light” as a favourite episode, pulling in a very easy 10/10.


Rating: 10/10

[Gatefan1976]

Hey EG
I think you posted the above in the wrong folder

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

Nope, I post it in the Review thread and also in this thread, because people can't respond in the review thread, or did you mean something else? *scratches head*

[howwow]

A very long post, but I enjoyed your writing.

I very much agree with the last part. From the very 1st episode, I immediately notice SGU/Destiny has a very different set and lighting designs from the other SG series. It is darker, the layers and texture richer. I always love how a bright star would shine that yellowish light into the crew quarters… very detail and intrigue designs wherever you go, from the doors to the corridor, and the gateroom.

And even the exterior of the ship, as more episodes pass, we see more angles and views of Destiny, appreciating the design, size of the ship.

I am liking the ship more and more.

I also love the particular scene in 'Resurgence" when Destiny was under attack, and Telford and the seed ship came to the rescue at an angle, and ask Destiny to follow them into a star… that scene was very very beautiful.

Why oh why again, would SyFy, cancel such a good show? *scratches head* It is a very very sad thing that some exec sitting in his or her chair somewhere out there, and all they worried about was advertising dollar, ratings etc, same goes to their bosses.

Some shows are still on the air, and I doubt they have very good ratings either, and I wonder why SGU was a victim…

[The Destiny]

SGU is expensive.

The thing I cannot fathom is why it doesn't have more viewers than it does. And least of all I do not understand why ratings dropped after deliverance! Probably because the show was cancelled.. that's a big buzzkill...

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Its funny how EG is the only one who does fan reviews .

[Egle01]

Its funny how EG is the only one who does fan reviews .

I've also seen jelgate's reviews. After some time Rachel500 posts her thoughts.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

I've also seen jelgate's reviews. After some time Rachel500 posts her thoughts.

Just looked in the other episode folders and it seems I have jumped to conclusions as EG has the only review in Deliverance and Twin Destinies, my bad .

[jelgate]

I've also seen jelgate's reviews. After some time Rachel500 posts her thoughts.

I had to stop doing those. RL didn't allow it.

[garhkal]

(whom he wanted to keep in touch on a regular basis) .

It was funny watching them talk about keeping in contact.. at a yearly reunion.. Brings back memories of that school reunion mitchell went to in S9.

1. I don't get that chair anymore. Until Sabotage, I thought that the chair was a combination of the Head-Grabber(you know, the thing that gave O'Neill knowledge) and the chair in Atlantis, but now it can make people disappear?

It seems to be more akin to atlantis's control chair than a head grabber.

3.Why haven't the Blue Aliens reappeared(did only the 3 ships in Divergence make it to this galaxy)?

Perhaps they felt a little TOO whipped after last ep.

And how, pray tell, would they be tracking them now with Chloe all de-alien-ified?

As far as we know. Perhaps they retarded her outward appearance of changing.

The chair always seems an anomaly to me. But so did the repository of ancient knowledge. With the repository why did they make multiple ones? Surely it would have been more practical to have made one in a hidden location that could only be accessed by humans of a certain intelligence. Similar to the tests the Asgard put in place that SG1 worked out.

Redundancy for one. If you only had the 1, then all that knowledge would be lost if that planet/location was destroyed.
Also we had several races that were in the MW, so perhaps each repository was made for them, 1 for the nox, 1 for the tollan, one for us...

- At least this is a good way, of "once and for all", shut down the idea of dialling the gate in a star while recharging, to try and get back home. Perhaps now they can concentrate on surviving the mission, and really explore what's out there.

Though you can bet some would still keep hope they could try it again, say just AFTER passing through a star to recharge, but not while in it.

After all this time, all this adversity, to choose to stay and complete the mission, to support the others, changes the survivors into something more than simply stranded. The mission becomes theirs.

Yup. As we say in the navy.. they finally decided to take ownership of the mission..

In contrast to the choice to stay was Telford's opposition, which also felt completely natural. Opposition to the idea in general and to Rush in particular. This opposition would have carried a great deal of weight at one point and I believe that Telford would have had no problem at all using whatever force he could – by rank, threat or gun – to try to enforce his will, but no one seems to be giving him much heed. Greer sums it up succinctly with a “good luck with that”.

It was interesting, especially since he was a while back, more than willing to try and take over/assume command. Now all of a sudden he is gung ho about returning??

There is one other character – or perhaps a character trait – that has been changed for the better and that is found in Eli's simple guilt about the effects wrought by his creations. This is rare in a genre which has generally been very easy on the sometimes cataclysmic aftereffects of great scientists. Whole worlds, whole people, have been wiped out with scarcely a nod to the ideas that birthed the act so it is really something to see Eli take responsibility for the alternate destiny and inevitable death that could have ensued.

It does go to show at least the powers that be have taken measure of some of our comments about prior eps and instances where we have done bad things cause of our arrogance. And that someone so young felt that guilt for something even he could probably have not predicted, shows that he is more mature than some of us possibly give him credit for.

In thinking of twin destinies, I can't help but think of the initial lottery, back in season one. Like the lottery, there are two preselected to go, this time: Rush and Young, who had excluded themselves from the first lottery. Here they are first to stay. There is a set number they are reaching for (although they would happily take more). About to go into the star to their certain deaths, they are assembled once again in the gate room, being addressed from the stairs. But in this lottery, rather than being chosen to leave, they are choosing to stay.

It is a stark contrast, but one i think actually brings back those memories in everyone, about how some were more than willing to give up the chance of surviving (rush/young) for what they believe.