'Cloverdale' (205) General Discussion

[MattSilver 3k]

Woah. Go collective negative opinion fandom!

I freaking loved this episode, top to bottom. Brad Wright did a fantastic job, and since I'm about the only one around here who doesn't have a problem with Scott or Chloe, it was great, and even beyond that, everyone else got their little moment to shine, didn't they?

First off: real reality. I did prefer these scenes, no doubt, but I still dug the other ones too (Even though, you know, they weren't quite real, but the Cloverdale scenes were good character insights into Scott). For one thing, the scenes showed the dedication of the characters in simple ways - TJ wants to do anything to save her patient, Rush is practical about the whole thing (Cut off his arm), Eli is standing around and hoping like all hell another Riley doesn't happen, Young is worried about everything (In one of his less psychotic moments. Good for him.)... and Greer is totally awesome. Seriously, he and Matt's friendship is a great reflection on both of them, and yeah, I couldn't help but smile a little with Greer being the last one behind with Scott and Chloe.

Plus, you know, flamethrower and Kino sled for the motherflippin' win.

Eli/Chloe thing was great, and unexpected. Poor guy.

Now, to the Cloverdale verse: It was interesting to see how Scott saw everybody, and while some of it wasn't surprising, some of it kinda was. Young the dad was easy enough, and Young the not very perfect father with some kind of little weight to him was fun, though very subtle. Eli being Chloe's brother must've either been a rationalisation on Scott's part or he's oblivious to Eli's definitely non-platonic love for her. Greer the best man makes sense. Brody the bar owner, Volker the awkward pharmacist, Telford the cop - all little things that work well within the context of the story. Poor James- still pining, and even Scott's subconscious alternate self whatevs knows it. That scene was off all around. Park randomly appearing as Chloe's maid of honour was odd, though I honestly couldn't pin down who else would take up that role outside of TJ... and they excluded her from everything outside her one scene for one very obvious reason:

More than anything, I'd bet Scott sees TJ as a sister. If they had gone with that in the alternate world, the Young/TJ thing would've looked so so damn creepy...

Lol Rush. Justice of the Peace. Of course.

All in all, I think I'll add this to one of my favourite episodes of SGU. Nice helping of offworld hijinks, ensemble character fun, a bit of alien plant action, flamethrowers, and some character exploration on Scott that hadn't happened in a while. Plus, first big Eli/Chloe moment in a while. Cool.

[mparsons1981]

Well i have to admit that within 10 minutes of watching this episode on my laptop, i was turning away and started webbrowsing. I skipped the rest and just watched the last 2mins. Seemed like a real waste of time. I will listen to the podcast, and maybe give it another go, but frankly i doubt it at this point.

3/10 (only based on what i watched admittedly)

[Inquisitor]

The only thing that I liked about this episode is that it brought back what SGU has missed; the kawoosh.

[latvian_stargatefan]

YThe "hook" of the show is they are on a ship millions of years old on other side of the galaxy and what they keep doing? Going to earth... eating dinner... having hallucinations about going to earth... having hallucinations about eating dinner at earth... It's like if neil armstrong took his first step on the moon and said "Does anyone know what rerun of lassie is playing at 6 tomorrow?"

Why can't people get it already? These people are not Neil Armstrongs. They're like SGA fans forced to watch "Days of Our Lives" or sth like that. Except for Eli and Rush (and maybe some other scientists) they don't even want to be there and do that exploration stuff. They've constantly said THESE ARE THE WRONG PEOPLE and viewers still can't get it.

All most of these people want is to go back to Earth. Therefore when seeing dangerous stuff they'd rather blow it up than explore etc. Now, the problem of the show is that it's stuck too long in this "we're not space explorers/enthusiasts'' thing that sooner or later it'll start to feel boring. So here's hope that next few episodes will show that they finally have to start doing some of that space stuff.

What I really liked about this episode was the scenes on Earth. Why? Because we finally saw how the relationships should develop. It wasn't like SGA guys, it was still SGU type of unease e.g. Telford's comment about Greer as a soldier, Eli saying to Matt that "he's not too deep", Matt and James, Rush about "your old man" but these people felt generaly comfortable around each other and were more than just people who live in a town/on a ship- they were friends. For the future of the show, they should do more of this stuff- people becoming friends but not losing the fact they're still clearly not heroes. The planet stuff wasn't bad and I didn't guess what Chloe was doing when she approached the alien plant (maybe because I don't treat every tv show like it's Agatha Christie novel and I should from the first minute in try to guess all the things what'll happen). A first when she stretched out her hand, I thought she maybe tries to do something to that plant mentally using her alien DNA but later, of course, it was clear to me too).

This episode, of course, was similar to SG1s "The Changeling", SGAs "Home" and "Real World". For me, "The Changeling" is possibly the only episode that is as good as "Cloverdale" for the reason that in these episodes, the story was created because of characters, not because of the plot. In both Atlantis cases, we saw those flashbacks to another reality just because the plot of the particular episode or season arc asked for them, they had almost zero relevance in real life after the episodes and were TRUE FILLER in the truest sense of the word. That was different with ''The Changeling" and "Cloverdale" whose another reality was based deeply into characters' (Teal'c and Matt) emotions.

Now, many may say that "we already knew that" or "we already knew this" but does it really matter? We already knew that Matt will be ok after the episode or Teal'c will be back in SG1 after "The Changeling". The thing (at least for me) is not what the plot is or is there an actual plot but HOW IT'S EXECUTED. You can tell the simplest of story- Avatar, SGAs "Eye/Storm" but all that matters is execution. If you do it well, be it action, exploration, drama or ahatever, you get a praise from me. If you do it ''by the numbers'' and just for the sake of doing you get none... I think that this episode's ''filler'' managed to do more than simple filler- it showed what the future direction with the dynamics of the crew should be, it solidified again the characters' relationships to each other, especially on the Matt + Chloe front and also contributed to the major story arc with alien pathogen in the blood of now both Chloe and Matt. It wasn't the best but certainly wasn't the worst episode either- solid 8/10, better than Intervention and Pathogen of this season but still worse than two "As"...

[Eternal Density]

Wow, now that was a great episode! I really enjoyed it
Even though Matt's dream was just a dream it didn't feel pointless to me, plus it was fun to see the characters stuck in various different roles.
And when Greer said that line about telling Eli to keep the camera out of his face I suddenly realised the Eli+Kino / Eli+Camera parallel (yeah I'm slow but I wasn't looking for it).

Chloe seems stronger this season, more forceful rather than using what I think of as her 'whiny voice'. That's a good improvement.
I quite liked having Justice Rush talking over the top of the blood transfusion. Nicely put together.

Also, at first I wondered whether it was possible that the growth on Matt was causing him to tap into an alternate reality or something (hey, it could still be true, lol). Just a random theory. Plus I managed to have a tiny tiny doubt that Matt might not actually survive, which helped sell the urgency for me.
Officer Telford FTW!

[escyos]

Im watching it right now, its almost over and I LOVED it! absolutely awesome episode!

[latvian_stargatefan]

Even though Matt's dream was just a dream it didn't feel pointless to me, plus it was fun to see the characters stuck in various different roles.

Yeah, that's the bit I don't get when people tell that this was boring stuff... Come on! Evil aliens or nanites in SGAs "Real World" (well, maybe not that much still the baddie was RDA ) or "Home" was boring stuff. This so called filler wasn't made up- the characters were the same, like the representations of them in Matt's mind and we even got some great bits like Telford tellig him basically about the brainwash he lived through or Eli's ''you're not that deep''

[Eternal Density]

Im watching it right now, its almost over and I LOVED it! absolutely awesome episode!

This! I'm a little disheartened by all the negativity because it doesn't match what I experienced at all! Pity.

[Rocksy]

balderdash.

Worst Episode Ever.

[Eternal Density]

Apparently "not directly affecting the main plot of the real world" = "pointless and boring" for many people. Remember, it's actually all equally fictional

[edit] I also like that they didn't try to juggle any other ship goings on, Earth visits, or Lucian Alliance stuff. This was all off-world action! Now with over 9000% more KAWOOSH!

[Nadji]

It felt a little uncomfortable in the alternate setting, I had a cringe moment at the bachelor party with Lt. James. But also some quality moments (Greers' passion and Elis' good bye, to name a couple) were enjoyable.

I was not a fan of The Changeling and this reminded me of that episode. Cloverdale was a decent 'middle of the road' ep. I do believe that it's the lowest point so far, in a very strong season.

[timmciglobal]

Why can't people get it already? These people are not Neil Armstrongs. They're like SGA fans forced to watch "Days of Our Lives" or sth like that. Except for Eli and Rush (and maybe some other scientists) they don't even want to be there and do that exploration stuff. They've constantly said THESE ARE THE WRONG PEOPLE and viewers still can't get it.

Then I guess they aren't the "right people" to be entertaining me. Guess what, the "wrong people" on the moon would still of looked around and said "Wow..." they wouldn't of given a **** about the reruns.

This tired excuse of "wrong people, wrong people, WRONG PEOPLE" is OLD. Guess what? No one wants to watch a show about how the wrong people do the wrong thing all the time. BSG was a show about the "wrong people" to be the surviors of the 12 collonies... they wern't the best of the best top 50K anywhere with the latest equipment but the shows writers didn't become a crutch to do the wrong thing and not do anything interesting because "they are the wrong people."

Tim

[Eternal Density]

A lot of people in this thread seem to be the wrong ones to entertain me too. But that's purely my fault for being weird enough to enjoy the episode.

Anyhow, I was just flipping back through it and noticed (remember, I avoided spoilers) that the Cloverdale theatre (which seems to be called Clova) is The Talon! Does that count as a special guest star?

[AscendedThor]

How can Chloe donate blood to Scott ??!?!?!
Matching a donor's blood type and a patient's blood is critical in transfusions.
If someone with type A blood receives type B, he may have a severe hemolytic reaction.
This can destroy many of his red cells and quickly kill him.
While blood-typing and cross matching are now routine, errors do occur. Every year people die of hemolytic reactions

[JustAnotherVoice]

The story was a bit "meh", but the performances were probably amongst the best that filler episodes have to offer. You can tell when the cast phone in their performances for filler episodes and when they actually try. This episode was the latter.

Carlyle in the B story was as close to perfect as it could get, in one man's opinion. It was refreshing to see Ferreira not playing an angry Young too.