'Justice' (110) General Discussion

[DigiFluid]

^^ I'm not sure how anyone can say that, to be honest. The amount we know about SGU characters is almost unprecedented as far as Stargate is concerned.

[MediaSavant]

There was so much good character stuff in this. It's clear that at this stage, we still had a lot more to know about these people.

The biggest surprise was how far Young would go. In the first part of the episode, he cooperated fully with the investigation and did the right thing. But, as we've slowly learned, a cool exterior seems to hide an explosive temper. While justice followed an organized process in the beginning, Young essentially took justice into his own hands by essentially sentencing Rush to death with no investigation or trial. The title "Justice" is certainly apt for the episode.

But, I have to wonder how much the situation played into that. Clearly, there was little time left to get back to the gate. How pre-meditated was Young's action of leaving Rush behind? At the same time, Young was pretty cool and calculating at the end of the episode at covering up his actions. It's a lot to ponder during the break.

Eli certainly is a bit of a co-conspirator in this and I have to wonder what will be going through his head in regards to what Young asked him to do. Will he begin to suspect what really happened on the planet? Young has tended to treat Eli with a lot of respect in terms of giving him responsibility that Eli never experienced in his life. Eli seems to have responded to that treatment by trusting Young a bit more than Rush. Remember the scene in a previous episode in which Rush chided Eli for working on Young's project and not his. I look forward to seeing where this all leads Eli.

I'm so glad we got to see Chloe in a different light.

Greer continues to be an awesome character. The chair continues to be a mystery, but for how long?

The second half of the season should be very interesting.

[EvilSpaceAlien]

THIS episode was called the mid-season episode.



Click on the source link above for more details. Justice was the mid-season finale...and it was no cliffhanger.

But it wasn't originally intended to be the mid-season finale. "Space" was supposed to be episode 10, but since "Fire" was split into "Darkness" and "Light" it ended up as episode 11 instead.

I think "Justice" did a good job considering that it wasn't intended to be the mid-season finale.

No cliffhanger??? Rush being marooned on that planet wasn't a cliffhanger? Huh.
It may not have been one of the best cliffhangers, but it was still a cliffhanger in my opinion.

[LtColCarter]

^^ I'm not sure how anyone can say that, to be honest. The amount we know about SGU characters is almost unprecedented as far as Stargate is concerned.

But it wasn't originally intended to be the mid-season finale. "Space" was supposed to be episode 10, but since "Fire" was split into "Darkness" and "Light" it ended up as episode 11 instead.

I think "Justice" did a good job considering that it wasn't intended to be the mid-season finale.

No cliffhanger??? Rush being marooned on that planet wasn't a cliffhanger? Huh.
It may not have been one of the best cliffhangers, but it was still a cliffhanger in my opinion.

Since my comment would be the same to both of you, I decided to combine the response. We're all entitled to our own opinions. To me, the characters seem very superficial. With the episodes show, SGU hasn't had that "I need to see" it feel that the two other SG series had. I don't know why, but it just doesn't...like I said in a pervious post...it is lacking something.

[Lucian]

I don't know if Rush will 'fix' the ship, I doubt it... he'll either encouter an alien species or something else which I will discuss in a minute.

I do think that in the system where Rush is, a system with a dozen planets with gate technology, there can be some other surprises around for Rush to find out. (PS. Rush does say there's a dozen planets with not a single indication of advanced technology "up until now", in this episode...) So there's a chance for him to find something other than a rusty ship. That being said, keep in mind the following:

Spoiler:

NEW! November 10 - When will we know more about the alien pod that detached from the Destiny at the end of "Air, Part 3?" Writer-producer Joseph Mallozzi gives this answer: "You will -- in about four episodes." This was following the broadcast of episode 107, meaning viewers should see this story continue in the mid-season two-parter.

The episode of "Space"

Spoiler:

will probably tell us about the pod. IF there is an alien species capable of space travel in this part of the universe, it might have retrieved the pod, and even Kiva from the Lucian Alliance on board of it . With Rush's help, a pod can probably locate its place of 'origin' in other words, the Destiny.

Although we don't get to see *Spoiler for "Subversion":

Spoiler:

Kiva until "Subversion", the next episode will probably give us a clue on how they got to follow The Destiny's crew into this part of the universe.

I'm thinking that Kiva and her crew, once on their own, did something, stole some tech, anything, to piss off another alien race. Enough for those Aliens to start considering anything that has a similar background of origin to the Destiny's pod the thiefs or terrorists used to get in contact with these 'aliens' to be further percieved as a 'threat'; thinking the Destiny and its crew to part of the same gang as the Lucian Alliance people who did whatever bad deed that made the Alien angry.

Ofcourse, when the Destiny gets shot at without any reason, it's only natural for them to shoot back. Rush will probably be detained and interrogated, but he won't know for what reason that will happen. Reason's which will probably be revealed in the final episodes of this season (reasons that have to do with Kiva)

*Spoilers for "Space " and "Divided"

Spoiler:

Rush during interrogation will be ask about the Ancient's Technology in the pod. He will be able to pinpoint the Destiny's location and use that to relay the information to his captors. With that, he'll probably hop back a ride back home, somehow. Which then lead's us to the end of eps Space and the beginning of "Divided". A division in the crew between Young and Rush?

PS. I think Eli at the end of Justice was to scared to do anything else than take the drive... He know's what Young did, or at least he suspects, and if you're smart, and you suspect someone is a killer, you don't flaunt it or dare to tell him to his face. You just make sure you keep a copy of whatever will be on that hardrive as well... just in case.

[Anon]

Since my comment would be the same to both of you, I decided to combine the response. We're all entitled to our own opinions. To me, the characters seem very superficial. With the episodes show, SGU hasn't had that "I need to see" it feel that the two other SG series had. I don't know why, but it just doesn't...like I said in a pervious post...it is lacking something.

maybe a bad guy, excluding rush and young (well now he is)

[LtColCarter]

maybe a bad guy, excluding rush and young (well now he is)

It could be.

[Anon]

It could be.

it could also be the fact that there is not much off world time.

[Ekiel]

Regarding spoilers:

Yes, anything not established in already aired episodes should be spoiler-tagged.
Spoilers are just impolite no matter how small. What is obvious to you might not be to others.

BTW it would be great if people could try to define their spoilers a little. I've clicked on spoilers expecting minor revelations and receiving a big one. It goes the other way too.
So maybe do something like that if you feel like it:

Regarding Young's alien pregnancy (up to 7x12):

Spoiler:

Twins

Regarding the episode:

I predicted what really happened when they found the gun.
From the beginning murder just didn't feel right so someone finding the gun and framing Young was the most logical assumption for me.
And Rush was not a bad bet for that. But I wasn't sure.

What I didn't like was that noone asked for Young's motive. Why kill someone who you have (as a commanding officer) virtually complete power over. You can lock him (especially him) up indefinitely. You can basically order him to death.
At the very least this should have raised doubts in some people. And if he was framed there is still a murderer running around.

Apart from those points I thought the episode was good.
I liked the absense of romance and on-screen use of the stones.
They actually used the chair and there I was thinking they would drag that out a few more episodes.
The ending was just great and left me wanting to see the next episodes right now.

So in conclusion the episode was enjoyable and at least as good as "Time" if not better.
SGU is actually starting to drag me in.

[Skydiver]

there's not much of a cliffhanger because we know that carlyle is signed for the whole season and he's mentioned in later season episodes, so him dying isn't a possibility

the only 'suspense' is how does he get back to the destiny and what's the fallout?

[s09119]

Regarding spoilers:

Yes, anything not established in already aired episodes should be spoiler-tagged.
Spoilers are just impolite no matter how small. What is obvious to you might not be to others.

BTW it would be great if people could try to define their spoilers a little. I've clicked on spoilers expecting minor revelations and receiving a big one. It goes the other way too.
So maybe do something like that if you feel like it:

Regarding Young's alien pregnancy (up to 7x12):

Spoiler:

Twins

Regarding the episode:

I predicted what really happened when they found the gun.
From the beginning murder just didn't feel right so someone finding the gun and framing Young was the most logical assumption for me.
And Rush was not a bad bet for that. But I wasn't sure.

What I didn't like was that noone asked for Young's motive. Why kill someone who you have (as a commanding officer) virtually complete power over. You can lock him (especially him) up indefinitely. You can basically order him to death.
At the very least this should have raised doubts in some people. And if he was framed there is still a murderer running around.

Apart from those points I thought the episode was good.
I liked the absense of romance and on-screen use of the stones.
They actually used the chair and there I was thinking they would drag that out a few more episodes.
The ending was just great and left me wanting to see the next episodes right now.

So in conclusion the episode was enjoyable and at least as good as "Time" if not better.
SGU is actually starting to drag me in.

I like how after your rant on how spoilers are needed, you say

Spoiler:

Young's alien pregnancy

WHAT!? I've never even heard of that, and if whatever's in those tags is true (I didn't read it), you just spoiled something for me. Thanks.

[Coronach]

I like how after your rant on how spoilers are needed, you say

Spoiler:

Young's alien pregnancy

WHAT!? I've never even heard of that, and if whatever's in those tags is true (I didn't read it), you just spoiled something for me. Thanks.

I actually think that's a joke. Perhaps intentionally ironic as well. For example, "(up to 7x12)" kinda gave it away for me, considering that would translate to "Season 7, episode 12".

The poster makes a good point about spoilers though. Very often, you'll see a thread title like:

"OMG, question about Chloe marrying the intergalactic space lord!!! *Spoilers*". Obviously, the damage is already done

[Lucian]

* See previous post .
PS. I think Eli at the end of Justice was to scared to do anything else than take the drive... He know's what Young did, or at least he suspects, and if you're smart, and you suspect someone is a killer, you don't flaunt it or dare to tell him to his face. You just make sure you keep a copy of whatever will be on that hardrive as well... just in case.

[EvilSpaceAlien]

I like how after your rant on how spoilers are needed, you say

Spoiler:

Young's alien pregnancy

WHAT!? I've never even heard of that, and if whatever's in those tags is true (I didn't read it), you just spoiled something for me. Thanks.

I thought everyone knew that he was going to have twins.
They will also mature at the same rate as Adria.
One of them will mysteriously disappear and then return as villain that will seduce Rush into giving her the access codes for the death ray.

[Kaiphantom]

I have to say, I liked this episode. The last few weren't high on my list, but this restored my faith. Some people said it may have been predictable, but I didn't find it to be. Even knowing about a suicide and a death in this episode, it could have been someone else, and Spencer would have come up as the first suspect.

Now onto the characters:

Young - Handled himself well for most of the episode, with his "above board, no lying to make things worse" attitude. Then he throws that all out the window when he attacks Rush and condemns him to death. Two wrongs don't make a right, Colonel, and Rush's words did strike true: He didn't have what it would take to make the hard decisions. Here's hoping you improve in the second half, as you've shown us promise, but also snatched that hope away.

Rush - I've said it before, and I'll say it again: cold, cruel logic. The chair could have very well been the key (and still might be), and it's rational to allow one person to test it out. Young should have at least allowed volunteers. NOTE: I am not saying Rush was emotionally right to frame Young, just that I can understand, if not agree. I wouldn't have done the same, but then again, there's a lot of pressure to get control of the ship, repair it, and get people home. Now, does he fix the ship, or do the alien owners come for him?

Eli - His main weakness has been his naivety. I can understand it, since I've been there. With time, I've turned from an Eli into a Rush, heh. So we'll see how this affects him, and whether he'll decide to start playing politics or continue to stick to the straight truth. He does need to grow a bit more of a backbone (all nerds tend to go through this). It almost seemed a bit too contrived that he found the gun, then again, he could really just be too smart for his own good.

Chloe - A bit better, but not there yet. She showed some promise standing up to Wray, and her speech about due process, but then she disappears shortly thereafter? Where went her convictions for finding the truth? Why so accepting of a backroom deal? I hope she has more use than just coming up when there is a murder on board, else she's gonna end up right back where she started. But she did show a bit of gumption, so maybe she won't go totally to pieces when Scott breaks up with her. My criticism of her hasn't really been "she needs a use," but more of a "she needs some character growth." She got a bit of the former this time, and maybe a bit of the latter. Time will tell.

Scott - Speaking of him, on one hand I can admire him for his loyalty. But on the other, he still needs to learn some things from Young. No matter how much you believe otherwise, you have to treat everyone equal. You can't give special treatment to people based on feelings (Ahem, Chloe). He was way too quick to say "done, let's move on" when searching Young's quarters.

Wray - Previous episodes hinted that she might start her own faction, or grab for power, and she went for it now. It was more obvious that she wanted leadership for herself (or maybe just thought she could do better), but there is props for stepping down gracefully. But bad move for taking Greer and some marines off the duty list. You made yourself an enemy, and that's not too smart.

Greer - loving the man with the sweet potato thing. He's been in the spot of being unjustly accused, but he does need to learn to cool it and follow protocol. Although I agree his personality is such that people need to respect him and treat him fairly first, before he'll reciprocate.

Franklin - Did he sit in the chair by his own decision? Or did Rush somehow force or convince him to? Hopefully we'll find out. I'm assuming the former for now.

Stones - one minor mention, good. Still have them, bad. The big issue continues to go unanswered.

Overall, I liked the pacing and direction. Good cliffhanger suspense for what will happen to Rush, and how Eli will respond to Young and Rush's actions.