Young has psychologically crumbled and needs be removed from command.

[jelgate]

Well ... yes. Just the same as anyone else, although it's notable that Young himself said, Listen to me: the civilians aboard this ship didn't try to take over because they thought I was doing a bang-up job. I get that.'

I know its just thier is no room for debate when you go there. Its all up to interpertation that really isn't right or wrong

[EllieVee]

Purely subjective and fully opinionated.

Well ... yes. Just the same as anyone else, although it's notable that Young himself said, Listen to me: the civilians aboard this ship didn't try to take over because they thought I was doing a bang-up job. I get that.'

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Kai,

I'm sorry, but no. You're trying the argument "It's not his fault! It's because of everyone else!" and that won't work, because we are discussing purely *HIS* decisions. You or I could make much better decisions were we in his place, and you know it. Especially when his decisions go directly against military mindset training. It's like he doesn't recall his training at all, when the whole point of it is to drill it into recruits so thoroughly they don't forget.

It's like him forgetting how to fire a gun. It just plain shouldn't happen, and you'd rightly call him an idiot if he forgot how.

And jelgate, as we've proved, SGU is a different type of show than SGA and SG-1. Comparisons can't be made very well.

That's not what I'm saying. Young has clearly made mistakes. I'm saying in the prior incarnations they commanders had hand picked teams. Young doesn't have that luxury. As such while Young has made mistakes it's not as though he's working with the A-listers who've been training together for this particular mission for months or years. His administration is, of necessity, much more ad hoc than it would have been on SG-1 or SGA.

Young bears direct responsibility for his actions. However, those actions aren't the cause of all their troubles.

[jelgate]

Well, he hasn't been accommodating at all so perhaps he should find a middle ground.

Purely subjective and fully opinionated.

[EllieVee]

Thier is too much at stake and too much danger to be playing diplomat to make sure everyone is happy. Their just isn't time for that

Well, he hasn't been accommodating at all so perhaps he should find a middle ground.

[jelgate]

If anything he should be more accommodating than he is given the majority of people shouldn't be there. He shouldn't be playing the heavy.

Thier is too much at stake and too much danger to be playing diplomat to make sure everyone is happy. Their just isn't time for that

[EllieVee]

Then shouldn't he be given more leeway in his decision making choices then the harsher criticism in comparassion to past SG leaders?

If anything he should be more accommodating than he is given the majority of people shouldn't be there. He shouldn't be playing the heavy.

[Kaiphantom]

It's not a fair comparassion. Every other SG incarnation had hand picked teams specially selected to do the job they did. Young is stuck with everyone who came through the Gate to Destiny. Most of whom were not supposed to be on the expedition. As such the discord and difficulty he has faced should not be entirely attributed to his command abilities.

I'm sorry, but no. You're trying the argument "It's not his fault! It's because of everyone else!" and that won't work, because we are discussing purely *HIS* decisions. You or I could make much better decisions were we in his place, and you know it. Especially when his decisions go directly against military mindset training. It's like he doesn't recall his training at all, when the whole point of it is to drill it into recruits so thoroughly they don't forget.

It's like him forgetting how to fire a gun. It just plain shouldn't happen, and you'd rightly call him an idiot if he forgot how.

And jelgate, as we've proved, SGU is a different type of show than SGA and SG-1. Comparisons can't be made very well.

[jelgate]

jelgate,



Yes. That's my point. In the other thread I pointed out he's made mistakes but while other's may have avoided his mistakes it's unlikely they would have avoided any mistakes with this group of people.

Then we part ways because I was orginally trying to show the mistakes Young has made are not very different from the ones that past leaders of Stargate have made. Excluding Justice of course

[Blackhole]

jelgate,

It's not a fair comparassion. Every other SG incarnation had hand picked teams specially selected to do the job they did. Young is stuck with everyone who came through the Gate to Destiny. Most of whom were not supposed to be on the expedition. As such the discord and difficulty he has faced should not be entirely attributed to his command abilities.

A fair statement. I think his command decisions have been good overall and only went downhill over the last two episodes.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

jelgate,

Then shouldn't he be given more leeway in his decision making choices then the harsher criticism in comparassion to past SG leaders?

Yes. That's my point. In the other thread I pointed out he's made mistakes but while other's may have avoided his mistakes it's unlikely they would have avoided any mistakes with this group of people.

[jelgate]

jelgate,



It's not a fair comparassion. Every other SG incarnation had hand picked teams specially selected to do the job they did. Young is stuck with everyone who came through the Gate to Destiny. Most of whom were not supposed to be on the expedition. As such the discord and difficulty he has faced should not be entirely attributed to his command abilities.

Then shouldn't he be given more leeway in his decision making choices then the harsher criticism in comparassion to past SG leaders?

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

jelgate,

Because when equating Young's comptence in comparassion to other Stargate leader they need to have the same criteria to be a fair comparassion

It's not a fair comparassion. Every other SG incarnation had hand picked teams specially selected to do the job they did. Young is stuck with everyone who came through the Gate to Destiny. Most of whom were not supposed to be on the expedition. As such the discord and difficulty he has faced should not be entirely attributed to his command abilities.

[Kaiphantom]

maybe it wasn't really funny the first time either?
If that's the measure of what we should differently about the series, this argument isn't working for me.

Regardless of whether you found it funny or not, the goal of the episode was humor, so things have to be judged in that light. Just like SGU needs to be judged in the tone of it's own light.

That wasn't Young's fault. It was just really bad luck that the radiation beam decided to strike the beam at that crucial moment.

I'll partially give that to you, but he still could have gone through with it. He ordered people not to shoot. Once again, his bad call ended up getting someone killed with nothing to show for it. I mean, if you're gonna lose someone either way, at least take the action that's going to get you something.

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

That wasn't Young's fault. It was just really bad luck that the radiation beam decided to strike the beam at that crucial moment.

*snorks* Come on, we all know Young can control something as piddly as a silly little star
</sarcasm>