My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie (spec and spoilers)

[Frostfox]

Dealing with the ship wars for way too long, i can understand shippers wanting something overt, at the same time i can see why others don't' want it.

For shippers, some have been called liars to their faces for years because they are interpreting things the way they want to see them (ie seeing a scene as a shippy moment) while those that don't' like the pairing will just as vehemently argue 'no, it didn't mean that, it meant this......'

They are very welcome to interpret SG1 any way they want. Just as the rest of us are interpreting what we see on screen. They aren't lying, just watching the show with a different emphasis.

After 10+ years of being told that they're wrong, liars, stupid, juvenile, etc, i can see why they want the confirmation. Why they want to get something undeniable to say 'see!!!!!!'

The relationship is wrong, stupid and juvenile, not the fans.

I must confess I don't understand the need for canon confirmation, but then, as a slash fan, canon is something we adapt to our purposes, we aren't ruled by it.. They can marry Sam and Jack in the gate room, it won't make an iota of difference to how many fans slash SG1, they won't all go, 'Oh, look it's canon, S/J are in a relationship, let's not write/vid/photoshop any more slash.' If anything, the amount of slash would explode as all the creators 'set things right' - that's what happens in other fandoms, SG1 will be the same. Slash happens, has, always will.

And, for those that simply hate the ship and hate 'losing', i can see why they don't want to see that. Just as i can see those that simply don't' like the ship not wanting an angle to overtake the show. I can understand the concern that movie 3 (IF it EVER gets made) might be the grand romance ending in a wedding...oh yeah, daniel and teal'c are there too....(honestly, i don't think it'll be that way)

I don't see it as those of us who don't like the relationship as 'losing' if they bring it up again, I see it as characters I care for 'losing'. I don't see the relationship as adding to the show, I can't think of any scene I found stronger because of S/J, indeed, it seriously weakened some key moments (making the hug in 'Heroes' about Sam and Jack rather than about Sam and Janet and Cassie is the one which really hurt, I never forgave TPTB for that). So I see it as a net loss to the show, rather than a net gain.

I think, IF the writers do - for once - follow through and do what they're saying they're gonna do, and actually produce something that they say is shippy - and the viewers agree - it's gonna be something vague.

it'll be sam and jack wearing rings, it'll be the movie starting with two people on a dock answering the phone, getting called back to colorado, it'll be a quip about one character being tired, then the other being tired and mmhm, wonder how come both of them had a sleepless night last night....or it'd be someone saying 'colonel o'neill', jack responds and the person says 'no, her'. or there'll be a wedding photo on jack's desk.

and that's likely all it'll be. I will be astonishingly shocked if there's a wedding or 3 minute long declaration of love.

I know some shippers will never be happy unless there is something long and overt...but I think a lot of them will be happy with something simple but undeniable. something that can't be interpreted any other way than 'they're together'. something that they cant' be called liars or stupid or juvenile for seeing. (of course, there are some anti-ship fans that will always hate and deny it....so be it.) there are passionate feelings on all sides.

I think, whatever happens, it'll be something simple but undeniable. Something that isn't vague like 'i'm dating a guy in washington'.

I still think the biggest 'If' is if the film gets made at all, every day that passes makes it less and less likely, or less and less likely with the current writers/producers/directors.

FF

[Tachyon]

Well, if you ain't a shipper, of course you don't understand the need for canon confirmation for that particular relationship. It's a shippers' thing, isn't it?

I am into S/J, yet my biggest hope is to see another SG-1 movie featuring Jack at least in some extent, with S/J confirmation or not. Seasons nine and ten don't really work for me, so if Jack ain't there, I don't know if I will even watch the movie at all. So that's my first priority, hypothetical confirmations come after that.

[hedwig]

Well, if you ain't a shipper, of course you don't understand the need for canon confirmation for that particular relationship. It's a shippers' thing, isn't it?

I am into S/J, yet my biggest hope is to see another SG-1 movie featuring Jack at least in some extent, with S/J confirmation or not. Seasons nine and ten don't really work for me, so if Jack ain't there, I don't know if I will even watch the movie at all. So that's my first priority, hypothetical confirmations come after that.

You're in luck if the writers stick to what they said about the 3rd movie when it was being talked about so much, because Brad Wright said it was supposed to be "Jack-centric", which I take to mean the movie will be focussed more on Jack. He also said he wanted the 3rd movie to have the original SG1 team members, so I'm assuming that means Sam, Daniel and Teal'c will be in it a fair amount as well. And his comment about there being a "shall we say romantic scene" suggests there will be perhaps a small Sam and Jack-type bit in it as well, but nothing over the top or anything that takes away from whatever the rest of the movie is about.

[flynn1959]

Well, if you ain't a shipper, of course you don't understand the need for canon confirmation for that particular relationship. It's a shippers' thing, isn't it?

I am into S/J, yet my biggest hope is to see another SG-1 movie featuring Jack at least in some extent, with S/J confirmation or not. Seasons nine and ten don't really work for me, so if Jack ain't there, I don't know if I will even watch the movie at all. So that's my first priority, hypothetical confirmations come after that.

It seems to be a Sam/Jack shipper thing and not a shipper thing in general.

I too am a shipper, J/D and D/V to name but two or the pairings I consider myself a fan of but I have never felt the need to call for canon confirmation, even though I guess in the case of D/V TPTB have already given us that one. I just feel that ship of any kind between any characters belongs in the minds of the fans and fan fiction.

I want to see Jack in the next movie, the Jack of old, I don't mind seeing Sam a little either but most of all I want to see ALL of the characters working together as a team, and not ahve two of htem off making goo - goo eyes at each other whilst being filmed through a grease covered lens as violins screech in the background.

[Frostfox]

It seems to be a Sam/Jack shipper thing and not a shipper thing in general.

I too am a shipper, J/D and D/V to name but two or the pairings I consider myself a fan of but I have never felt the need to call for canon confirmation, even though I guess in the case of D/V TPTB have already given us that one. I just feel that ship of any kind between any characters belongs in the minds of the fans and fan fiction.

I want to see Jack in the next movie, the Jack of old, I don't mind seeing Sam a little either but most of all I want to see ALL of the characters working together as a team, and not ahve two of htem off making goo - goo eyes at each other whilst being filmed through a grease covered lens as violins screech in the background.

I'm not much interested in a Jack-centric film (Daniel and Sam interest me more, these days) but Jack, fully part of the team would interest me a lot (did the Jack from our timeline even speak to Daniel or Teal'c in Continuum? I don't think he did, you know). I also really want to see Sam commanding her spaceship.

FF

[Aragon101]

I have no doubt they'll try something. However I think the instant they try something "Overt" it'll be like tripping at teh top of the CN Tower's stairs and not having the agility to grab a hold of the handle bar.

I've already accepted that TPTB want Sam/Jack even more than the shippers do. Look at all the evidence of the universe itself pushing Sam and Jack together and dare I say, 'fate' itself. I have no doubt in my mind that there will be a "confirmation" scene if there's a 3rd movie (which everyday grows a dimmer and dimmer prospect)

One just needs to look to Joe Mallozi's comments on "Threads". He basically confirmed it there. And there's no amount of fan criticism, flying monkeys, or even ambiguity to change that.

If its there, it's there, and Sam/Jack have joined Riker and Troi and Leela and Fry (although Leela and Fry was handled quite well despite things) as "We're gonna wait till the last possible moment to give you what you want!"

Am i going to enjoy it? I'd rather watch SGU. Is it likely? Yeah i'd say so.

[majorsal]

I think, IF the writers do - for once - follow through and do what they're saying they're gonna do, and actually produce something that they say is shippy - and the viewers agree - it's gonna be something vague.

it'll be sam and jack wearing rings, it'll be the movie starting with two people on a dock answering the phone, getting called back to colorado, it'll be a quip about one character being tired, then the other being tired and mmhm, wonder how come both of them had a sleepless night last night....or it'd be someone saying 'colonel o'neill', jack responds and the person says 'no, her'. or there'll be a wedding photo on jack's desk.

(snipped)

I know some shippers will never be happy unless there is something long and overt...but I think a lot of them will be happy with something simple but undeniable. something that can't be interpreted any other way than 'they're together'. something that they cant' be called liars or stupid or juvenile for seeing. (of course, there are some anti-ship fans that will always hate and deny it....so be it.) there are passionate feelings on all sides.

I think, whatever happens, it'll be something simple but undeniable. Something that isn't vague like 'i'm dating a guy in washington'.

You're in luck if the writers stick to what they said about the 3rd movie when it was being talked about so much, because Brad Wright said it was supposed to be "Jack-centric", which I take to mean the movie will be focussed more on Jack. He also said he wanted the 3rd movie to have the original SG1 team members, so I'm assuming that means Sam, Daniel and Teal'c will be in it a fair amount as well. And his comment about there being a "shall we say romantic scene" suggests there will be perhaps a small Sam and Jack-type bit in it as well, but nothing over the top or anything that takes away from whatever the rest of the movie is about.

personally, i DO want big romancy and sexy scenes , but i'll be greatly happy if there's a kiss.

but i also don't think it'll be anything *big*. the things that skydiver said is the way i think it'll go. (a kiss would be icing on the cake )

taking away all the ship wars, and the years i've been involved in it... i just want to see that these two ppl, that had been fighting falling for each other, that have been adhering to the restrictions put upon them... i just want to see their happy ending.

this is a ship the writers created, did, and continued (not something simply 'wanted' by some fans). it's an over decade long storyline, and one that i *so* hope has a happy ending.

i sooooo hope.

[kymeric]

Married and raising Cassie and Sams preggo imho.

[majorsal]

married and raising cassie and sams preggo imho.

[Tachyon]

this is a ship the writers created, did, and continued (not something simply 'wanted' by some fans). it's an over decade long storyline, and one that i *so* hope has a happy ending.

True. And TPTB acknowledge that as well. I don't care which was first - fans who saw the chemistry between the two, or the writers who provided episodes where S/J was more than hinted. Heck - if TPTB even tried to give us confirmation in Atlantis episode (Trio), then S/J is not insignificant for the writers, nor is the S/J fanbase. S/J fandom is more than some tiny inner circle where shippers mutter to each other shippers' secrets in a dark corner of the internet.

[Skydiver]

The one thing that strikes me about this....some hate the ship, others don't.

but, you know, no one person's or group's preferences are any more 'right' than another's.

If you're going to allow the presence or absence of confirmation to 'ruin the movie for me'....that's your problem.

They're gonna do what they're gonna do. And, no matter what they do, someone will be ticked off. Because it's 'there', because it's 'too shippy', because it's 'not shippy enough' because it's 'not there'.....literally those will be the complaints no matter what they do.

There is no one 'perfect' way to end it. There is no singular 'right' way to end it.

I see so many people arguing with the passion that seems to indicate that this inclusion/non-inclusion of ship will be a personal insult to them, that it'll keep them awake at night, that they'll be unforgivably insulted and hurt...and I just shake my head.

NONE of us are right, and NONE of us are wrong. And no matter what they do, someone will hate it. we are, by and large, 'victims' of whatever games TPTB want to play.

And they're gonna do: whatever they want to do, whatever the actors consent to doing, whatever the network will let them do, not necessarily in that order.

What they won't do is do something just to personally tweak off any single segment of the fandom, or to please any single segment of the fandom.

[flynn1959]

Married and raising Cassie and Sams preggo imho.

Um .. wouldn't Cassie be in her twenties now?

[flynn1959]

The one thing that strikes me about this....some hate the ship, others don't.

but, you know, no one person's or group's preferences are any more 'right' than another's.

If you're going to allow the presence or absence of confirmation to 'ruin the movie for me'....that's your problem.

They're gonna do what they're gonna do. And, no matter what they do, someone will be ticked off. Because it's 'there', because it's 'too shippy', because it's 'not shippy enough' because it's 'not there'.....literally those will be the complaints no matter what they do.

There is no one 'perfect' way to end it. There is no singular 'right' way to end it.

I see so many people arguing with the passion that seems to indicate that this inclusion/non-inclusion of ship will be a personal insult to them, that it'll keep them awake at night, that they'll be unforgivably insulted and hurt...and I just shake my head.

NONE of us are right, and NONE of us are wrong. And no matter what they do, someone will hate it. we are, by and large, 'victims' of whatever games TPTB want to play.

And they're gonna do: whatever they want to do, whatever the actors consent to doing, whatever the network will let them do, not necessarily in that order.

What they won't do is do something just to personally tweak off any single segment of the fandom, or to please any single segment of the fandom.

Why does it need to be ended? It, meaning Sam and Jack ship, or any of the other ships, doesn't have to be in the movie at all. That way those that see it and those that don't see it can carry on just as they are.

I fail to see how anyone rational could take the inclusion, or exclusion, of something, ANYTHING in a movie as a person insult!!! I mean, come on, its only a bit of fun and fictional fun at that. I know some people get a touch passionate about Stargate but deep down I think we all know its not really a serious matter. Deep down 99% of people are rational.

[Skydiver]

by 'it' i think, that by and large, this'll be the last SG1 movie.

i think this movie - if it ever gets made - will be the last with the original crew, and possibly the last ever. SGU simply isn't popular enough to pull the ratings to get money invested into the franchise. SGA won't be used, i don't think.

I think this movie is SG1's last hurrah. That's the 'it' i'm referring to.

What i would hope is, whenever they realize that the movie will never be made, they don't keep that script locked up forever until it's useless and wasted. I hope they release the script or get someone to novelize it and release it as a novel.

SG1, as a franchise, is basically over. This is its ending. SGA is over. I don't think there'll ever be a movie. TPTB seem to want to forget that they ever made a show. and I think SGU's days are numbered.

So, for shippers, this movie is their last chance to get what TPTB have been teasing them with for years.

[flynn1959]

by 'it' i think, that by and large, this'll be the last SG1 movie.

i think this movie - if it ever gets made - will be the last with the original crew, and possibly the last ever. SGU simply isn't popular enough to pull the ratings to get money invested into the franchise. SGA won't be used, i don't think.

I think this movie is SG1's last hurrah. That's the 'it' i'm referring to.

What i would hope is, whenever they realize that the movie will never be made, they don't keep that script locked up forever until it's useless and wasted. I hope they release the script or get someone to novelize it and release it as a novel.

SG1, as a franchise, is basically over. This is its ending. SGA is over. I don't think there'll ever be a movie. TPTB seem to want to forget that they ever made a show. and I think SGU's days are numbered.

So, for shippers, this movie is their last chance to get what TPTB have been teasing them with for years.

I agree, Stargate is pretty much over now and like you I have my doubts this movie will ever get made. I have never really seen TPTB teasing S/J shippers, then again I have never seen that particular ship on the show. I just don't get why some people seem to think that Sam and Jack are any different from all the other possible pairings followed by fans of the franchise.

This movie, if it happens, will also be the last chance for fans to see Jack with Sara, or Lara, or see Daniel and Vala end up together again, or Teal'c and Sam. Whatever.

If this is the last chance to see the characters together I would rather they go out as the have always been - comrades in arms and not as lovers.