Divide and Conquer (405)

[keshya]

don't know exactly where she gets it from, but she does get a lot of sneak peeks

if you wanna know, ask her. she's around here somewhere

[Melyanna]

Not to be the ballbuster here, but how acurate do you think her info is?

This came from the casting sides, the same place GW's spoilers came from. Due to copyright reasons, I can't give you the exact line, obviously, but it's in there. That doesn't, however, mean it'll appear in the episode when it airs. Any number of things from time constraints to other writers to RDA's tendency to ad-lib could mean the line gets deleted, but as of Martin Gero's final draft, it's in there.

[captain jake]

Cool!!

[OrangeShipper]

i LOVE this episode!! (Shipper all the way!). Except Anise... I just don't like her. She has a wierd mouth, and her head kinda jolts when she talks, it really bugs me. Anyway..

There's a look that S&J share that I totally, totally love that noboadys mentioned.. Just as Jacks being led away to have the "procedure", when Sams about to be drugged, she looks down the corridoor at him and he turns back to look at her, and it kinda goes a bit slow-mo.. That look is just AMAZING, it turns me to jelly!!!

[scifi_girl]

i LOVE this episode!! (Shipper all the way!). Except Anise... I just don't like her. She has a wierd mouth, and her head kinda jolts when she talks, it really bugs me. Anyway..

There's a look that S&J share that I totally, totally love that noboadys mentioned.. Just as Jacks being led away to have the "procedure", when Sams about to be drugged, she looks down the corridoor at him and he turns back to look at her, and it kinda goes a bit slow-mo.. That look is just AMAZING, it turns me to jelly!!!

yeah, thats one of my favourite moments. i love the whole episode

[meredithchandler73]

Does anyone know whether the memories we see (stuff that was supposed to have taken place during Upgrades, but weren't in the episode) were filmed at the time Upgrades was filmed or if they went back and inserted that new stuff?

[Chaka's_Mum]

I suspect that they were filmed at the same time as the rest of 'Upgrades', otherwise they would have had to have rebuilt that part of the set just for one very short sequence. Unless they have stock 'Goa'uld ship corridor' sets that they use for that purpose, of course!

[Callista]

OK, so I'm finally watching all the episodes in order. On first viewing about a year ago I thought this episode was all right. Not great, but not horrible either. Now, however I think this is my most hated episode. Not just dislike, but absolute HATE! Let me clarify that I love Sam. I love Jack. I love Daniel. And, I love Teal'c. I'm not a slasher. I don't have a huge problem with ship, as long as it stays about the level of Solitudes. This episode had so many things going against it.
1)Anise/Freya's outfit was horrendous! When ALL the other Tok'ra dress in what PDL describes as "Tripe", I find it quite unbelievable that one of their top scientists dresses like a showgirl.
2)Anise/Freya/Jack/Daniel What?!?!? Is Stargate going in for foursomes now?
3)a)Jack tells them that the reason he couldn't leave Carter behind is because he cares for her "a lot more than I'm supposed to". Hello?!? Wasn't he also trapped behind multiple force fields? Daniel and Teal'c couldn't get back in, so presumably he couldn't have gotten out even if he wanted to.
3)b)Teal'c and Daniel could have left, but they chose to stay behind and get blown up with Carter and Jack even though they didn't even know where they were. For all they knew, they'd already whooshed out a back door and were at the Stargate. Does this mean that they both have inappropriate feelings for Jack and/or Sam?
3)c)Does anyone here believe Jack wouldn't have stayed behind if it had been Teal'c or Daniel stuck behind that force field? Or Frasier? Or Hammond? Or Bra'tac? Or ANYONE he knew?! Jack's catch-line has always been "We don't leave our people behind!" Since when does that only apply to people he is romantically involved with?
4)I think this episode cheapens Sam's character. I love that she is super smart. I love that she is a good soldier. I love that she is a caring and moral individual. I love that she is a great friend. I hate that the writers chose to make it appear that she would have fought less and cared less if it were Teal'c or Daniel or Janet that were being led off to have their brains fried.
5)I think Jack is a great leader and I don't like that, from this point onwards, he keeps toying with Sam (all the way to Season 8, where she dumps her fiance because she is still not sure of Jack's feelings for her). If he really loves her and is pretty sure that she loves him back, he should have retired. He retired before. Or, he should come right out and tell her they have no future. This episode starts a long run where they just make goo-goo eyes at eachother. It felt rather 90210 to me. When they said "none of this leaves this room" (although at least 3 other people witnessed it) it would seem to imply that they are putting a stop to it. Of course that doesn't happen. Sam is not some hormonal schoolgirl. Jack should be old enough and wise enough to know better. In Solitudes, nothing was stated, but their affection for eachother was obvious, but they could have gone on denying their feeling for eachother. After Divide and Conquer, everything is out in the open. At the very least, they should have been on different teams.
6)My husband brought up the fact that the whole pre-programmed assassin that doesn't know they've been pre-programmed was very reminiscent of "Strange Brew". From then on, I was picturing Walter up there playing the fatal chord on the organ that would cause Martouf to skate around and kill the President with a hockey puck.

So.....
I'm sorry if I've offended shippers. Now that we're in season 10,

Spoiler:

I have no problem if they want to imply Jack and Sam are dating eachother on the sly.

But for the 6 years in between, I see this episode as the point where the show veered off the track of the remarkable friendship/loyalty/trust that was shared between 4 remarkable individuals. I still love SG-1, but I don't think it ever quite got that back.

[Two_L's]

This episode had so many things going against it.
3)a)Jack tells them that the reason he couldn't leave Carter behind is because he cares for her "a lot more than I'm supposed to". Hello?!? Wasn't he also trapped behind multiple force fields? Daniel and Teal'c couldn't get back in, so presumably he couldn't have gotten out even if he wanted to.
3)b)Teal'c and Daniel could have left, but they chose to stay behind and get blown up with Carter and Jack even though they didn't even know where they were. For all they knew, they'd already whooshed out a back door and were at the Stargate. Does this mean that they both have inappropriate feelings for Jack and/or Sam?
3)c)Does anyone here believe Jack wouldn't have stayed behind if it had been Teal'c or Daniel stuck behind that force field? Or Frasier? Or Hammond? Or Bra'tac? Or ANYONE he knew?! Jack's catch-line has always been "We don't leave our people behind!" Since when does that only apply to people he is romantically involved with?

Just a guess here, but I think Jack had to say that he cared about Carter because of the tense 'moment' between them. Both Jack and Sam had avoided speaking of that specific situation that had occurred which is why the machine thought they were lying. Of course, O'Neill would've stayed behind for any of his team, but the underlying reason for his determination and desperation to rescue Teal'c or Daniel had they been in the same compromise, would only be a matter of friendship and loyalty. Therefore, all he would have had to say was, 'he is a member of my team, and a friend, and I couldn't leave without him.'

With Carter it was different. He could say 'she's a friend and I won't leave her', which is true, but the machine was capable of knowing when the whole truth was not being told. And here, the whole truth was, that he cared for her, "a lot more" than he's supposed to, and was completely omitting the fact that his personal feelings had been revealed while they were on the ship, albeit unspoken.

To the episode, I thought it was excellent! Although Anise's outfit was awful and quite distracting to say the least, the episode itself was really well done and I liked the not knowing if O'Neill or Carter where infected or not. I was sad about Martouf 's demise though, he was an awesome character despite that he could have prevented Sam/Jack shippyness

[Chaka's_Mum]

I think the issue Callista is raising is not so much the fact that the Za'tarc detector required the truth to emerge despite Jack and Sam's attempts to hide it, but the 'truth' that it brought to light.

Like Callista, I find the sudden emergence of a definite 'yes, they are' as opposed to 'are they/aren't they' like this somewhat unfortunate - and for many of the same reasons.

I am not actively opposed to 'ship - but I don't subscribe to it, so this episode just opens up doors I would much rather have remained closed. I could elaborate, but I think Mr Prophet has put it best:

If you're dating your 2IC you're prejudicing the chain of command. If you're even thinking regular naughty thoughts about your 2IC you really should get one of you reassigned, because you're putting everyone else on your team in danger otherwise. Moreover, if you're dating, then everyone else in your command will be thinking you're favouring them, even if your not. Favouritism is bad for morale; favouritism like saying that you can date your 2IC but nobody else can. Maybe Hayes is cool with it, but would Lieutenant Bloggs be down if he still couldn't date Major Smith? Or Sergeant Jones, who wants to marry Captain Davis, but isn't allowed to fraternise with the officer class?

Universally appropriate or not, the regulations exist for a reason.

Given that it is clear that Jack has now lost his objectivity where Sam is concerned, what's happened to his professional integrity? Does he realise what could happen to both him and Sam if this were ever to come to light? Surely they can't believe that it won't at some stage? In a closed environment like that, things like this can't stay under wraps - there are always rumours.

Again - sorry if this offends shippers - it's not meant to! My beef is not with 'ship itself but the fact that, when it was merely 'implied' I could ignore it. Now it's being shoved in my face whether I want it or not.

[beccabob593]

i was so sad when martouf died he is one of my fav non sg1 characters poor martouf!

[Harlan's Speechwriter]

i was so sad when martouf died he is one of my fav non sg1 characters poor martouf!

I too was sad to loose Martouf; he and Jacob Carter are/were my favourite characters among the Tokr'a.

I liked the concept of this episode; the idea of the Goual'd creating hidden, human 'weapons' was both clever and engaging. But, without meaning to offend shippers, I didn't really appreciate the Sam/Jack issue being forced on me so openly. Suggestions are ok, as you can read whatever you like into them, but this was laid on a bit thickly for my personal taste.

It also calls into question Jack and Sam's professionalism - surely things like this don't stay under wraps all that long, in such a confined organisation?

[Verona]

I love the Hair issues Jack has if you go back and watch the scene when he is re tested one shot he looks like he's been dragged backwards through a hedge the next its all nice and neat. I think the rufflers from the thunk thread got to him.

[Cascade]

This episode = w00t!

I don't just like it because I'm a Sam/Jack fan, but because I thought the whole Zatarc concept was interesting too, as was Anise's lie-detector contraption. Despite Anise's frankly terrifying dress sense, and the death of poor Martouf (), this rates as (yet another) one of my favourites so far.

My favourite SG-1 episode list keeps growing and growing, hehe.

[Nikki]

3)a)Jack tells them that the reason he couldn't leave Carter behind is because he cares for her "a lot more than I'm supposed to". Hello?!? Wasn't he also trapped behind multiple force fields? Daniel and Teal'c couldn't get back in, so presumably he couldn't have gotten out even if he wanted to.

Yes, he probably couldn't have gotten out but the point is that he didn't know that. He assumed that Daniel/Teal'c made it out of there and so could he, if he left Sam behind, as they got in there easily enough. He couldn't have predicted that a force field would drop down blocking his exit.

3)b)Teal'c and Daniel could have left, but they chose to stay behind and get blown up with Carter and Jack even though they didn't even know where they were. For all they knew, they'd already whooshed out a back door and were at the Stargate. Does this mean that they both have inappropriate feelings for Jack and/or Sam?

No, it doesn't. But the explanation for why Daniel/Teal'c stayed and why Jack stayed are different and are shown in the episode. Daniel/Teal'c stay because they 'never leave a man behind' - loyalty and friendship. Jack says he didn't leave because he cares about Sam 'a lot more that he's supposed too'...implying that she isn't just another soldier to him. He would’ve stayed behind for any other person/comrade but because of his sense of duty and honour not because of personal/intimate feelings. He further confirms this by saying 'I didn't leave . . . because I'd have rather died myself . . . than lose Carter.' - he'd rather die than grieve the loss of Sam. That's not just friendship or loyalty, he's lost friends/comrades before and each time it must have been painful but in this case he'd rather die than grieve.

3)c)Does anyone here believe Jack wouldn't have stayed behind if it had been Teal'c or Daniel stuck behind that force field? Or Frasier? Or Hammond? Or Bra'tac? Or ANYONE he knew?! Jack's catch-line has always been "We don't leave our people behind!" Since when does that only apply to people he is romantically involved with?

Yes, I do but not for the same reasons (see above) and that’s why it doesn’t imply he is romantically involved with them.

4)I think this episode cheapens Sam's character. I love that she is super smart. I love that she is a good soldier. I love that she is a caring and moral individual. I love that she is a great friend. I hate that the writers chose to make it appear that she would have fought less and cared less if it were Teal'c or Daniel or Janet that were being led off to have their brains fried.

I don't think that they implied that at all. She would have cared for all her friends as much but again just not in the same way. She knows Jack as well as we know him, he showed how much he didn't trust the Tok'ra especially Anise/Freya and would rather choose any other option than use what they had to offer and so the only other reason he would be going through with the procedure would be if it would benefit Sam in some way...and he says as much, which Janet relays back to Sam.

So obviously she's also going to have a sense of guilt as well as realise the underlying reason for why he suddenly put his life on something/someone that he verbalised his severe distrust of, esp in that ep. After seeing what happened to Lt. Astor no one in their right mind would go through with the procedure with the sole belief that 'oh maybe it'll work this time' especially when another option was available, there was obviously another reason and she knew that it was because of his feelings for her.

And if those feelings were just of friendship, why would she say 'Something neither one of us can admit, given our working relationship, our military ranks....'. They're allowed to be friends and the military is all about sacrificing your own life in order to save a fellow team mate’s but what the military doesn't allow for is what Jack did...sacrifice your life because you'd rather die than grieve the loss of another because your feelings go beyond that of friendship.

5)I think Jack is a great leader and I don't like that, from this point onwards, he keeps toying with Sam (all the way to Season 8, where she dumps her fiance because she is still not sure of Jack's feelings for her).

Well from then on (except for 'Threads') it's pretty much interpretation. Personally, I don't feel that he toyed with her and if I was forced to choose, I'd say it was Sam who toyed with Jack, even though I feel that neither did.

They had this status quo after D&C where they both knew the extent of their feelings for each other but knew that it couldn't go any further for the time being. But it was Sam who changed that mid-season 7 by dating Pete and tried to confront Jack in 'Lost City' to which he replied 'I know'. I interpreted that subtext as Sam trying to tell him that she still had feelings for him but was trying to move on by dating Pete because there was no solution to their dilemma...“I know” - Jack.

And Sam tells him that Pete proposed and she asks him (through subtext IMO) in Affinity 'has anything changed' and he tells her nothing has. She can't leave anymore than he can because they're both equally as important to the program and are at war with the Goa'uld/Replicators but if things were different "I wouldn't be here" - Jack.

She accepts the proposal and Jack finally decides its time to move on. After he thinks she had given up on them and was happy, he started dating Kerry. It was very obvious to Kerry that he was in love with Sam and Sam with him and asked 'Is the military the only thing keeping you two apart?' - rationally who else could she be talking about?

Sam realised she couldn't truly be happy with Pete because she was still very much in love with Jack and couldn't move on from him even if it would end up going no where. It wouldn't be fair to her or Pete. Jack didn't stop Kerry from leaving (or correct her when she said he had feelings for another) for the same reason and so Sam/Jack decided to be there for each other 'Always' at the end of 'Threads'.

Notice, he generally let her steer the direction of their relationship.

In season 9 the Goa'uld/Replicators had been defeated, we see Jack heading up to DC (world of paperwork and bureaucrats) not making him Sam's CO anymore and leaving the door open for a relationship. A "Not exactly" single from Sam in 'Ex Deus Machina', a marriage implied/hinted in '200', 'fishing' as her personal password and the use of "d'oh" in 'Line in the Sand' and

Spoiler:

a picture of her and Jack fishing on Sam's desk in Atlantis season 4

hinting to an off screen relationship.

If he really loves her and is pretty sure that she loves him back, he should have retired. He retired before. Or, he should come right out and tell her they have no future.

See above.

This episode starts a long run where they just make goo-goo eyes at eachother. It felt rather 90210 to me. When they said "none of this leaves this room" (although at least 3 other people witnessed it) it would seem to imply that they are putting a stop to it. Of course that doesn't happen. Sam is not some hormonal schoolgirl. Jack should be old enough and wise enough to know better.

No they are neither and the fact that their relationship progresses, shows that what they have is not just a crush/infatuation 90210 style but something more.

In Solitudes, nothing was stated, but their affection for eachother was obvious, but they could have gone on denying their feeling for eachother. After Divide and Conquer, everything is out in the open. At the very least, they should have been on different teams.

Only Janet/Teal'c knew from the SGC and they are Sam/Jack's closest friends, I doubt they would tell Hammond, knowing what the consequences would be. It was most likely covered up and therefore they stayed as SG1.

I'm sorry if I've offended shippers.

And nope, no offending here. It's nice to get a discussion going, as I said there is a lot of interpretation and implication. Everyone's PoV is different and its interesting hearing different sides.