S10: Critique & Contemplation

[Coco Pops]

I

I love you handle.... I can relate.

Ta thankyou. I couldn't think up a really neat nickname for here
but I do love chocolate and had just finished watching "The Entity"
and well it just came to me hehe.

[suse]

watch out for that plot hole. you might hurt something when you step in it

Nah, since it's bottomless I don't need to worry about hitting the ground.

:
ReganX thy name in Alice Down the rabbit hole!

on who was the caterpillar in the planning sessions for S9...

suse

[suse]

I

I love you handle.... I can relate.


I think the problem is they created a character with no real sustance to the character. It's easy to ignore a character when it's not your fav one--I imagine the writers do the same thing.

Of course, Cooper had a good basic idea for the Ori but really didn't deliver them or the Aurthur legend.

With the Goa'uld they did make more of an effort with the Egyptian gods. Made them believable. The Ori are more like--the boogie man. Stays in the closet and never really came out to scare you. Just--laughed at ya.

And never mind that the "history" used for the Ancient tech found on Earth was *many* centuries off the Arthurian timeline.

suse

[suse]

Love all your replies and glad no one flamed me

But I really don't get still how a writer can create a character they
can't work out a weakness for. It's as if they have got it all on paper,
committed it to screen, but not thought out all the bugs. As others
have said, their feelings, motivation.

In the end I really do hope that the Ori are not beaten in a way that
will feel insulting to the viewers. I really do. At the moment they're
almost my least favourite part of the show, though Adria does make
for good set dressing.

Poor Adria managed to inherit Mommy's early S9 clothing choices. Slave color included.

suse

[Jackie]

Ta thankyou. I couldn't think up a really neat nickname for here
but I do love chocolate and had just finished watching "The Entity"
and well it just came to me hehe.

You should have been here about a month ago...this turned into the chocolate thread. I have recently re-acquainted myself with the Necco Skybar and the Necco mallow cups. I found the Skybar was useful in teaching sharing to my daughter.

[Jackie]

And never mind that the "history" used for the Ancient tech found on Earth was *many* centuries off the Arthurian timeline.

suse

yep, aurturian legend throws a monkey wrench in the mix.

Then the never did bring in the Lady of the Lake or King Aurtur's sword, Excaliber. I think they tried to make out Excaliber was a hologram or something like that.

It would have been neat if the sword turned out to be real and have some ability with it.

[astrogeologist]

Well said. The writers may wanted to have come up with something different from the goa'uld but I can't say I liked their replacement. As you say, Ba'al in his heyday was pretty threatening--think Abyss. (then they made him a clone joke. Another case of "we think this actor's great, let's find a way to keep bringing him back" but not finding a way that *made sense*)

Though SG1 was always seeking out technology to fight the goa'uld, most stories were not just about a "treasure hunt" as it seemed to become in s9 & 10.
Sure the formula is they go to a planet, get in trouble and get out of trouble. But they don't get into trouble by being idiots. it was always more that the humans were in over their heads--hence the ingenuity you mention.

When you have the show runner calling the heroes of the show "screwups" that says a lot about why things went downhill. If he doesn't understand who the main characters are...

The impression that I get is that competent characters are boring to write... boring to direct... and boring to act for the actors. So no one wants to 'do competent'... instead, they all want to be the ones who get to mess around and have fun.... responsible and competent... is just... boring...

I like competent heroes... compassionate... with the occassional human failing... but with the maturity and 'smarts' and ethics and morals that helps them pull themselves up after their mistakes and get it right the next time. I like to see resolve... and heroics and self-sacrifice... and enthusiasm for life and it's wonders... and enthusiasm for exploring the universe...

I don't like a bunch of macho screw-ups.

Both Jackson and Teal'c got 'macho-er' in Seasons 9 and 10 (Teal'c's macho increase was more in Season 10?) - and it didn't go over well with me at all. Both of the lead females became female cliches (either followers, wallpaper, or just supporting fodder or blatant female stereotypes). Mitchell... his character was a mess after they brought him in, tore the team apart to make it happen, booted Carter out of command and any semblance of credibility for her rank and experience and competence, and tried to make Mitchell a replacement for O'Neill (bad, bad move... Mitchell should have been his own character - a new character, not an attempt at a slightly revised retread... and Mitchell should have enhanced the team - not torn it apart). Bizarrely they tried to write it as if Mitchell 'brought the band back together' - but that was ludicrous because the team was torn asunder to give him the central command slot on the team.

[astrogeologist]

Because they didn't want to make things too easy for them; they could have expanded on Sam's ability to use Goa'uld technology, had her carry a hand device and healing device on every mission but it would have given them too great an advantage.

I think it would have been cool (and 'scifi') to have had her carry the devices, but not to be able to work them well - to have them work sometimes, but unpredictably in terms of the results. To have them work, but only at great physical and mental cost - so O'Neill would have to seriously weigh whether or not to ask/order her to use them because he might then have a disabled team member if the physical cost was too high or the devices didn't work quite correctly. Seeing Sam struggle with wanting to heal someone, but not being able to control the device completely - that could have been great storyline (they did a bit of it with Daniel when he ascended the first time, but I would have liked to have seen a longer storyline with the Goa'uld devices for Carter).

Having it all work perfectly, with no apparent 'cost'... makes it all too much like magic.

[Coco Pops]

You should have been here about a month ago...this turned into the chocolate thread. I have recently re-acquainted myself with the Necco Skybar and the Necco mallow cups. I found the Skybar was useful in teaching sharing to my daughter.

I don't live in your part of the world LOL so what's a Necco Skybar and
a Necco Mallow cup all about?

[AGateFan]

The impression that I get is that competent characters are boring to write... boring to direct... and boring to act for the actors. So no one wants to 'do competent'... instead, they all want to be the ones who get to mess around and have fun.... responsible and competent... is just... boring...

I like competent heroes... compassionate... with the occassional human failing... but with the maturity and 'smarts' and ethics and morals that helps them pull themselves up after their mistakes and get it right the next time. I like to see resolve... and heroics and self-sacrifice... and enthusiasm for life and it's wonders... and enthusiasm for exploring the universe...

I don't like a bunch of macho screw-ups.

Both Jackson and Teal'c got 'macho-er' in Seasons 9 and 10 (Teal'c's macho increase was more in Season 10?) - and it didn't go over well with me at all. Both of the lead females became female cliches (either followers, wallpaper, or just supporting fodder or blatant female stereotypes). Mitchell... his character was a mess after they brought him in, tore the team apart to make it happen, booted Carter out of command and any semblance of credibility for her rank and experience and competence, and tried to make Mitchell a replacement for O'Neill (bad, bad move... Mitchell should have been his own character - a new character, not an attempt at a slightly revised retread... and Mitchell should have enhanced the team - not torn it apart). Bizarrely they tried to write it as if Mitchell 'brought the band back together' - but that was ludicrous because the team was torn asunder to give him the central command slot on the team.

So many great post from you and so little green.

[mapsc]

I think it would have been cool (and 'scifi') to have had her carry the devices, but not to be able to work them well - to have them work sometimes, but unpredictably in terms of the results. To have them work, but only at great physical and mental cost - so O'Neill would have to seriously weigh whether or not to ask/order her to use them because he might then have a disabled team member if the physical cost was too high or the devices didn't work quite correctly. Seeing Sam struggle with wanting to heal someone, but not being able to control the device completely - that could have been great storyline (they did a bit of it with Daniel when he ascended the first time, but I would have liked to have seen a longer storyline with the Goa'uld devices for Carter).

Having it all work perfectly, with no apparent 'cost'... makes it all too much like magic.

What a great idea. All these missed opportunities are depressing.

Mike

[ReganX]

I think it would have been cool (and 'scifi') to have had her carry the devices, but not to be able to work them well - to have them work sometimes, but unpredictably in terms of the results. To have them work, but only at great physical and mental cost - so O'Neill would have to seriously weigh whether or not to ask/order her to use them because he might then have a disabled team member if the physical cost was too high or the devices didn't work quite correctly. Seeing Sam struggle with wanting to heal someone, but not being able to control the device completely - that could have been great storyline (they did a bit of it with Daniel when he ascended the first time, but I would have liked to have seen a longer storyline with the Goa'uld devices for Carter).

Having it all work perfectly, with no apparent 'cost'... makes it all too much like magic.

Yes, that would have been an excellent twist; imagine if Goa'uld tech had an effect on Ori Priors, not so much that it made things too easy but enough to given them a fairly substantial advantage, but that prolonged use also had a detrimental effect, physically, mentally, emotionally or a combination of the above on a person without a symbiote.

It would have given us a measure of Mitchell and Landry as people; would they be willing to order/encourage Sam (and Vala in Season Ten) to use the tech at the expense of their own well-being?

[Jackie]

I don't live in your part of the world LOL so what's a Necco Skybar and
a Necco Mallow cup all about?

Now see what you're missing!

[Skydiver]

yeah, i wish they would have explored sam and jolinar more. not just the healing device or the rribbon weapon, but how about a situation where sam gets the team in trouble because they can sense jolinar in her? or vala for that matter.

and yeah, it would have been nice had they done some real research into the arthurian legend adn realized that they were about 9000 years off

or excalibur...what if, like 'the davinci code' excalibur wasn't a sword per se, it was a person. and that person is the key to defeating something. and do they have the right to force that person into doing somethinhg they don't wnat to do?

[Frostfox]

yeah, i wish they would have explored sam and jolinar more. not just the healing device or the rribbon weapon, but how about a situation where sam gets the team in trouble because they can sense jolinar in her? or vala for that matter.

and yeah, it would have been nice had they done some real research into the arthurian legend adn realized that they were about 9000 years off

or excalibur...what if, like 'the davinci code' excalibur wasn't a sword per se, it was a person. and that person is the key to defeating something. and do they have the right to force that person into doing somethinhg they don't wnat to do?

The Arthurian stuff was so hackneyed, so cartoon Disney Merlin and co.
Either use the real myths or choose a more obscure, early version such as the Irish Sagas or the Tales of the Mabinogi. Which are less clichéd but there is still plenty of material to work with.
It was also buggering up their established canon of when the Ancients and Gould were active; it was a good millennia too late.

Continuity is for squids.

FF