S10: Critique & Contemplation

[pittsburghgirl]

Hands Zoser glass of Johnny Walker Black and ice bucket.

[Jackie]

what i'm afraid of for the Shroud is that fans have built it up so much that it'll never live up to thier expectations.

I saw it with summit/last stand. the daniel fans were drooling over it, literally. It was a whump heaven for the danny whumpers. Slave daniel rescued by his hero jack....dream come true for many.

then it aired.

jack didn't rescue his little buddy. in fact, jack didn't seem to lose any sleep over daniel being a slave. Course, he really wasn't a slave, he was jsut under cover. no whumpage - beyond that teltac crash. and teh very same folks that were pumping it up and drooling over it became its harshest critics because it didn't live up to what they wanted it to be.

I've seen the same thing with eps touted as shippy in the pre-eps spoilers.

I just have a bad feeling that Shroud will be so pre built up by fans that it'll never deliver cause nothing they can make will ever match the fantasies adn expectations of fans

I just hope that "The Shroud" will be a Jack-heavy episode and that he gets to interact not only with Daniel but also with the rest of the team especially Sam and Vala.

I have the feeling that it will be an episode that the die fans will love despite the draw backs.

I also have the feeling the episode will not be heavy with Jack. Most likely Jack will have about ten minues in the whole epi. The end scene I have the feeling will be Daniel/Vala centered--becuase of the way the show is shipping them.

I highly doubt the episode will show the big three (Daniel, Sam and Teal'c) at the end re-establishing thier own relationship. They should have the ep centered on Jack, Daniel Sam and Teal'c. I doubt it will fo that way. Vala will be pushed to the front as if she was the only one really affected by Daniel's prior-isim.

[Amanda Eros]

As for the pigtails, it's good to see her get rid of them as well. I've been noticing a funny trend, though... she doesn't seem to have them whenever Daniel isn't around... Uninvited, Line in the Sand, Road Not Taken... and then when Daniel is back she goes back to the pigtails. I wonder if it has something to do with her being more childish and annoying whenever he's around?

I have a theory for that. Daniel was flipping though the channels and Vala came in when he landed on CN. She automatically assumed that he was watching it, and saw that one of the female characters was wearing pigtails.

Another theory is that TPTB have made Vala into Dorathy from Wizard of Oz. It's their way of keeping around that favorite Jack cliche.

[dipsofjazz]

yeah, wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

how many times has jack been on and COULD have interacted but is just trotted out for 5 minutes of distanced time

maybe i'll be surprised but given how TPTB have wasted jack's presence the past few times, i'm not holding out much faith in them using it as anyting but a ratings stunt

Sadly I have to agree. They've absolutely wasted RDA's time in the SG-1 episodes so far.

[ReganX]

yeah, wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

how many times has jack been on and COULD have interacted but is just trotted out for 5 minutes of distanced time

maybe i'll be surprised but given how TPTB have wasted jack's presence the past few times, i'm not holding out much faith in them using it as anyting but a ratings stunt

As long as TPTB are worried about Jack overshadowing the new characters, I'm afraid that all we'll see are cameos from him on SG-1.

[Hubble]

what i'm afraid of for the Shroud is that fans have built it up so much that it'll never live up to thier expectations.

{snip}

I just have a bad feeling that Shroud will be so pre built up by fans that it'll never deliver cause nothing they can make will ever match the fantasies adn expectations of fans

My expectations are very low really. I'm guessing it's going to be Vaniel again. What I would like to see is the entire team working together to save Daniel, and I want the story to make sense with them explaining how/why Daniel went Darkside (if he, in fact, did), how they're able to bring him back without him combusting, etc. I don't want to hear Vala call General O'Neill "Jack" and I'd love for Jack to look at Vala and say, "Hey, what's up with the pigtails?"

I agree with you that this may well be a disappointment to those fans who have their expectations very high. I think that unless Jack goes to the SGC with his P90 at the ready to shoot anyone who tries to harm Daniel, unless he really shows his concern for his best friend and emotes, some people are going to be disappointed. Some are going to be disappointed if Jack so much as looks as Sam as well, or spends even a few seconds talking to her. Some are going to be disappointed if he *doesn't."

It is going to be interesting to read all the comments from the various groups, that's for sure.

[Jackie]

My expectations are very low really. I'm guessing it's going to be Vaniel again. What I would like to see is the entire team working together to save Daniel, and I want the story to make sense with them explaining how/why Daniel went Darkside (if he, in fact, did), how they're able to bring him back without him combusting, etc. I don't want to hear Vala call General O'Neill "Jack" and I'd love for Jack to look at Vala and say, "Hey, what's up with the pigtails?"

I agree with you that this may well be a disappointment to those fans who have their expectations very high. I think that unless Jack goes to the SGC with his P90 at the ready to shoot anyone who tries to harm Daniel, unless he really shows his concern for his best friend and emotes, some people are going to be disappointed. Some are going to be disappointed if Jack so much as looks as Sam as well, or spends even a few seconds talking to her. Some are going to be disappointed if he *doesn't."

It is going to be interesting to read all the comments from the various groups, that's for sure.

I would love for Jack to look at the pigtails and call Vala, Dorothy.

[AGateFan]

I would love for Jack to look at the pigtails and call Vala, Dorothy.

Only if he means Dorothy's evil twin.

[JessM]

I have a theory for that. Daniel was flipping though the channels and Vala came in when he landed on CN. She automatically assumed that he was watching it, and saw that one of the female characters was wearing pigtails.

that's not a bad theory!

Another theory is that TPTB have made Vala into Dorathy from Wizard of Oz. It's their way of keeping around that favorite Jack cliche.

Ah, so that would explain their choice in that part of 200 then...

random disgruntled fan: What is this? SAM should be Dorothy!
TPTB: But look! PIGTAILS! Do you need any more proof than that?!

[JessM]

My expectations are very low really. I'm guessing it's going to be Vaniel again. What I would like to see is the entire team working together to save Daniel, and I want the story to make sense with them explaining how/why Daniel went Darkside (if he, in fact, did), how they're able to bring him back without him combusting, etc. I don't want to hear Vala call General O'Neill "Jack" and I'd love for Jack to look at Vala and say, "Hey, what's up with the pigtails?"

Mine, too. I'm really hoping that Jack is used well, especially in his scenes with Daniel. And like you, I'd love to see it be a team effort. And yeah, Jack saying that line would be cool

I agree with you that this may well be a disappointment to those fans who have their expectations very high. I think that unless Jack goes to the SGC with his P90 at the ready to shoot anyone who tries to harm Daniel, unless he really shows his concern for his best friend and emotes, some people are going to be disappointed. Some are going to be disappointed if Jack so much as looks as Sam as well, or spends even a few seconds talking to her. Some are going to be disappointed if he *doesn't."

It is going to be interesting to read all the comments from the various groups, that's for sure.

Oh, definitely. And I agree because I'm trying to keep my expectations low. I'd just love to see everyone's concern for Daniel be shown, and their relief when he's brought back at the end. Not something like "hey Daniel glad you're back" from Jack, Sam, Teal'c and Cam individually in like a five-second scene, and then the rest is Vaniel so we can all be told that "See? She cares about him the most!"

[JessM]

Only if he means Dorothy's evil twin.

*snerk* Green for you on that one, AGateFan!

[suse]

what i'm afraid of for the Shroud is that fans have built it up so much that it'll never live up to thier expectations.

I saw it with summit/last stand. the daniel fans were drooling over it, literally. It was a whump heaven for the danny whumpers. Slave daniel rescued by his hero jack....dream come true for many.

then it aired.

jack didn't rescue his little buddy. in fact, jack didn't seem to lose any sleep over daniel being a slave. Course, he really wasn't a slave, he was jsut under cover. no whumpage - beyond that teltac crash. and teh very same folks that were pumping it up and drooling over it became its harshest critics because it didn't live up to what they wanted it to be.

I've seen the same thing with eps touted as shippy in the pre-eps spoilers.

I just have a bad feeling that Shroud will be so pre built up by fans that it'll never deliver cause nothing they can make will ever match the fantasies adn expectations of fans

Then it won't be an issue for me. I don't think my expectations can go anymuch lower, even with the decentbetter last couple of eps. But then I don't necessarily miss Daniel as he has been the last several seasons.

suse

[Racingtime]

I'm glad someone mentioned this, because that's how I've always felt about it. Right from the start Jack and Daniel had the bantering back and forth, and it always seemed to come natural to me. I thought MS and RDA had a great chemistry together. As much as many people say MS and CB have a great chemistry, the banter between them doesn't seem as natural to me.

As much as I love Sam and have always loved her, there were a few times during S7/8 where she annoyed me a bit. I forgave her completely in S9 and 10, though I'm saddened that we haven't seen a whole lot of her except for the eps you mentioned.

Interesting points to think about. I agree about Shroud. I'm glad RDA will be there for that one - I just hope there isn't a Vaniel overload there, since despite tptb's attempt to show us otherwise, Vala isn't the only one who cares about Daniel.

I would love to see the whole team, particularly the Big 3, share one last moment together before the episode ends. I'm not too optimistic about it though.

i do love sam, but i wish they'd have figured out that there WAS more to her than being half of a relationship. One weakness of these writers. If they can't pair the female up and have her hanging off someone's arm, they don't know what to do with her. Not only sam, but vala too.

Just paired both quotes at once to make it easier...

Jess, that's how I feel regarding the two different styles of bantering too. I definitely end up feeling that the Jack/Daniel banter came across more naturally than the Daniel/Vala does. Of course, some of that problem comes from them constantly pairing up D/V so it feels more forced on us whereas at least with J/D they mixed it up more so it didn't disrupt the team feel. But in any case, I don't see them as the same at all.

Daniel is still my favorite character but I agree that Vala is much more interesting when he's not around because as soon as he's there, she becomes an immature kid again.

Spoiler:

I'm trying not to get my hopes up for The Shroud either because even though she hasn't been talking about Daniel in the last two episodes, I fear that they'll go right back into her being all about him in this episode and I'd really rather not see her overshadow the rest of the team's responses.

I would LOVE to see a Big 3 scene again but like you guys, I'm not going to expect anything because I'm more than likely going to end up disappointed.

I also agree about Sam and now Vala. Even though I'm a guy, I still think I could come up with better storylines for the women on this show (and I'd love to see Sam and Vala interact more). I loved Sam the most in the earlier seasons before they started throwing in more things about her love life. I'm not a fan of romance on TV and I don't think they handle it particularly well on this show either so whenever they went into that angle for Sam, I became easily bored and even annoyed (no offense to those that liked it). I like her much more when they concentrate on her independence and her own strengths and I wish they would've spent more time developing those sides of her instead of dealing so much in her love life. Same goes for Vala since they sadly only really show her strength and independence when Daniel's not around. I'd probably like Vala a lot more if they didn't make her so annoying around Daniel which is pretty much always when he's in an episode. There are so many sides to Vala that would've been much more interesting to explore but they chose not to.

[MediaSavant]

yeah, wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

how many times has jack been on and COULD have interacted but is just trotted out for 5 minutes of distanced time

maybe i'll be surprised but given how TPTB have wasted jack's presence the past few times, i'm not holding out much faith in them using it as anyting but a ratings stunt

As far as I'm concerned, the character of Jack was automatically distanced from everyone when he became a general and RDA's odd distant performances in the role from that point on didn't help.

It's become a "you can't go home again" situation. I actually don't look forward to his appearances anymore at all.

[Skydiver]

I also agree about Sam and now Vala. Even though I'm a guy, I still think I could come up with better storylines for the women on this show (and I'd love to see Sam and Vala interact more).

that's just it. and i know you didn't mean it this way, but it doesn't have to be storylines suitable for the FEMALE cast members. Just write a storyline for the CHARACTER and don't get caught up in anatomy.

Write for the ex-host goa'uld trying to redeem themselves, not the ex-host woman, or write for the air force officer trying to balance science and faith and duty, not the woman trying to balance science and faith and duty

the writers seem to get caught up in gender and forget to just write teh characters and let the actors bring the gender into it