Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread

[VSS]

Random Q:

How/When do you think Jack told Sam he and Kerry broke up?

That's a good one. I'm not sure he'd ever really come right out and say it just because he's not good with talking about relationship issues in general.

Also, it's unclear to me how much time goes by in Threads before Anubis attacks the galaxy via the stargates? If it's the same day that Jacob dies, or perhaps the next day, then I think that Jack would have been with Sam most or all of the time because they're not occupied battling evil forces, that's all done, and because of the funeral and trying to help her through that- and made his intentions clear more or less without saying anything at all. From that, Sam would have figured out Kerry wasn't in the picture. Though I suppose her orderly and factual side would have surfaced rather quickly and she probably would have asked.

I also wanted to add that the reason I feel so strongly about what Jack said with the "Always" thing is that's what happened to me.

OT

Spoiler:

It's eerily similar but my dad died- and the one guy who was supposed to "always" be there had all kinds of excuses (ironically, his last name was O'Neill). Then there was this guy whom I had just met who left in the middle of final exams (in med school ) and drove 1000 miles in a rental car to be there for me.

The rest, as they say, is history. No wonder I'm such a hopeless romantic!

[trinity3]

Welcomes Trin with a big ((((hug)))). Hmmmm ... thinks she looks very familiar ... kinda sorta maybe remembers her from somewhere ... puts on thinking cap and tries to remember where and when. Whatever! Anyway, come in, sit down, have some broccoli and cake or pie or jello.

(((((hugs Hedwig back)))))

Thanks for the warm hug and welcome. It's good to be home

I think its when you reach 2000 posts you get to have your own avatar.

Oh, and I think he definitely told her about breaking up with Kerry sometime before their hands brushed over each other's in the briefing room when she slid a report over to him at the table.

Cool. Cause there definitely was no hand brushing before then

When you reach 2000 posts or there abouts

I think it must have been between when Kerry brike up with him and when they were talking in the briefing room near the end *shrugs* In other words I have no idea

Seems like you've got a few there.

That's a good one. I'm not sure he'd ever really come right out and say it just because he's not good with talking about relationship issues in general.

Also, it's unclear to me how much time goes by in Threads before Anubis attacks the galaxy via the stargates? If it's the same day that Jacob dies, or perhaps the next day, then I think that Jack would have been with Sam most or all of the time because they're not occupied battling evil forces, that's all done, and because of the funeral and trying to help her through that- and made his intentions clear more or less without saying anything at all. From that, Sam would have figured out Kerry wasn't in the picture. Though I suppose her orderly and factual side would have surfaced rather quickly and she probably would have asked.

I also wanted to add that the reason I feel so strongly about what Jack said with the "Always" thing is that's what happened to me. It's eerily similar but my dad died- and the one guy who was supposed to "always" be there had all kinds of excuses (ironically, his last name was O'Neill). Then there was this guy whom I had just met that drove 1000 miles in a rental car to be there for me.
The rest, as they say, is history. No wonder I'm such a hopeless romantic!

Hey! Maybe that's a fic that you should write V! (only it won't really be fic it would be real)

I'd read it. Real life angst, romance, fluff and....

...well maybe hold the gutter.

[dipsofjazz]

Happy Birthday ses!

[BrenRen]

Just because the cat has got the canary feathers sticking out it's mouth doesn't mean it ate the canary, they could have got there a number of ways

It could mean they were standing too close to the canary when it exploded (a la Shrek!)...

Or perhaps the cat was snogging the canary...

[hedwig]

It could mean they were standing too close to the canary when it exploded (a la Shrek!)...

Or perhaps the cat was snogging the canary...

>>>at the images those two comments create.

[Cagranosalis]

<snipped>


Robert Carlyle is far from a household name. He may be well known overseas, but in the states, where they count the ratings that keep shows on the air, he's not as well known.

He isn't? He was in The Full Monty? Some Bond Film I can'r remember, Hamish Macbeth and... ooh ok then. He's pretty big over here so we think they've got quite a coup on the SGU team.

Lou Diamond Phillips is probably not much of a household name to anyone under about 25 now. Is he? he used to make my heart go a-flutter once upon a teenagehood. Thinking about it, RDA probably wasn't much of a household name to people under about 25 when SG-1 first aired. And definitely not in the UK. I remember him in Macgyver because the whole Smart & Sexy thing appealed to my inner (and outer) geek, but it wasn't that huge over here and I can't say most of my age group would recall him from that.

Hi guys.

I know you all have probably forgotten about me by now since I lurk more than post atm.
<snipped>

Random Q:


How/When do you think Jack told Sam he and Kerry broke up?

Hi there! Welcome back. I wondered where you'd been?

That's a good one. I'm not sure he'd ever really come right out and say it just because he's not good with talking about relationship issues in general.

Also, it's unclear to me how much time goes by in Threads before Anubis attacks the galaxy via the stargates? If it's the same day that Jacob dies, or perhaps the next day, then I think that Jack would have been with Sam most or all of the time because they're not occupied battling evil forces, that's all done, and because of the funeral and trying to help her through that- and made his intentions clear more or less without saying anything at all. From that, Sam would have figured out Kerry wasn't in the picture. Though I suppose her orderly and factual side would have surfaced rather quickly and she probably would have asked.

I also wanted to add that the reason I feel so strongly about what Jack said with the "Always" thing is that's what happened to me.

OT

Spoiler:

It's eerily similar but my dad died- and the one guy who was supposed to "always" be there had all kinds of excuses (ironically, his last name was O'Neill). Then there was this guy whom I had just met who left in the middle of final exams (in med school ) and drove 1000 miles in a rental car to be there for me.

The rest, as they say, is history. No wonder I'm such a hopeless romantic!

Awww. That's sweet.


Well even though neither of them have proven to be great at talking about that touchy feely stuff, I think they got around to having some sort of frank and honest discussion, even if it was half based on mutual understanding of what needs to be aired.
Actually, I read quite a good fic about that a while ago which is more of less how I think it might have gone down:

Years Ago

As for timescales of Threads, I think it happened over a number of weeks. So perhaps as much as a week passed between Jacob dying and the breifing room scene - enough time that the big galactic emergency wasn't "big" enough just after Jacob died that Sam had time to go off and dump Pete.

Happy Birthday ses!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...KissBW_004.jpg

And Happy birthday from me too!

[Linda06]

It could mean they were standing too close to the canary when it exploded (a la Shrek!)...

Or perhaps the cat was snogging the canary...

The canary exploded?

Ok the cat snogging the canary, that is so not an image I needed

[BrenRen]

The canary exploded?

Ok the cat snogging the canary, that is so not an image I needed

Sorry!

It was either those, or a response so deeply mired in the bottomless trench in the Gutter that it would surely get me permanently banned...

Since I still want to flood the thread with as much Gutter water as humanly possible, I chose discretion this time. I know, what a shocker!

[Alan]

Martin and Amanda comment on SG1 and SGA movies

Thanks to Kes for the link

MAGNETS!

Thanks Kes and you too jumble!

*My 12,100th posting*

[Pol]

Trin!! Welcome back!

RE: the "Always"

I've told friends I'd be there for them, but I have only whispered in a sweet, gentle voice "Always" to one person.

I think if Jack meant that in a 'buddy way' then A) Sam wouldn't have been unconsciously caressing the back of his hand with her thumb; and B) Jack (as Daniel would have) would have said nothing - which he's best at, leaving it for Sam to interpret.

Jack said "C'mere" and opened his arms. The invitation was extended...was there for her to take or not. Sam slides rather comfortably into is embrace, taking his hand in hers and caressing it with her thumb.

She's boldly, at the SGC, in uniform, on base in and in front of her Dad, accepted his invitation. Sam says, "Thank you, Sir." Jack looks slightly puzzled and response, "For what?" And Sam turns and looks him dead in the eyes...no hiding, no ducking away, just fully open and honest, mere inches from his face, and says, "For being here for me." (Not "for being here" and making an oblique reference, but "For being here for me." That's significant. She's acknowledged his invitation and her acceptance of it.

Jack then seals the deal, permanently by promising, "Always." Jack O'Neill does not make promises lightly. Sam turns to him again and faces him fully...no prevarication.

Done. Deal.

[Rachel500]

<lots of snippage>
At the point when Sam dumps Pete, do you think she knew (either through Jack telling her or her guessing) that Jack was no longer with Kerry?

OR, am i reading the scene wrong? is sam *so* caught up in her feelings of loss about jacob, that she's just letting her defenses down and responding to him? isn't the whole scene about letting down their walls and finally letting the other person in?

Attempting to answer both questions in one post...

Yes, I do think Sam had a fair idea Kerry was history when she actually talks to Pete.

However, for me, that isn't the moment Sam dumps him. I mean, it is officially *the moment* but I think she made *the decision* some time before...actually, pretty much as soon as she sees the house.

That look on her face is 'OMG, what the hell am I doing?' For me, Pete was history from that instance. In fact, I think its the knowledge that she's going to break-up with Pete and that it was over in her heart that has her ending up in Jack's driveway determined to speak with him. Because I think she realises exactly *why* it was never going to work with Pete and that sends her to Jack to tell him how she feels and to find out what he feels, whether it is just friendship.

For me, although the conversation in Jack's yard makes it seem like Sam goes to see Jack as a 'tell me how you feel so I can determine whether to marry this guy', I think that although her words are carefully couched in qualifying terms such as 'I think' actually what she's meaning is 'I know I'm making a mistake and I know it's got everything to do with the way I feel about you and I just can't keep it in a room anymore because I'm unhappy; I need to know how you feel'.

And Jack gets that (more on that later); it makes his knowledge that Kerry is inside excruciatingly awkward; makes the realisation how unhappy she is devastating and makes the moment she finds out about Kerry, agonisingly painful for them both (he's so apologetic to her and abashed).

I also think when Sam later assures her father she's happy, she's lying through her teeth. But as she sits and watches Jacob, I think alongside thinking about Jacob and her relationship with her father, she really considers his words to her about finding happiness. And I think she settles in her heart what she needs and wants. She knows it's over with Pete even if Jack is with Kerry; and she accepts that.

So when Jack walks in and asks how she is, I think Sam is at the point where she's emotionally drained (from her realisation she can't marry Pete, from the aborted yard conversation, from the revelation Jack has someone) and at the point where she's just being emotionally honest with herself for the first time in a long time - and responds unthinkingly to Jack with that same honesty.

The 'Surprisingly, good even', I think is actually not just about Jacob dying but about everything. She knows how she feels; accepts everything - and is at peace with it all.

And, for the first time, Jack responds with complete honesty to her. He doesn't hesitate to offer her comfort. And she doesn't hesitate to take it I think she just doesn't care at that point. In her head, she's lost him (after all, as far as Sam knew at that point, Jack was with Kerry but had come to be with her even though she'd turned up at his yard and embarrassed him with her feelings and half-finished confessions) and she takes hold of his hand because she needs the additional contact as she thanks him.

Which is when he tells her what she was asking him in her yard because he knew without question that she was asking him how he felt. And it is 'I'm here for you; loving you; whatever you need; however you need me; always.' For me, Jack knows when he gives that answer that Pete was going to be history.

Sam's response, the searching look at him, the confirmation that he means it that she finds in his gaze is everything she needed to know. And in that moment Sam's whole world changes again because I think she knows he would never tell her that, never give her that assurance if Kerry was still in the picture. So suddenly just as she thought her happiness was out of reach, suddenly she can achieve the happiness that Jacob wanted for her again, she can have everything she wants again.

And it's overwhelming and incredible and...if they were anywhere else and her father wasn't dying in front of them, they would be kissing. But they're on base, in uniform and her father is dying so all she can do is return to his embrace and hold his hand. So yes I agree with Sal that that scene is all about their walling tumbling down, about honesty with each other and about it just being too emotional for them both to continue pretending...

After that, I don't think she and Jack *talk* about it. I think there's a lot that happens in the wake of Jacob's death and I don't think they actually *talk* about them at all.

When Sam goes to formally end it with Pete, though, yes, I think she knew Kerry was gone but more importantly, I think Sam knew Jack was hers.

[josiane]

Martin and Amanda comment on SG1 and SGA movies

Thanks to Kes for the link

*happy dances* Fab news!

Edit: Rachel, I just spent far too long trying to formulate the exact same thoughts, but I might have drunk a few cocktails tonight and I was failing to get anything coherent down! But that distinction between the moment of the dumping and the moment of the decision is the key thing I think

And *big ol' shippy sigh* at Pol's post*

[VSS]

He isn't? He was in The Full Monty? Some Bond Film I can'r remember, Hamish Macbeth and... ooh ok then. He's pretty big over here so we think they've got quite a coup on the SGU team.

Lou Diamond Phillips is probably not much of a household name to anyone under about 25 now. Is he? he used to make my heart go a-flutter once upon a teenagehood. Thinking about it, RDA probably wasn't much of a household name to people under about 25 when SG-1 first aired. And definitely not in the UK. I remember him in Macgyver because the whole Smart & Sexy thing appealed to my inner (and outer) geek, but it wasn't that huge over here and I can't say most of my age group would recall him from that.

I agree about LDP but I'd say the main problem there is lack of visibility in recent years. RDA was about five years off of MacGyver when SG-1 started up, and I have a feeling (as you suggest) there's a lot of crossover between MacGyver fans and scifi as genres go. (They had a Mythbusters ep on MacGyver, how's that for geek worship?) And I do know people who NEVER watch sci fi but watched stargate for RDA.

But for LDP the big hits were twenty years ago. And sadly, I think he's not going to be a regular anyway. "Cause he used to make my heart go aflutter, too.

Awww. That's sweet.

Thanks. I seriously lucked out in the man department.

As for timescales of Threads, I think it happened over a number of weeks. So perhaps as much as a week passed between Jacob dying and the breifing room scene - enough time that the big galactic emergency wasn't "big" enough just after Jacob died that Sam had time to go off and dump Pete.

Wow, maybe I should look at it like that. I thought maybe days. Or at least the Anubis thing was over in days because when someone near and dear dies it really sets one's priorities straight and I'd hate to think they didn't have time to reflect on that. When I see Jack looking at Sam through the glass as Jacob is dying, I think it's a reminder for him of what really matters in this world. Things that he locked up tight when Charlie died and has been afraid to let out ever since.

[Regularamanda]

You see I see that scene very much like a fusion between what hedwig says and in the shippy way. Jack's actions are prompted by the need to comfort someone he cares about who is in emotional distress. Yes, he probably would do the same/similar for Daniel or Teal'c or his ex-wife of Cassie etc. The difference isn't that he's just there for her, but the way he reacts while he is there for her. The look on his face when he says "Always" is one of pure, unconditional love. And when she goes to her dad, you can see how deeply her pain is resonating through him. Really, honestly, it's possible to "feel" another person's pain without loving them (and we do it often among our friends and colleagues) but only those closest to you who love you the greatest feel that pain so completely that their heart breaks along with yours.

I said once before that what Jack's saying here is "I am here for you, for whatever you want and for however long to need me to be and I ask nothing from you in return."

Now that's what love is all about.


*sigh* I love Sam and Jack so much.

Yup Cags that's pretty much how I see it....but my question is I know He'd be there for Daniel and Teal'c...but would he have wrapped one of those arms around Daniel? Or would Teal'c have stroked Jack's hand?

That's a good one. I'm not sure he'd ever really come right out and say it just because he's not good with talking about relationship issues in general.

Also, it's unclear to me how much time goes by in Threads before Anubis attacks the galaxy via the stargates? If it's the same day that Jacob dies, or perhaps the next day, then I think that Jack would have been with Sam most or all of the time because they're not occupied battling evil forces, that's all done, and because of the funeral and trying to help her through that- and made his intentions clear more or less without saying anything at all. From that, Sam would have figured out Kerry wasn't in the picture. Though I suppose her orderly and factual side would have surfaced rather quickly and she probably would have asked.

I also wanted to add that the reason I feel so strongly about what Jack said with the "Always" thing is that's what happened to me.

OT

Spoiler:

It's eerily similar but my dad died- and the one guy who was supposed to "always" be there had all kinds of excuses (ironically, his last name was O'Neill). Then there was this guy whom I had just met who left in the middle of final exams (in med school ) and drove 1000 miles in a rental car to be there for me.

The rest, as they say, is history. No wonder I'm such a hopeless romantic!

re to your OT:

Spoiler:

So...did you marry this guy that drove 1000 miles? Because now you got me curious And awww! I had a really good quote one time about that but do you think I can think of it, nope

Trin!! Welcome back!

RE: the "Always"

I've told friends I'd be there for them, but I have only whispered in a sweet, gentle voice "Always" to one person.

I think if Jack meant that in a 'buddy way' then A) Sam wouldn't have been unconsciously caressing the back of his hand with her thumb; and B) Jack (as Daniel would have) would have said nothing - which he's best at, leaving it for Sam to interpret.

Jack said "C'mere" and opened his arms. The invitation was extended...was there for her to take or not. Sam slides rather comfortably into is embrace, taking his hand in hers and caressing it with her thumb.

She's boldly, at the SGC, in uniform, on base in and in front of her Dad, accepted his invitation. Sam says, "Thank you, Sir." Jack looks slightly puzzled and response, "For what?" And Sam turns and looks him dead in the eyes...no hiding, no ducking away, just fully open and honest, mere inches from his face, and says, "For being here for me." (Not "for being here" and making an oblique reference, but "For being here for me." That's significant. She's acknowledged his invitation and her acceptance of it.

Jack then seals the deal, permanently by promising, "Always." Jack O'Neill does not make promises lightly. Sam turns to him again and faces him fully...no prevarication.

Done. Deal.

http://i328.photobucket.com/albums/l355/polrobin/vids/th_Threads_cuddle.jpg

You know that remains me of VSS's fic (the flowers one )...I can totally see Jack saying something along the lines "You shouldn't be surprised by that"

I agree about LDP but I'd say the main problem there is lack of visibility in recent years. RDA was about five years off of MacGyver when SG-1 started up, and I have a feeling (as you suggest) there's a lot of crossover between MacGyver fans and scifi as genres go. (They had a Mythbusters ep on MacGyver, how's that for geek worship?) And I do know people who NEVER watch sci fi but watched stargate for RDA.

But for LDP the big hits were twenty years ago. And sadly, I think he's not going to be a regular anyway. "Cause he used to make my heart go aflutter, too.

Thanks. I seriously lucked out in the man department.

Wow, maybe I should look at it like that. I thought maybe days. Or at least the Anubis thing was over in days because when someone near and dear dies it really sets one's priorities straight and I'd hate to think they didn't have time to reflect on that. When I see Jack looking at Sam through the glass as Jacob is dying, I think it's a reminder for him of what really matters in this world. Things that he locked up tight when Charlie died and has been afraid to let out ever since.

OH...I never thought of that! Makes sense though

[Regularamanda]

And hmmm I think I'm going to disagree with Rachel to an extent () I don't think Sam knew that Jack had broken up with Kerry, I think she was doing it for herself...that he wasn't the one for her, he bought a house without telling her, so on and so forth. But I do think they talked...I know they would have had a hard time after Jacob's death but I think when they were up at the cabin they would have said something...if not before. Remember how he looks her up and down at the end of Moebius? I don't think he would have done that if he thought she was still with . If not a talk then something...just so they know that they still love one another...and that wasn't going to change.

Edit: Kind of like a

Sir...when I was at your house what I was going to say was...
I know...for now Carter...just for now.