Sam Carter /Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread 2.0

[fems]

It's funny. I've often thought the same thing about Sam. She comes in TOO defensive in that first scene. Of course, she's probably dealt with a myriad of different guys who treated her wrongly because of her gender throughout her career, but to come into a meeting where nearly EVERY officer in the room outranks you and be so snotty is a little unbelievable.

Some people in the fandom, but not on GW state that TPTB really didn't know how to write female characters, and that's probably part of the problem, but AT made a choice to play those lines in that way, and that tells me that she thought that Sam would have a gigantic chip on her shoulder and be uber-defensive about her place on the team. She settles down, thank heavens, into the graceful (exact word I usually use to describe her) officer/woman/scientist that we all know and love, but she definitely doesn't start that way.

As for Daniel, I didn't really start liking him until he came back from being Ascended the first time. He became one of my favorite characters during Season 9 and 10 (I am fully aware that I'm in the minority there.)

I'll say again - one of the reasons that I like the recut version better is the absence of nekkidness. There is literally NO reason why the nudity was necessary. I believe it cheapened the show to be so gratuitous.

Actually, AT has mentioned several times that she didn't like Sam's soap box moment. However, they didn't know if the show would last/they'd keep the job until after the pilot was approved, so she waited until she got the gig to make changes to Sam's character and told TPTB to write her like they'd write a guy and that she'd take care of the woman part. Or something along those lines.

[SamJackShipper93]

It's funny. I've often thought the same thing about Sam. She comes in TOO defensive in that first scene. Of course, she's probably dealt with a myriad of different guys who treated her wrongly because of her gender throughout her career, but to come into a meeting where nearly EVERY officer in the room outranks you and be so snotty is a little unbelievable.

Very true. If I didn’t know Sam from the rest of the show, I’d definitely assume from this first scene that she has a high-and-mighty, I’m-smarter-than-every-CO-I’ve-ever-had, type of attitude.

Though to be fair, if I didn’t know Jack from the rest of the show, I’d think that his character was ignorant and misogynistic thanks to this scene (the way he says “I like women” is almost lecherous to my ears). He (and Ferretti and Kawalsky) really didn’t give Sam any indication that he’d be different than other sexist officers that Sam’s had to report to before.

Some people in the fandom, but not on GW state that TPTB really didn't know how to write female characters, and that's probably part of the problem, but AT made a choice to play those lines in that way, and that tells me that she thought that Sam would have a gigantic chip on her shoulder and be uber-defensive about her place on the team. She settles down, thank heavens, into the graceful (exact word I usually use to describe her) officer/woman/scientist that we all know and love, but she definitely doesn't start that way.

Oh yeah, Amanda has said that that’s exactly how she interpreted Sam in the beginning so those character choices don’t surprise me.

I’ve got no basis for this other than my personal acting background, but if I remember correctly, the briefing room scene was used for the auditions for Sam Carter, and I’ve always thought that some of the really fiery, defensive lines may have been infused with that emotion during that audition process, when Amanda was first trying to figure Sam out (her audition “sides” likely consisted of this scene alone, with no other context for Sam in the rest of the episode) and trying to set herself apart from the many other actresses she was up against.

And for all we know, maybe in the original sides for the audition, Sam’s character description was something like “a capable, intelligent officer and astrophysicist with a chip on her shoulder from dealing with sexist male superiors.” Probably not, but you get my point. I’ve been in a lot of auditions where I’ve been asked to read a scene with a completely different interpretation or style than how I’d prepared the scene.

As for Daniel, I didn't really start liking him until he came back from being Ascended the first time. He became one of my favorite characters during Season 9 and 10 (I am fully aware that I'm in the minority there.)

I love Daniel in both his pre/post Ascension forms. I loved Daniel as the mild-mannered Shanks-impersonating-Spader version, and I really liked it when you could see that Michael Shanks was making Daniel more of his own character. Personally, I’m not quite as fond of Daniel in Seasons 9/10, mainly because “Daniel” became so much like Michael Shanks is in real life (quite a bit more sarcastic and abrasive than Daniel in his previous forms) that I couldn’t see nearly as much of a distinction between character and actor.

I'll say again - one of the reasons that I like the recut version better is the absence of nekkidness. There is literally NO reason why the nudity was necessary. I believe it cheapened the show to be so gratuitous.

Oh absolutely. I really appreciate that TPTB felt the need to rectify that scene, since it’s pretty clear that that is not was Stargate was supposed to be about. Season 1 certainly dealt with a lot of storylines involving sex and rape (Emancipation, Brief Candle, Hathor), but other than the locker room scene in Broca Divide, it seemed pretty clear already that this wasn’t going to be an explicit, random-sex scene type of show, and for that I am eternally grateful.

It’s unfortunate that they felt the need to include the scene originally since they were on Showtime, but I just assume that since they quickly got picked up for two seasons (and then by the end of Season 1, Showtime gave them four full seasons), they felt that they didn’t need to keep including scenes like that, and they could make the show that they felt Stargate should be.

After having watched the DVDs with my mom for eight years, I finally, finally, finally watched “Chimera” with her because she got wind that there was an episode that I’d never shown her (I was a young teenager when I got into SG! ). It was an awful experience (like that episode always is!), but afterwards, my mom just said, “Welp, I’m glad the rest of the show isn’t like that!” And I definitely feel the same way.

There’s a reason that episode sticks out amongst the others and I thinks it’s because it’s way too explicit with romantic relationships, especially since the A-plot is Daniel/Sarah, and the B-plot is Sam/Pete. As much as I wish that character relationships were explored more in this show (my number one problem with SG-1/SGA is that character beats were glossed over or ignored completely), it really was most successful when plot was the main priority and character development happened slowly and implicitly.

[SamJackShipper93]

I'm giffing my way through The Road Not Taken at the moment and have ended up being confused about this whole major/colonel thing going on:

“Colonel Samantha Carter” is from our universe. “Major Samantha Carter” is from the other universe. Obviously Landry and Lee and Lorne and everybody else at SGC realize that she is not their original Samantha Carter. However, the episode never says that they make that revelation public. Even though the world knows about aliens attacking Earth, I’m sure that they thought alternate universes would be a pill too difficult to swallow, which is why Sam is the one to tell Rodney that she’s not his Sam Carter, and why the people at the party still refer to her as Major Carter, because they never knew that she died in the explosion.

The promotion from Major to Colonel is likely because our Sam (who is a Colonel but assumed by the public to be a Major) just saved the world from the Ori. That promotion will only matter to the people who assume she is still the original Major Carter. Landry and Lee and the others still say “Colonel” Carter when speaking to/about her because they know the truth – that she is a Colonel in the universe she comes from.

However, it is my best guess that by the time she appears on the news with Julia Donovan, the promotion hasn’t been made official yet. Until it is, our Sam would still have to appear as the original Major Carter.

[Samantha-Carter-is-my-muse]

“Colonel Samantha Carter” is from our universe. “Major Samantha Carter” is from the other universe. Obviously Landry and Lee and Lorne and everybody else at SGC realize that she is not their original Samantha Carter. However, the episode never says that they make that revelation public. Even though the world knows about aliens attacking Earth, I’m sure that they thought alternate universes would be a pill too difficult to swallow, which is why Sam is the one to tell Rodney that she’s not his Sam Carter, and why the people at the party still refer to her as Major Carter, because they never knew that she died in the explosion.

The promotion from Major to Colonel is likely because our Sam (who is a Colonel but assumed by the public to be a Major) just saved the world from the Ori. That promotion will only matter to the people who assume she is still the original Major Carter. Landry and Lee and the others still say “Colonel” Carter when speaking to/about her because they know the truth – that she is a Colonel in the universe she comes from.

However, it is my best guess that by the time she appears on the news with Julia Donovan, the promotion hasn’t been made official yet. Until it is, our Sam would still have to appear as the original Major Carter.

Thanks, SamJackShipper93, fogsblue on tumblr has the same theory - that the promotion hasn't happened yet, that they're probably planning on making a spectacle of it - and if I know the Landry of this universe right, he wouldn't miss an opportunity to stand next to the woman who saved the world. (Can you tell how I dislike this incarnation of Landry )

[webbo]

I don't have anything new to add to the discussion except - I noticed in the dinner scene on Abydos and the banquet scene on Chulak, Jack and Sam were sitting very close to one another. Probably due to filming requirements rather than any "ship".

I noticed that too. And you can tell Sam was laughing, joking, to try to ease into the situation. The whole episode was about them gaining familiarity with each other. I almost cringed every time Daniel called her, "Dr./Captain Carter" and Sam called him, Dr. Jackson. You can also tell how Amanda Tapping and Michael Shanks grew in their acting by leaps and bounds during the filming of the 10 seasons. Both the characters and the actors are a bit unsure, testing the relationships, testing the waters...

I just love this show.

[hedwig]

Oh absolutely. I really appreciate that TPTB felt the need to rectify that scene, since it’s pretty clear that that is not was Stargate was supposed to be about. Season 1 certainly dealt with a lot of storylines involving sex and rape (Emancipation, Brief Candle, Hathor), but other than the locker room scene in Broca Divide, it seemed pretty clear already that this wasn’t going to be an explicit, random-sex scene type of show, and for that I am eternally grateful.

It’s unfortunate that they felt the need to include the scene originally since they were on Showtime, but I just assume that since they quickly got picked up for two seasons (and then by the end of Season 1, Showtime gave them four full seasons), they felt that they didn’t need to keep including scenes like that, and they could make the show that they felt Stargate should be.

i could be wrong, but it was my understanding the Showtime demanded the nudity scene. And later on when Rob Cooper became executive producer of SG1, he was the one that wanted sexiness in various scenes. Brad Wright didn't want them at all.

[SamJackShipper93]

i could be wrong, but it was my understanding the Showtime demanded the nudity scene. And later on when Rob Cooper became executive producer of SG1, he was the one that wanted sexiness in various scenes. Brad Wright didn't want them at all.

Oh definitely. I believe that you're right, and that's what I was trying to say. The only reason that it's there is because of Showtime, because they were the ones that picked the show up.

[Britta]

This rewatch you all have going has given me an idea for a game, and I'd like to see how many of you are interested before I go to the effort of creating it. It would be over in the Fun and Games section. (To avoid spamming this thread and so that others know about it.)

It's an SG-1 Caption Contest! Basically, each round would last a week and would be based on one episode (two-parters would usually count as one episode) starting with Children of the Gods. I would post five screencaps, and you would get to post a caption for each of them (one caption per user per screencap, you can do as many of the screencaps as you want). These captions could be narration, dialog, go wild! You smash that fourth wall if you want! The goal is to be funny.

At the end of the week I would choose a favourite caption for each screencap, as well as choosing an overall favourite. This will likely be the only situation in which you'll be competing for my approval.

So, what do you think? Sound like fun? Care to compete for that most elite badge of honour... the Teal'c Seal of Hilarity?

[IamDKScully]

Britta, I like it!

[webbo]

Britta, the screen cap game idea is fabulous, I'm in!

[Akamaimom]

This rewatch you all have going has given me an idea for a game, and I'd like to see how many of you are interested before I go to the effort of creating it. It would be over in the Fun and Games section. (To avoid spamming this thread and so that others know about it.)

It's an SG-1 Caption Contest! Basically, each round would last a week and would be based on one episode (two-parters would usually count as one episode) starting with Children of the Gods. I would post five screencaps, and you would get to post a caption for each of them (one caption per user per screencap, you can do as many of the screencaps as you want). These captions could be narration, dialog, go wild! You smash that fourth wall if you want! The goal is to be funny.

At the end of the week I would choose a favourite caption for each screencap, as well as choosing an overall favourite. This will likely be the only situation in which you'll be competing for my approval.

So, what do you think? Sound like fun? Care to compete for that most elite badge of honour... the Teal'c Seal of Hilarity?

[IMG]http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h170/peanutbritta/SG1%20Caption%20Contest/capcon-tealc_zpsgycyr5ks.jpg[/]

Sounds like good times to me.

[Akamaimom]

I had a run-in with a person on another fandom today (on FB). She was highly derogatory and rude towards fanfic writers, calling them either "little girls" or "fat, middle-aged women". Then, she finished up her tirade by stating that "Fanfiction sucks."

I've heard people dismiss it, and make fun of writers, but never with this kind of vitriol. So, I have to ask. Do most people on this page read fanfic? Or do some of you like participating in the fandom without caring much for fanfic?

I'm just wondering, since fanfic is what brought me to Gateworld in the first place.

[Britta]

I don't actually read much fanfiction (though oddly enough I have written one short fic), but I don't agree with that level of hate. Sure, a lot of fanfiction is absolutely terrible but isn't that true of fiction in general?

Sure, it doesn't help that a lot of fanfiction has terrible spelling and grammar but again that's not all of it. When I see such hateful comments I can only conclude that their author never cared to go beyond a cursory glance at the world of fanfiction.

[iiradned]

I read fanfic everyday. A lot of the fic I read are for show, books, graphic stories that are no longer being produced and fic is the primary way for me to get my fix.

[Everlovin]

I had a run-in with a person on another fandom today (on FB). She was highly derogatory and rude towards fanfic writers, calling them either "little girls" or "fat, middle-aged women". Then, she finished up her tirade by stating that "Fanfiction sucks."

I've heard people dismiss it, and make fun of writers, but never with this kind of vitriol. So, I have to ask. Do most people on this page read fanfic? Or do some of you like participating in the fandom without caring much for fanfic?

I'm just wondering, since fanfic is what brought me to Gateworld in the first place.

I love reading fic. I love writing fic. I love both ship fic and gen fic. My thinking is everyone expresses their fandom in their own ways. I don't see me going for cosplay or roll playing games.