Daniel Jackson Discussion and Appreciation

[GateGipsy]

Magnolia, I think I agree wholeheartedly. You do mean it will seem so utterly insulting to NOT allow Daniel to have that sort of connection with the Ancients/Ascended considering his history with them right?(it's a little hard to tell for me from how it is worded). If it is, I agree.

It is such an insult and belittlement to not have Daniel's relationship to this acknowledged and made a significant part of the plot arcs regarding the Ancients/Ascended while transferring everything over to Jack with his "special genes" Jack's got the freakin' Asgard in his pocket already, this is just a little ridiculous. They will have literally stolen his unique story arc and given it to someone else(just like they've stolen numerous other things over the years and transferred them off to other people).

I'm not so sure I feel so strongly about that. There were precedents for Jack to have a link with the Ancients - Fifth Race established that. So I don't feel that to have Jack do so in Lost City in any way belittled Daniel's achievements and storylines.

However, I do agree that in making the Ancients a part of the 'mundane' they've lessened their impact, and the whole ascending thing, in particular Daniel's ascencion in Meridian, which is now no longer quite the wonderous event that it was. Then it felt as if he'd worked hard enough and deserved this incredible gift - and that all of SG1 might have reached that level too if Abyss is anything to go by. But then we find there's nothing 'earned' about it - acencion isn't a spiritual achievement but something that Oma can do anytime she feels fit.

Kinda a let down for me

[darklilac]

On a positive note, even if the writers did their best to downplay Daniel again in season 7, the character developed anyway thanks to MS.
His connection with Sarah/Osiris, even if not a romantic one, was very good, that part of Chimera was interesting and let the door open for further stories.

And there's always the possible return of Nick Ballard, at the last Con Michael said that he had wrote something with Greenburg, so maybe they'll let him do it.

[GateGipsy]

Well, I'm going to German City Con so I'll definitely be bugging Michael Greenburg about that. Would love to see Nick again!

[darklilac]

Good, maybe you could tell him that many fans would like to see the return of Nick.

[epiphany]

I'm not so sure I feel so strongly about that. There were precedents for Jack to have a link with the Ancients - Fifth Race established that. So I don't feel that to have Jack do so in Lost City in any way belittled Daniel's achievements and storylines.

I disagree. Jack had the Ancient's knowledge accidently downloaded into his brain and then it led him to the Asgard who took it all out again. It had no permanent effect on him whatsoever. Daniel's connection was far deeper and more profound. Of course Daniel was the one who initially was so convinced that there were "the Asgard" and pushed them to go to Cimmeria to try and find them too. So one could say that the Asgard storyline also started as Daniel's only to be given to Jack. They consistently take things away from Daniel. They've downplayed his(not to mention Catherine's!) contribution to the Stargate by trying to increase the credit Carter gets. Maybe once in a while they'll give a quick throwaway mention but note in every other AU SAM is the one who did it, thus basically saying they didn't really need Daniel to do it, Sam could have done it, she just didn't get the chance. Daniel just got lucky.

So to me it is just one more sympton of the way they downplay Daniel's importance to the overall storyarc of the Stargate Universe. They take away his arcs and character connections to give to other characters. They belittle and downplay his contributions. They pretend he is just some guy who translates stuff occasionally and makes a convenient negotiator instead of a the brilliant, unique intellectual mind and genius he is.

[Gategrrl]

Epiphany, I agree with everything you wrote there. But you did leave out that whatever connections Daniel DID have (Abydos) to the movie, and to his adoptive family, was also wiped out -- and made to be *his* fault, by appearances (which I don't agree with). Now, if that isn't downplaying the character, also, by making him look stupid (and Jack, too, now that I think about it), I don't know what does.

Also, don't forget, Daniel spent about a year or so on Abydos, and yet Skaara had a mystical sort of relationship with *Jack*, and any reaction Daniel had when Skaara was released from Klorel's control was avoided. Off-screen, of course.

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[epiphany]

Well yes of course, I was just trying to stick with the "ancients/ascended" plot arc for the most part. Because obviously once you get started you can end up with a pretty long list. Time and again interesting storyline after interesting storyline, character connection after character connection has been taken away from Daniel for no apparent reason other than to totally minimize his influence and effectiveness in the Stargate Universe.

They use the excuse that Daniel is hard to write for, blah blah--it's not that Daniel is hard to write for. It's that they keep taking away his interesting storylines and personal connections. It's like they go "Oh hey, that's interesting--let's take it away from Daniel and give it to ::insert Jack or Sam here::" and honestly that is something that has been happening almost since the beginning of the show. It's kind of pathetic on their part.

[GateGipsy]

Also, don't forget, Daniel spent about a year or so on Abydos, and yet Skaara had a mystical sort of relationship with *Jack*, and any reaction Daniel had when Skaara was released from Klorel's control was avoided. Off-screen, of course.

That bothered me too, but then a good part of Jack's story from the movie did revolve around Skaara, so while he wasn't there for a year, he did have a strong connection with him. And I have wondered how he felt after he shot Klorel in order to save Daniel too.

[GateGipsy]

They use the excuse that Daniel is hard to write for, blah blah

I gotta ask about this as I haven't seen any of the writers say that - can you point me in the direction? I remember JM saying that about Sam but not about Daniel. Cheers

[Madeleine]

Also, don't forget, Daniel spent about a year or so on Abydos, and yet Skaara had a mystical sort of relationship with *Jack*.

I have a fix for that, if you're interested.

Daniel had become familiar to Skaara, part of the family. Although Daniel was still a hero to the Abydonians Skaara must have picked up some of Sha're's irreverence towards him; Daniel and Skaara were rather big brother / little brother. Jack was a hero who hadn't stuck around to become familiar, and the hero-worship and idolising were all still there in Skaara. Daniel might even have downplayed his own role to puff up Jack and make himself seem more approachable whenever he and Skaara talked of the uprising during Daniel's year on Abydos.

I can't excuse what I always thought to be bad writing, but thinking of it this way makes me feel okay about it.

[GateGipsy]

oh yeah, I like your workaround on that better than mine Madeleine. I'll go with that!

[indeed_teal'c]

I do like daniel... he's had so many great moments and his love for Sha're... I like the episode "Crystal Skull" where he's ghost like... very cool...

[Iskandra]

It maybe just me, but I do enjoy fanfic of the hurt/comfort type...maybe I should wish for a bit more of hurting Daniel...? Okay, I suppose that was sick...

[Dani347]

It maybe just me, but I do enjoy fanfic of the hurt/comfort type

I loooove hurt/comfort Danielfic. The only thing is, when it comes to Daniel, tptb lately have been good with the hurt, and putrid with the comfort. So, I'd stick to fanfic, where the writers know how to give both.

[Bonnie Way]

I have to agree. There's a lot of set-up potential for angst, but the writers seem to drop the ball on the payoff, every time.