'Spoils of War' (412) General Discussion

[Mackan]

This episode was all right, but nothing special. I still feel as if I've learned nothing about how the Wraith beat the Ancients. So they had a massive army of cloned troops, big deal. They still needed the ships to make use of those troops, and I would assume building ships takes a hell of a lot longer to make than a batch of clones. Not to mention with the Ancient's technical superiority, the Wraith ships should have been having their clocks cleaned repeatedly. How did they gain and hold territory let alone maintain a steady advance? That's what I really need to know.

Also, this episode just had me constantly rolling my eyes. So let me get this straight, the Atlanteans, who planned and supposedly knew where they were going in the Asuran city, didn't have enough time to beam down a squad of Marines to appropriate a ZPM, but the Wraith, who probably didn't have nearly as much city knowledge as McKay and company, can send some darts down near the end of the battle and just grab a ZPM like that? Please. This only furthered my belief that the humans are idiots.

I don't even know what to say about the fact that they destroyed yet another hive ship. That was one of the most predictable and ridiculous things they've done in a while. Finally they get a hive with seemingly no strings attached, and they lose it? Are you kidding me? They should have gone straight to Atlantis after making sure the hive was secured, not use it for some scouting mission where they had no idea what was gonna happen. Where the hell was the Daedalus or Apollo? Only a week after the big battle and they're already gone? There should be one stationed over Atlantis at all times for security and missions just like this one.

Don't even get me started on the absurdity of Todd being let free. Why they would let him go off on his own I have no idea. Unless I'm supposed to believe he somehow overpowered his guards, Sheppard, and Ronon. And all this happened off screen no less. Dumb.

Other than that, not bad.

They can't keep a wraith hive ship, because it costs too much to make the CGI, causes trouble for the writers to construct future episodes, etc. You can bet that all ships they come over will be destroyed in the same episode. It is the same with their own ships, they can't use them all the time. Or, the writers do not put enough effort into writing the episodes. There are definatly room for better episodes, but they have to keep it dumbed down for various reasons. It is all becoming very predictable. But we have to live with that, and a sci-fi series like Stargate Atlantis is highly enjoyable nevertheless.

[Integrabyte]

The only good thing about SOW? We found out the secret mentioned in the "Aurora" episode . Had the ancients known, pow wow with a couple Auroras on that facilty and booom . Tide was turned in their favour.

[Vorash]

Just have to say i loved this ep seasone 4 is turning out to be the best seasone so far.

[doylefan22]

I was disappointed that Teyla's baby seem to more along the product of Michael's experiments rather than the loving relationship Teyla seems to make it seem like. It would have been nice to have a nice normal baby instead of what could be some form of mutant

I think basically the child will have inherited the same abilities Teyla has directly from her. Whilst pregnant the two minds are a lot closer together and can work as one to make her abilities more potent.

[fammann]

Seeing Teyla control a queen was all very interesting. I don't like how it puts the baby at risk though.Oh and it's a boy! Lorne and Teyla's little chat was obviously filler, but thier conversation was still kinda cute.

John and Teyla's scene, very touching. Nice climactic ending crashing the hive into the cloning facility but once again, no ZPMs..

Teylas chat with Lorne was no filler.

It's called character development.

What I would call filler is all the shooting around. Although it wasn't that much in this episode.

By the way I liked the ep. But not as good as the last two.

[dasNdanger]

Where to start. As a Lorne fan, it was nice to see him get some quality screen time, and to even talk more about his family. As a Todd fan, glad he's not dead but disappointed he's pulled a Ford.

Don't even get me started on the absurdity of Todd being let free. Why they would let him go off on his own I have no idea. Unless I'm supposed to believe he somehow overpowered his guards, Sheppard, and Ronon. And all this happened off screen no less. Dumb.

I love Todd. He’s just fantastic. It was great to hear him officially named - sorry Ruffles! I wonder what happened to him? I'm thinking he did escape, which is good. I want to see more of him.

Here's my overall impression about Todd's great escape.

It wasn't an 'escape'...but a slip out the back door, so to speak. In the hectic moments before crashing the ship, Todd has the opportunity to slip away from the others, and leave. I don't think that - at this point - they are seeing him as a prisoner. He's been a free agent since the battle - free to go his own way. And that's what he did - he chose to go his own way.

Perhaps he didn't want to be part of the plan to destroy the facility. Perhaps he was just tired of all the drama these humans create, and needed some peace and quiet. Afterall, between Rodney's whining, and Ronon's hateful glares, it's enough to burn a guy right out. Who needs that crap? A Wraith's main goal is to survive, and as long as he hangs with these humans, his survival will always be in doubt if they do not allow him chances to feed. He's much better going off on his own at this point.

Yes, it's frustrating that it happened off screen. I would have liked to see him butt heads with Sheppard - and maybe bring up the 'all bets are off' thing...and tell the Stargate folks to stick it, then take off on his merry little way. But it didn't happen that way.

Perhaps TPTB are testing the waters - testing to see if fans want more of this character. They left the possibilities wide open - either Todd is out there somewhere, doing Wraithy things...or he was din-din for his old pals on the other hive ship. Perhaps they just want to see if the character is worth keeping around.

das

[caty]

Careful sir...that question may force the writers to think in advance for once rather than just making stuff up as they go along.

You know, at times the writing on Stargate(both shows) seems like a young child who initially tells one white lie, but then needs to tell a never ending string of addtional lies to cover up their initial poor judgment call.

Keep in mind that they just obtained the ZPM's that were neccessary to power this facility. And warriors was what they needed first. That does not mean that the writers didn't take that into consideration. The wraith just may not have had the chance to go that far.
Same thing 10,000 years ago with the war against the ancients. They needed more warriors to defeat them.


Overall, I disagree with the majority here because for me, Spoils of War was WAY better that BAMSR. I always like the eps with the most character development best, and this one had it all. Including the action. Couldn't make me happier!

[Falcon Horus]

*saunters in to drop off small review*

Positive:

* Ronon yanking Rodney out of the dressing room
* Teyla playing with the Wraith Queen (who looked deliciously scary), that whole sequence was very wel done
* the other Wraith made me think of these dogs that have a flat nose, like they've run into something.
* now we know what the Wraith soldiers look like underneath their mask (thank you for that image )
* sweet Lorne
* sending the hive-o-gram - if we can't have the ZPM's than no one can ...
* poor Sheppard just doesn't know what to do when he's hugged, it's hilarious, looking like another iratus-bug attached itself to him

Negative:

* the whole episode was quite boring to be quite honest
* slow paced
* I missed Weir when they're talking in the control room.
* yeah, and I'm still dying of a Teyla-underdose, I don't think that will change again any time soon, and I don't see it changing into season 5 either.

[Lord batchi ball]

Overall, I disagree with the majority here because for me, Spoils of War was WAY better that BAMSR. I always like the eps with the most character development best, and this one had it all. Including the action. Couldn't make me happier!

Well that is the same way I feel. I liked this episode way more than BAMSR.

[Ruffles]

One can hope... But i wonder if John's thought of her wanting to be on the team was just her desire to find the rest of the Athosians or was from something else..

What do you think it might be?

On my notes.. did it look to anyone else like that one wraith (the one who served the queen/betrayed todd) was the same one who fed on Larrin and was bluffed by shepard in travelers??

It's the same actor. He's also the same one running the Wraith facility in Reunion.

Am I the only one who thought that maybe the reason Teyla had an easy time controlling the Wraith ship and the Queen's mind was because her baby is a Wraith?
I think it's possible that Michael implanted her, and that her belief that it is Kanan's baby is mistaken or wishful thinking. I can't remember which scene it was(maybe her conversation with Lorne) but she definitely had an uncertain look on her face when referring to her pregnancy. Lines like, "It's complicated" and "I'm not really sure what to expect" could indicate that she's at least a little afraid that all might not be as it seems.

If Teyla's baby is a Wraith, the diagnostic equipment in the infirmary and the biosensors in the control room should be tossed in the garbage. Seriously, after 3 months, you don't think Keller might have noticed that the baby is progressing slightly differently than expected?

I really enjoyed seeing the mission ready room scene! I got a kick out of seeing the team all get ready! I chuckled when Ronon yanked Rodney away so Sheppard and Teyla could talk. The poor guy is clueless, isn’t he?! Ronon just makes me smile!

I loved actually seeing the locker room. What a normal place to be. I didn't think Rodney was clueless though. I thought he was nosy. He had a front row seat for anticipated fireworks (since he missed them last time - it was only fair).

This was a good episode for Teyla too. It was interesting her baby makes her wraith abilities stronger. I wonder why that is? Is it just her son has a strong concentration of wraith DNA and can enhance her abilities owing to the combination of Teyla’s and Kanan’s DNA? Or is there something more sinister at play here? Guess we'll find out in time.

I wondered if Kanan might not also have "the gift" so that Baby Emmagan got a double dose of Wraith DNA. Or it could just be that having 2 lives working in concert made her abilities stronger.

I love Todd. He’s just fantastic. It was great to hear him officially named - sorry Ruffles! I wonder what happened to him? I'm thinking he did escape, which is good. I want to see more of him.

Alas, I'm still in mourning over the name.

Shep said at the end that Todd escaped in a dart through either a space gate or to the hive that was attacking. Personal opinion: Todd is WAY too smart to hang out with that hive. He hightailed it to the space gate as soon as he got a chance. Now he has to find a hive sympathetic to his point of view so he can command another ship.

I did find it interesting that after years of imprisonment by humans he was still allowed to command a ship. I wonder what kind of power he had before Kolya got him....

Hello everyone!

Could someone please tell me what kind of food is that, what Lorne gives to Rodney on the Wraith hive ship?
What does Rodney say after he grabs it?

Thanks in advance!

I think it was either a portion of an MRE or a PowerBar. Rodney said "apricot" something.

[EdenSG]

Another good episode!

I really liked this one, just as much if not more than BAMSR.

Last week was fast paced with a lot of action and a lot of plot turns – really great stuff. But this week also seemed fast paced to me too, not so much in action and plot turns but rather in story/character development. In this one episode we find out that the Wraith had a hidden agenda for participating in the battle last week- they had a stealth mission and took a ZPM, we saw the Wraith cloning facility in action and learned a lot about how the Wraith were able to defeat the Lanteans, Teyla using her supped up Wraith abilities to not only connect with the ship but to take over the Queen’s mind to “save” her teammates and there was some character development and character moments. There was a lot of stuff in this episode. For me this ep answered a lot of questions about the Wraith and the Wraith/Lantean War – and of course like any drama the answers lead to more questions. I also thought the story showed a lot of continuity as it picked up on several storylines from previous episodes/seasons.

Really liked:

The Teyla and John moments – The episode started out with them still at odds over her role with the team now that she has revealed she is pregnant and it ended with them understanding where each was coming from and John showing support. What I liked was how the events in the story precipitated their conversations and forced each of them to reconsider what they had said to each other and eventually coming to agreement on what her role should/would be.

The Ronon and McKay dynamic can be a lot of fun. Ronon dragging McKay out of the locker room when John wanted to talk to Teyla and on the Wraith ship when Ronon activated the map and McKay is like “What did you do?”

The sets and CGI were impressive. A really great scene at the end with the Wraith ship crashing into the cloning facility.

Lorne – We got a little back story and such a nice conversation with Teyla. I think I see him as Uncle Lorne.

The interaction between John, Ronon and McKay when they were captive and forced to confront the Queen – John’s being able to so strongly resist the Queen (he did say he has had practice), Ronon yelling feed on me when the Queen threatened to feed on one of them and then John’s look of distress as he tried to break free to help Rodney – to me it demonstrated a close knit team that really cares about and will defend each other. And then even Teyla got involved with this too when she connected with the Queen to find them – she was ‘sorta’ there with the rest of them.

The Wraith Queen and Teyla interaction. Well done on all fronts, the script, the acting and the camera/lighting – made it seem a bit creepy to me. (And Todd was really surprised that Teyla was capable of doing that – not sure if it means anything, I just thought is was interesting). I liked how they showed the Queen talking over her shoulder so you could see/hear the battle of wills going on.

Teyla, the Queen & John - It was a nice little twist with the baby augmenting Teyla’s abilities but then having the Queen trying to exploit that as a vulnerability of Teyla’s – also drove home that fact that Teyla is not in this alone, the decisions she makes not only effect her, but also her baby and consequently the team. Also liked the fact that Teyla called out to John for help, (I actually think this was poignant as she called out to him for help when she knew he was the one who was so against/concerned about her being there as it might put her and the baby in jeopardy) - John realized Teyla was in trouble with the Queen and responded by killing the Queen. I also like the fact that he didn’t throw it back in face later. The ending scene on the balcony he let her talk, he stood by his belief but not in an angry way but more supportive.

A few spots dragged a little but not for long.
I would have liked to see some mention of Carter
Todd's escape was a bit too convienant but necessary if they want the character to return,

All in all I really enjoyed this episode.

[Vala_M]

I wonder...are only the masked warriors cloned? And the unmasked ones, perhaps individuals in of themselves, without clones?

About Todd...am I the only one that is enjoying the 'snarling' between him and Ronon? It's like a classic testosterone standoff - each trying to prove they are the Alpha Alien.

das

I thought that the masks were part of their skeletons as was shown with the Wraith skeleton in "Poisoning The Well" or was that never established? What perpose does the mask serve?

We don't really know where the Aurora aftter they found out the Wraith's weakness. Is it really out of the realm of possibility. If the Ancients had been able to destroy the Wraith facuility, it would had seriously crippled the Wraith's presence in the war.

I thought that there NEVER was a Wraith weakness, that it was just a bit of fake information that the Wraith who was posing as the first officer put into the computers of the virtual environment to make the captain focus on fixing the hyperdrive in order for the Wraith to get the information to upgrade their hyperdrives.

Vala,

[Myles]

.....
I thought that there NEVER was a Wraith weakness, that it was just a bit of fake information that the Wraith who was posing as the first officer put into the computers of the virtual environment to make the captain focus on fixing the hyperdrive in order for the Wraith to get the information to upgrade their hyperdrives.

Vala,

I never got that impression, but it's possible. It'd be interesting if this was the secret they had discovered, though.

[jelgate]

I thought that there NEVER was a Wraith weakness, that it was just a bit of fake information that the Wraith who was posing as the first officer put into the computers of the virtual environment to make the captain focus on fixing the hyperdrive in order for the Wraith to get the information to upgrade their hyperdrives.Vala,

I am curious what made come to that theory. The Aurora episode said that the weakness had been erased form logs. I don't remember it saying anything about the weakness not existing

[Chailyn]

Teylas chat with Lorne was no filler.

It's called character development.

I agree. I think after Sheppard questioned her in the beginning and then her questioning herself, she needed someone to just say something nice and ressuring to her. So, not only did we learn a little about Lorne, but it wasn't even really a conversation about the baby. It was about Teyla and how she'd handle her new responsibilities. And instead of making a big deal out of it, Lorne treated it as if it was the most normal thing in the world, even relating it to his sister. In the beginning, Teyla was talking about the baby as if it was something sacred. "The last of my people". By the end, she was just seeing it at a normal, maternal level that Lorne was talking about. It's her baby, and it's now her first priority. I think it was an angle Teyla needed to see.

If Teyla's baby is a Wraith, the diagnostic equipment in the infirmary and the biosensors in the control room should be tossed in the garbage. Seriously, after 3 months, you don't think Keller might have noticed that the baby is progressing slightly differently than expected?

Agree. If they can detect nanites then they better be able to give an accurate pregnancy test. I will be disappointed if they pull another "Who's the baby's father?" twist.

I loved actually seeing the locker room. What a normal place to be. I didn't think Rodney was clueless though. I thought he was nosy. He had a front row seat for anticipated fireworks (since he missed them last time - it was only fair).

I liked seeing the locker room too. So, do you think this was the male locker room or a unisex one? I didn't see any shower units. Interesting.

I wondered if Kanan might not also have "the gift" so that Baby Emmagan got a double dose of Wraith DNA. Or it could just be that having 2 lives working in concert made her abilities stronger.

I hope this is the explanation. Teyla did say Kanan has the ability to be a leader (and her sensing the Wraith was one reason her people followed her, I believe), so maybe he has the Wraith DNA too, but just isn't as accepting of the powers and responsibilities.