Sheppard needs to be demoted....

[vaberella]

Racist probably isn't the right term here. Xenophobic is closer: Bates had a deep suspicion (bordering on manic paranoia) regarding Teyla and her people. The color of their skin didn't matter, their place of origin did. They were ALIENS. They weren't from Earth. Therefore, they were not to be trusted.

This is one of the things about Bates I didn't much care for- it's something that could have been built up in an interesting and meaningful way (he could full well have valid reasons for his suspicions based on previous experience) but as with so much else on the show, it was done unevenly and without being put into the proper context to help us understand him.

Or that's how I feel about it, anyway. Bates could have been a much better, stronger character if TPTB had just given a damn.

Uh...reverse that....The Atlantis crew are aliens and they have their own sect...Teyla and her people are not the aliens here. And I guess it would be better termed 'speciesist' (yeah it's a real term).

But I agree with much of it. Although I loved Bates as he was and I may have to say he wasn't a speciesist..more so just really suspicious of them. Which is understandable and I didn't blame him fro that and me in that position I would be too. But then I woul dhave had all my people under suspicion but only the off world teams. Since I know the rest of the people of the Athosians were not able to get in contact without leaving the planet and that must have been monitored.

Another little bit of error that the writers seemed to have omitted.

TPTB don't give a flying **** what the fans think, who they like, who they don't like, or what they want to see. If they did the show would be very VERY different than what it is.

If they did I don't think I'd want to watch...would you?

You can please some of the people some of the time, not all of the people all of the time...and if you do, your doing something wrong!

Which is a quote I agree with. Do you know how many shippers would overrun and how much romantic bull crap I'd have to sit through if TPTB listened to the fans. I like the show as it is...and to quote JF....---'relationships aren't that important to me' which I agree with..sure it has it's place, but it's not necessary. I'm more into development.

And to accomodate all the needs, especialy what I'm seeing on the board....come on..they'd be shooting themselves in the foot with paying attention with the fans.
VB

[ShadowMaat]

Uh...reverse that....The Atlantis crew are aliens and they have their own sect...Teyla and her people are not the aliens here. And I guess it would be better termed 'speciesist' (yeah it's a real term).

Doesn't matter. From Bates's perspective I'm still willing to bet that he saw THEM as the aliens, regardless of semantics.

Speciesist... I have a bit of trouble with that word in this context. "Species" to me means an entirely- and visibly- separate species. The Athosians are still human (barring any genetic manip), their ancestors simply weren't born on Earth.

I also don't know if I'd necessarily call Bates xenophobic OR speciesist. He may have some of the characteristics, but I don't think it's full-blown. I was just trying to head off a "race" war in the thread by fixing the terminology.

[Deevil]

Interesting I thought Bates just didn't trust a race of people he didn't know. And really, you can't blame him. Being that far away from home and the head of security, your job is to suspect everything and everyone. If you don't know them, and don't know what code they live by, it is difficult to detirmine what they are going to do, and thus they are difficult to trust.

[ShadowMaat]

Interesting I thought Bates just didn't trust a race of people he didn't know. And really, you can't blame him. Being that far away from home and the head of security, your job is to suspect everything and everyone. If you don't know them, and don't know what code they live by, it is difficult to detirmine what they are going to do, and thus they are difficult to trust.

Yup, there's certainly a lot of that, too. But I felt that he took it to extremes sometimes and it made me wonder if there was more to his paranoia/suspicions... or if it was just bad writing.

[Deevil]

You could be right Shadow, there could ahve definatly been more to his paranoia. They might have even wanted to explore it, but for whatever reasons he didn't come back this season, so we may never find out.

[Willow'sCat]

and Colonel Caldwell needs to take over the military contingent.

You have to love people who go around starting threads and then forget to actually put in the first post the reasons they have for starting the thread. *well no you don't and I don't either*

Why does Col Caldwell (that isn't the correct spelling is it?) need to take over?

Why should that mean Sheppard is demoted?

Why doesn't McKay ever have sex with the hot alien babes? *sorry while I was asking*

Why am I bothering to even type this anymore...

Aw, leave John alone he has a tough job to do and he is doing his best.

[ShadowMaat]

Because around here opinions are actually FACTS and FACTS don't need to be explained?

Sorry, I was being sarcastic again, wasn't I?

[IWantToBelieve]

All I have to add to this thread is that if they ever did kill off Sheppard, I would stop watching. I enjoy the other characters, but Sheppard is what keeps me there. He's what made me watch. I wasn't even going to tune in to the show till I saw the preview shows where they were talking with Joe Flanigan. Then the ads for 'get in the gate' or whatever they were, with him and Sam, and I thought that maybe this leading guy might actually bring something good to the show. I've been hooked since then.

And okay, I have another point to add, I agree with whomever it was that hates killing off of characters. I'm still stewing over Frasier's completely unwarranted and unnecessary death. *still*

[Linzi]

All I have to add to this thread is that if they ever did kill off Sheppard, I would stop watching. I enjoy the other characters, but Sheppard is what keeps me there. He's what made me watch. I wasn't even going to tune in to the show till I saw the preview shows where they were talking with Joe Flanigan. Then the ads for 'get in the gate' or whatever they were, with him and Sam, and I thought that maybe this leading guy might actually bring something good to the show. I've been hooked since then.

And okay, I have another point to add, I agree with whomever it was that hates killing off of characters. I'm still stewing over Frasier's completely unwarranted and unnecessary death. *still*

Ditto.

[Avatar28]

You have to love people who go around starting threads and then forget to actually put in the first post the reasons they have for starting the thread. *well no you don't and I don't either*

Why does Col Caldwell (that isn't the correct spelling is it?) need to take over?

Why should that mean Sheppard is demoted?

Why doesn't McKay ever have sex with the hot alien babes? *sorry while I was asking*

Why am I bothering to even type this anymore...

Aw, leave John alone he has a tough job to do and he is doing his best.

1. He shouldn't. He's too busy going back and forth in the Daedalus so would be too often not present.
2. He wouldn't have to be even IF Caldwell was given command. But he hasn't done anything to warrant that anyways. Last time I checked there aren't any military regs against sleeping with alien women and he hasn't done anything else worthy of getting demoted either.
3. Um, because he's a nerd/geek and hot women never seem to go for the brainy types. They always seem to prefer the jocks, i.e. Sheppard.
4. Because you're like the rest of us and have no life? ;-)

[Willow'sCat]

Because around here opinions are actually FACTS and FACTS don't need to be explained?

Sorry, I was being sarcastic again, wasn't I?

Where you? Missed it completely.

How bad would SGC look if they had to go and demoted him again... it is again? He was apparently demoted or at least push aside after that incident in Afghanistan. No it would look bad for SGC if they demoted him. It's bad enough they had... spoiler for Critical Mass.

Spoiler:

A Goa'uld commanding the Daedalus for a while there. It's like the keystone cops, do they ever get anything write?

On the Ditto no I would still watch, but I would miss him. Like with Daniel, still watched but missed him... like with Jack still watch but really miss him.

[Rodan5757]

Yea, I have a love/hate relationship for Sheppard, I love the fact that he's a Stargate character/I hate what TPTB have choosen to display. He's supposedly a stand up guy, gives everything for his team, smart....and yet, we see very little of this. Your on an alien planet and a giant ray beam destorys some Wraith darts, but he doesn't even suspect that the alien priestess that *really* wants to go back to Atlantis isn't hiding something. This isn't the Mensa test passing military guy I'd expect.

And yes...McKay does need to start have sex with hot alien babes! I don't need a suave Colonel getting all the action, give some to the *GEEK*!

[Willow'sCat]

1. He shouldn't. He's too busy going back and forth in the Daedalus so would be too often not present.
2. He wouldn't have to be even IF Caldwell was given command. But he hasn't done anything to warrant that anyways. Last time I checked there aren't any military regs against sleeping with alien women and he hasn't done anything else worthy of getting demoted either.
3. Um, because he's a nerd/geek and hot women never seem to go for the brainy types. They always seem to prefer the jocks, i.e. Sheppard.
4. Because you're like the rest of us and have no life? ;-)

Hey I have a life it is sitting in a small blue box at the end of my bed. As for the rest well I agree with 1 and 2 not sure I agree on 3 guessing you are a guy?

[ShadowMaat]

It's tempting to turn this into a long ranting diatribe about the utter meaninglessness of death in the Stargateverse, but that's probably a subject best left for another thread.

Personally, I don't watch Atlantis for Sheppard. If anything, at this point I watch in spite of him. However, as much fun as it is to theorize about other possibilities and getting rid of Shep and bringing in someone else (or promoting another character), I think it's pretty obvious that it will never happen.

I think it's safe to say that Shep's detractors are a definite minority. Not that it matters too much since the most important thing about Shep is that he's TPTB's Marty Sue- their puppet through which they can live vicariously, fulfilling all their wildest fanboy fantasies, and they aren't about to get rid of THAT golden apple any time soon.

All my opinion, of course.

[Rodan5757]

I think it's safe to say that Shep's detractors are a definite minority. Not that it matters too much since the most important thing about Shep is that he's TPTB's Marty Sue- their puppet through which they can live vicariously, fulfilling all their wildest fanboy fantasies, and they aren't about to get rid of THAT golden apple any time soon.

Very well put. I couldn't agree more...well I could, but I don't think I will...to much effort you know.