The Intruder (202)

[sparklegem]

And why didn't Sheppard and McKay do anything to protect their eyes, and skin too, from the star in the F302?

What could they have done? They were trapped in the F-302 before they realized they would have to fly in it, so they didn't bring anything with them. Unless you think there was something stored in the F-302 that they didn't use?

I didn't have a problem with Landry, Caldwell, and the others inquiry into a new military leader. Yes, Sheppard is capable and has saved many lives, but on an isolated outpost in another galaxy, one of the most important missions that humanity has ever embarked on, it should be assured that the best possible people are there. For all we know, Caldwell could do a better job as the military leader of Atlantis. We can't know who the best choice would have been, but I think the concern was valid.

And I didn't think McKay was just a clown. He was haughtily interacting with Hermiod and, while he could have been more acerbic, he was shoving past everyone that was blocking his way to instruments or control panels.

[ShadowMaat]

What could they have done? They were trapped in the F-302 before they realized they would have to fly in it, so they didn't bring anything with them.

I think the issue is more with the fact that there WAS no protection. And if you're going to be using ANY craft in space, it had bloody well better have SOME way to protect its occupants from the sun (or star if you have to be nitpicky ). Polarization is mandatory, especially if you're gonna have a big, open canopy like that. If it's made out of some "magic polymer" that shields you from radiation and keeps your retinas from melting, I think it'd be a good fact to drop in somewhere.

As I said, I don't know a LOT about the subject, but I know that I've read books where people will be in orbit over earth and their faceplates will instantaneously polarize to the max as soon as they turn towards the sun. And that's from a good clip away. I was under the impression that Shep and McKay were a bit closer than that. Close enough for their instrumentation to be affected. They should have been dead long before that point. Or at the very least incapacitated by heat prostration and blindness.

I know it seems like a small thing to a lot of people, but it bugs the hell out of me. I wonder how- or why- TPTB overlooked something like that. So that the facts wouldn't get in the way of good storytelling? Well, maybe THEY think it was good storytelling, but I beg to differ. I'm willing to suspend disbelief for some things so I can enjoy the moment, but this isn't one of those moments and it definitely isn't one of those things.

[watcher652]

Wow, 10 pages for this episode already! I'm really slow in responding to this episode. I haven’t read the pages of posts so forgive me if I repeat things or ask questions that have answers already. I just wanted to get all my thoughts down. This running commentary is ridiculously long, I know.

BTW, I liked the episode. Lots of character moments, some action, some humor. I just have an overactive mind when it comes to questions.

- Damn, I miss the opening credits! I so wanted to see Paul McGillion in the credits.
- What was the real reason John couldn’t sleep?
- John is so cute all excited about being promoted. I bet he never thought that would happen.
- John gives Elizabeth a funny look when she says obviously the people whose opinions matter the most thought John deseved to be promoted. John must realize the only person who could possibly be on his side is Elizabeth.
- The senior staff went back to the SGC thru the Gate because Atlantis has the ZPM. But they have to take 18 days to get back on the Daedalus because Earth Gate doesn’t have a ZPM power to send them back. I wonder how long they spent on Earth debriefing, getting supplies and new personnel.
- How did that crewman know Elizabeth and John were in the mess?
- Why is Carson checking out the dead doctor? Doesn’t the Daedalus have its own doctor?
- Is Dr. Monroe one of the new Atlantis crew? He didn’t even get to the Pegasus Galaxy.
- Why is Rodney reviewing what the dead doctor was doing? Doesn’t the Daedalus have its own engineer/head computer technician/whoever?
- Oh look, there’s Garwin Sanford’s name in the credits. I know what that means.
- Loved the flashback with Weir, Landry and Caldwell. What a bad approach Landry took in announcing the possible new military commander. Landry seems to understand the political game being played and seems to admire Elizabeth’s stand. Was that a setup by Landry? Did he disagree with the choice of Caldwell? Landry doesn’t seem too upset that Elizabeth wants John as the military head of Atlantis instead of Caldwell. Caldwell looks justifiable angry. Caldwell was very agreeable with Elizabeth in The Siege 3. That must have been because he was trying to get on her good side since he was sure he was going to have to work closely with her as the new military commander. So they’ve set up the friction that is to come between Elizabeth and Caldwell. Caldwell won’t be getting along with John either, although it really isn’t John’s fault. But Caldwell certainly won’t agree with John’s non-military, seat of the pants ways.
- Interesting that Elizabeth had that “discussion” with John at the end of Hot Zone about John disobeying orders yet seems not to be so upset with it now.
- Is Rodney investigating this murder investigating by himself? What kind of crew does the Daedalus have?
- Rodney seems surprised that Caldwell listened to his advice to drop out of hyperspace. But Caldwell is no fool. Presented with the proper information, he’s does the right thing.
- I know I should have brought this up in the Siege 3 thread, but I wonder if Rodney and Caldwell have a history? Because when Rodney said his first words to the Daedalus, Caldwell responded to Rodney personally without being told it was Rodney speaking. So it seems to me Caldwell recognized Rodney by voice. Maybe there’s something in their personal history to make Rodney surprised that Caldwell would listen to him. I probably just have an overactive imagination.
- Love Hermiod’s attitude! He’s just as snarky as Rodney is. When Hermiod was with Novak, he didn’t seem that way. I wonder if Hemiod’s attitude is the result of having to deal with Rodney? I know we shouldn't expect all the Asgard to act the same. But Hermiod seems to have a lot of attitude. Does Hermiod adapt to whom he has to deal with?
- Sheppard being weirded out by Hermiod was funny. At least Sheppard acts like a normal person when it comes to non-humanoid aliens. He’s been aware of aliens and wormholes and all this stuff for only a year. He hasn’t really seen any non-humanoid looking aliens except for the mist creatures in Home. And thanks for mentioning Hermiod was naked!
- By now, Rodney must think he’s some sort of jinx. It’s a wonder he hasn’t suffered from a breakdown yet. Gaul and Abrams. The 5 scientists in the Hot Zone. Peter Grodin. Now Lindstrom. All of them died either right in front of his eyes or almost in front of his eyes. He must have nightmares.
- Was Lindstrom another new Atlantis expedition member?
- OK, I’ve given up wondering where the Daedalus is hiding its CMO and its Chief Engineer/Head Computer Person. Thanks for tending to Rodney, Carson.
- According to Caldwell it’s been at least 2 months that the Daedalus has been at Atlantis. Did the Atlantis senior members leave thru the wormhole at the same time the Daedalus left for Earth from Atlantis?
- Caldwell gets in a dig about the new personnel. I wonder if Kavanaugh got sent back to Earth? Was Bates still in his coma and sent back, too?
- Ooh. Carson in civvies! (cough, sorry about that).
- Carson is the Chief Surgeon? Is that his title? I though he was the Chief Medical Officer. Surgeon, geneticist, doctor. How can Carson think he’s not qualified?
- Ah, here’s the breakup scene. Oops, not yet.
- Hermiod “How perceptive.” This Asgard definitely has an attitude.
- “Airperson” ?
- “Crap, indeed.” I swear Hermiod is adapting to Rodney.
- Rodney looks like he needs a shave when he’s reporting on the situation to Caldwell, Sheppard and Weir. Doesn’t Rodney ever get a chance to get a full night’s sleep?
- Yes, Sheppard gets to fly! Bright idea to shoot out the transmitter, John. And you must have been studying up on the F-302 when you were back on Earth.
- Why does Rodney brace for impact but Elizabeth doesn’t?
- Hey, Elizabeth can have ideas, too. Use the transport beam. Doesn’t Caldwell know enough about his ship to suggest these things himself?
- Ooh. John in civvies! (cough, sorry about that).
- The flashback John had about Ford was very moving. And let’s add to John’s guilt, shall we?
- Can you move in a transport beam? Because John went from sitting in his ship to standing on the bridge.
- Isn’t that ship still heading for the Wraith? Is that good? Shouldn’t it be shot down? Maybe it's out of range. Some acknowledgement of that would have been nice.
- Elizabeth is getting touchy feely with all her staff. She gives Rodney a little pat on the back as he works on rebooting the Daedalus.
- Rodney is really a genius. Knowing how to reboot the Daedalus is just one of the many things he seems to know.
- Ok, here’s the breakup scene. Simon fesses up that he met someone. That’s fine, Simon. But why didn’t you tell Elizabeth right away instead of stringing her along? She gives you a video good bye, and then you get another video that tells you to move on. So you had permission and you did move on. Who would have blamed you after Elizabeth chickened out the first time in telling you goodbye? You probably met this person before you got the second video and were feeling guilty (I hope). But instead of telling her right away when she first got back, you pretended you were still her boyfriend. You let her think you were considering going to the Pegasus Galaxy. That’s just plain sleazy. Was the stringing along payback for the initial video goodbye? Was the different hair due to a mid life crisis because Elizabeth dumped you instead of the other way around? Or was the different hair because of all the complaints that when you first appeared you looked exactly like a certain SG1 character?
- Rodney remembers a similar situation happening at the SGC. That ought to make happy all those people who complaining about every Atlantis episode is so much like at least 3 SG1 episodes.
- Why is it only Rodney and John taking out the memory modules in the F-302s? Doesn’t anybody else on the Daedalus know these ships? I know the civilians are in lockdown, but what about the Daedalus crew?
- Rodney squishing himself down so he’s a smaller object to transport was funny. And I see he’s taken John’s remark about having bits not transported to heart. Does Rodney really have his hands where I think he does? Rodney in his semi-seated crouch looks like he expects to be transported into one of the ships.
- Rodney seems really surprised that the transport beam worked. Sometimes it doesn’t pay to be a genius and able to think of all the worse case scenarios in a flash.
- What’s that yellow thing in the first ship Rodney’s in? Looks like a personal object. That must mean there are pilots assigned to certain ships. Why isn’t at least one of them helping John and Rodney? Yeah, I know. It’s for the drama. Well, I don’t mind, just bringing it up.
- Rodney leaping up to check if John is working in that ship seemed so Rodney.
- Why does it take so long for John to respond to Caldwell when the bay shield failed? Maybe “Damn, Rodney and I almost died there” got him a little distracted.
- Rodney must really be claustrophobic. This is the third time he’s brought it up. But he doesn’t seem to have problems being in the Puddlejumper (other than in Thirty Eight Minutes) or in an Atlantis transporter. Maybe he only gets claustrophobic in small places where there’s a real possibility of certain doom.
- John tells Rodney to be quiet by pointing his finger in the air. And I love how Rodney did shut up without an argument. For the moment. Amazing, Rodney does listen.
- So there’s that errant ship! Why did everyone, including John, forget about the ship John was in? Did they all assume it was making tracks to the Wraith? John didn’t seem like he suddenly got a brainstorm about it. He just matter of fact-ly realized it.
- Did the rear sensors go offline? Because how did the Daedalus miss that ship shadowing them?
- Great special effects of the F-302s flying thru space. I could really feel the speed.
- John calmly talking to Rodney as he concentrates on destroying the other ship is great. John can multi-task. You can’t shut up Rodney when he’s panicking, so why even try?
- Good shooting, John!
- Why did John pat Rodney on the head for doing great but then tease him about flying the ship?
- Obviously, despite being cramped, Rodney doesn’t mind the flying part of being in the ship since he seemed disappointed that John didn’t let him fly.
- Did Elizabeth leave Teyla in charge of Atlantis when she was away? I wonder how the expedition felt about that. Or the folks on Earth. Teyla isn’t of Earth, would they have a problem with her?
- Nice that Teyla anticipated John’s desire to read the reports about Ford. I’m sure she’s as concerned in finding her lost teammate as John is.
- Teyla has a new top.
- Why is Carson standing at Rodney’s side in the control room while Rodney types at a console instead of making a beeline to the infirmary?
- What is Rodney checking on? Is he running a diagnostic to check for hidden Wraith viruses?
- Looks like Carson has taken a page out of John’s “How to deal with Rodney” book. Just agree with Rodney, it makes life so much easier.
- Do Elizabeth and Teyla have on more eye makeup than they used to?
- Looks like Radek got a haircut.
- Radek said ZeePM, not ZedPM. Somehow I had thought the whole world except the US and a couple of small countries said Zed instead of Zee. Is Rodney the only one stubborn enough to keep on saying ZedPM? Stubborn, hmm, I think that’s a yes.

That was fun! We get a little bit of Earth, some set up for future tensions, and have further proof the Wraith are pretty clever with their tech as well as being life sucking aliens.

[ShadowMaat]

Lots and lots of good questions asked, watcher, but you forgot something a little obvious that answers at least half of them: Atlantis is the greatest, most brilliant, most perfect team in the history of the universe (other than SG-1, of course). They can do absolutely ANYTHING, which is very handy since most of the people around them are so absolutely incompetent it's a wonder they can keep their jobs. So the Daedalus crew is made up of a bunch of idiots, led by an even BIGGER idiot, and that's why the Atlantis team had to take over everything in order to save the day.

Regarding Simon, I really wish they'd given us a bit more on that, just because it was so... gappy... but I'm going with the idea that Weir never actually gave Simon a chance to explain himself or what he'd been up to and that he was reluctant to bring it up, for whatever reason. Maybe because by holding off, he makes Weir look like the wounded party and the angst and attention is all on her instead of whatever HE suffered through when she left him.

Anyway, work is beckoning. *shudder* I hope today is better than yesterday...

[Hatcheter]

A strange, random thought hit me, going from these two lines at the end of the ep:

Sheppard: "Any word from your offworld contacts?"

Teyla: "We have recieved several intelligence reports, although as of yet there is no news of Lt. Ford."

So, is Teyla now Atlantis' intelligence chief? Maybe she's setting up a network of contacts across the galaxy, to gather info and spread misinformation about the fate of Atlantis.

I've got all sorts of weird and ill-formed plot bunnies coming to mind now.

[the dancer of spaz]

A strange, random thought hit me, going from these two lines at the end of the ep:

Sheppard: "Any word from your offworld contacts?"

Teyla: "We have recieved several intelligence reports, although as of yet there is no news of Lt. Ford."

So, is Teyla now Atlantis' intelligence chief? Maybe she's setting up a network of contacts across the galaxy, to gather info and spread misinformation about the fate of Atlantis.

I've got all sorts of weird and ill-formed plot bunnies coming to mind now.

That'd be nice. Let's hope they're nothing like the Genii.

[joasia]

I don't know. Stargates have been able to survive plenty of trauma before (in A Matter of Time the off-world one was able to last quite a while against the black hole and the Earth gate survived the bomb detonation, and in Exodus the gate was able to last at least a few minutes inside the star).

The gravity pull is not a nuclear blast... And IIRC the one sent into a star had some kind of shield added to allow it to last long enough to blow up the star. And we do know that naquadah enchances the power of nuclear explosion.

But anyway, Teyla had convinced the Wraith that they were about to abandon Atlantis. And even if the Wraith tried to send through a few Darts, they could have interpreted the ships being destroyed by the shield as them being instantaneously crushed by the water pressure at the bottom of the Atlantean ocean.

They could send some small signalling device... Some little machine that goes PING

But i somehow forgot about Teyla messing with their minds. That could be it. I wonder how soon will they blow their cover...

[DarkQuee1]

It was only an OK ep. At least, they acknowledged the "Entity" re-cycle; "Tangent" element went unacknowledged.

One thing I wondered about: why was Weir so upset about Simon? In addition to disappearing for a year without Simon's having any indication that she would ever be back (and in addition to wanting him to drop everything to go to another galaxy), didn't she basically tell him not to wait and to move on in her "Letter"?

[greytop]

I have seen these at the end of the show. Are they new to the RL market and what at they called?

[NotANumber]

What could they have done? They were trapped in the F-302 before they realized they would have to fly in it, so they didn't bring anything with them. Unless you think there was something stored in the F-302 that they didn't use?

I could be wrong on this, but I think that everytime we've previously seen someone get into a fighter, their helmet was already in their seats waiting for them. Wouldn't it make sense to have the helmets there so they don't have to carry them to and fro each and every time?


(By the way, I think I've made a booboo that may be rippling through the thread. Is it an F-302 or an X-302? Or do both exist?)

[Steve_the_Wraith]

(By the way, I think I've made a booboo that may be rippling through the thread. Is it an F-302 or an X-302? Or do both exist?)

The X-302 was the prototype fighter from "Redemption"(601)
The F-302's are the production models seen in Atlantis and in "Lost City"(722)

So the X-302 was the fighter from Redemption but all the other fighters are F-302s.

[NotANumber]

The X-302 was the prototype fighter from "Redemption"(601)
The F-302's are the production models seen in Atlantis and in "Lost City"(722)

So the X-302 was the fighter from Redemption but all the other fighters are F-302s.

Thanks for that. I was actually watching Redemption today and it got me thinking about it.

[Steve_the_Wraith]

Thanks for that. I was actually watching Redemption today and it got me thinking about it.

Your welcome.

BTW Sorry if my post seemed abit... loud(I suppose thats the word) it wasn't your post but the whole X-302/F-302 thing has been getting on my nerves recently

[Easter Lily]

One thing I wondered about: why was Weir so upset about Simon? In addition to disappearing for a year without Simon's having any indication that she would ever be back (and in addition to wanting him to drop everything to go to another galaxy), didn't she basically tell him not to wait and to move on in her "Letter"?

Since when do you know human beings to be logical... especially about relationships...

But I've already made a post earlier about this...

[the dancer of spaz]

The franchise just needs to ditch any overt references to ship when it comes to their female characters (Sam, Elizabeth, Teyla, Vala, Janet, Carolyn, etc.), because something always happens and fans wig out. And it's not the female's faults all the time either.

Either the writers don't even it out on the male counterpart's side, making it seem that much more unrequited and unreciprocated, or they write a scene where the character is either doing something (a) unprofessional or (b) ridiculous.

I like ship. I'm a Sam/Jack shipper, I think it's perfectly healthy and normal to ship, and I'm willing to personally ship all of the permutations under the sun for Atlantis - Lord knows there's about 20 of 'em. But I don't need to see it on screen - even when it has to do with Elizabeth and Simon, and ESPECIALLY when TPTB are suggesting that she's got the hots for Sheppard and TH is suggesting that she's got the hots for Caldwell. I just don't want Elizabeth to become the Hussy of Atlantis.

And that goes for Teyla, as well.

And Vala.

And Dr. Lam.

And something tells me we'll never revisit Sam's love life again.