Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Whistler84]

LOL. So can I.. I can easily ship Liz with someone else... but ehhehe... the problem is John.. who should I ship him with, alien princess?

Well, um, personally, I think the strongest arguement for ship with Sheppard has always been . . . ahem, McKay. Honestly, SGA spent the most time defining this relationship that any other.

[Erised]

Well, um, personally, I think the strongest arguement for ship with Sheppard has always been . . . ahem, McKay. Honestly, SGA spent the most time defining this relationship that any other.

moahaha!!! That's so true, it's scary. I am not a slasher and never will be but writers focus on those two all the time.. They must think that repetative interaction that leaves them screaming at each other must be funny...*sigh*

[xkawaiix]

I wonder sometimes what these people are looking for in a male/female relationship. With John and Teyla, there's the possibility for a sexship but little else. I mean what would they talk about over breakfast? "Hey babe, loved the way you blasted that dude our last time off-world! That was cool!" "Thanks sugar butt, you sure know how to tote a gun!"

John simply does not go to Teyla and carry on casual conversation about his feelings. He doesn't solicit her opinions or try and help her make decisions. He doesn't try to communicate with her on a higher level or empathize with her or figure out what makes her who she is. He does those things with Elizabeth. On the flip side, I've seen even less from Teyla toward John. She's shown more intrest in Ronon and what makes him tick in a few episodes than she's shown for John in two years!

The evidence is just not there that there's anything to build the ship around or that either party is interested in doing so. The few 'maybe' lines and actions don't make up for a total dearth of nothingness 99 percent of the time.

I agree, they can talk about some good wins and fights because they're both combat specialists in their own way... but I really can't see anything passed that. I remember a cousin of mine (who is so literally my opposite that it makes some people wonder how in the world are we related) said that S/T would have more to talk about but now that I think about it, I can only see them as "boxing buddies" like what was seen in Hot Zone.

They just don't have as many leader to leader, friend to friend, heart to heart, conversations with each other like what John and Liz have. The only episodes that may show them discussing on a leader or friend level would be in Suspicion and that little bit in

Spoiler:

Allies

and what that shows is that S/T isn't very consistant or as consistant as S/W.

[xkawaiix]

Well, um, personally, I think the strongest arguement for ship with Sheppard has always been . . . ahem, McKay. Honestly, SGA spent the most time defining this relationship that any other.

LOL, way~ too much UST between them to just leave it as a brotherly love relationship. XD!

**Shuts up**

[Weir'sRedShirt]

Well, um, personally, I think the strongest arguement for ship with Sheppard has always been . . . ahem, McKay. Honestly, SGA spent the most time defining this relationship that any other.

bwahaha. But it's so true! Those two have about five times as much screentime than anyone else.

[Luz]

LOL, way~ too much UST between them to just leave it as a brotherly love relationship. XD!

**Shuts up**

These two work so well together, and yes, there is UST. I'm not a slasher, but i can't deny it, if there ever was a serious contender for Sparky it would be McKay/Sheppard, thank god tptb don't do slash (at least not openly ).

[Melyanna]

They just don't have as many leader to leader, friend to friend, heart to heart, conversations with each other like what John and Liz have. The only episodes that may show them discussing on a leader or friend level would be in Suspicion and that little bit in

Spoiler:

Allies

and what that shows is that S/T isn't very consistant or as consistant as S/W.

Add to that the fact that almost none of the conversations they've had have been friendly. Since the beginning of Season 1, when they've talked, they've been arguing or otherwise uncomfortable with each other.

Of course, John and Elizabeth have done their fair share of arguing too, but they've got personal scenes to balance it out. Those arguments aren't going to harm their relationship greatly because they have interaction outside of their disagreements. And that's really key. They respect each other in disagreements now, which is something I honestly have a hard time seeing with Sheppard and Teyla at times.

If anything, I think Teyla has become the ideological antagonist for Sheppard – what Weir was supposed to be in the first place, and what didn't work with Elizabeth.

[Whistler84]

These two work so well together, and yes, there is UST. I'm not a slasher, but i can't deny it, if there ever was a serious contender for Sparky it would be McKay/Sheppard, thank god tptb don't do slash (at least not openly ).

Just don't let Pooh hear you say this. Poor girl has enough slasher anvils to deal with.

[smallgirl]

Well, um, personally, I think the strongest arguement for ship with Sheppard has always been . . . ahem, McKay. Honestly, SGA spent the most time defining this relationship that any other.

I agree. I could see the slasher view point, though I don't share it, in season one but not as much in season two. Somehow the McKay/Shep dynamic has lost some of it's original appeal. My main objection to McShep, apart from not really seeing things through slasher glasses, was that it always seemed that it might be a bit one sided and be more about McKay's feelings rather than Sheppard's. Despite that, one of my Sheyla objections, is the feeling that if Sheppard had to choose only one person out of his team to save, it'd be McKay, above Teyla and Ford in season one and Teyla and Ronon in season two. I think it is possibly because TPTB can write better male friendship dynamics than they can male/female ones (Sheppard/Weir seems to be a fortunate accident). Despite enjoying some aspects of Sam/Jack in SG-1, if I was totally honest, Jack/Daniel's relationship seemed more poignant to me and I didn't slash there either.

[parsifal]

These two work so well together, and yes, there is UST.

As disturbing as this OT line of posts is, I have a question.

Am I fundamentally misunderstanding the definition of UST, or has its usage broadened so that, to some people, any kind of snappy byplay between any two characters is somehow UST?

[Whistler84]

I agree. I could see the slasher view point, though I don't share it, in season one but not as much in season two. Somehow the McKay/Shep dynamic has lost some of it's original appeal. My main objection to McShep, apart from not really seeing things through slasher glasses, was that it always seemed that it might be a bit one sided and be more about McKay's feelings rather than Sheppard's. Despite that, one of my Sheyla objections, is the feeling that if Sheppard had to choose only one person out of his team to save, it'd be McKay, above Teyla and Ford in season one and Teyla and Ronon in season two. I think it is possibly because TPTB can write better male friendship dynamics than they can male/female ones (Sheppard/Weir seems to be a fortunate accident). Despite enjoying some aspects of Sam/Jack in SG-1, if I was totally honest, Jack/Daniel's relationship seemed more poignant to me and I didn't slash there either.

Yeah, I've said it once before here, but I'll say it again. Since I don't do slash either (nothing wrong with it, just not my cup of tea), if Daniel had been a girl, I would have been a J/D fan. Their friendship was the best thing in the first couple of seasons, and actually, I kinda see this paralleled with not only Sheppard/McKay, but also S/W. Their friendship is first and foremost. The respect and comfort is palpable.

In the episode thread for "Coup D'Etat,"

Spoiler:

one poster commented on the ending scene. He/she said that it was so fantastic to see a male/female dynamic that was so comfortable. Good friendship. Good comradery. No romance. Now, while *I* see it through a shipper view, I still grinned like heck when I read this. People are comfortable with the Sheppard/Weir friendship and like it. I think, since it's only season two, that's the way it should be. Friendship, nothing more (for now).

I may get in trouble for this, but personally, I though both the kisses were kinda . . . pathetic. (for different reasons). One, the S/T kiss was way too hostile and aggressive and one-sided. And two, the S/W kiss was by alien entities! Not to mention, both kisses were too forced and rushed. Both, in my personal opinion, got their collective asses handed to them by the hug. Why? Besides the reason I've already stated, the timing was all off. The hug was fantastic because it was true and felt natural, yet was a complete and pleasant surprise. Even some S/T fans say they loved the hug. It was natural.

The kisses, for numerous reasons, were anything but.

[SnoggingPicard]

As disturbing as this OT line of posts is, I have a question.

Am I fundamentally misunderstanding the definition of UST, or has its usage broadened so that, to some people, any kind of snappy byplay between any two characters is somehow UST?

Nope, I think you've got the definition down pat. It's just the craziness of this thread.

[Luz]

I agree. I could see the slasher view point, though I don't share it, in season one but not as much in season two. Somehow the McKay/Shep dynamic has lost some of it's original appeal. My main objection to McShep, apart from not really seeing things through slasher glasses, was that it always seemed that it might be a bit one sided and be more about McKay's feelings rather than Sheppard's.

Yeah, Sheppard just shrugs him off, but he sure loves baiting him, but then taking the mickey out of McKay seems to be the Atlantean national sport, lol.
I was watching the Siege 3 and on that part where

Spoiler:

They all thing Sheppard is dead, the looks on McKay, Beckett, and Weir's eyes, the three of them were devastated. McKay looked almost as brokenhearted as Weir did.

But then, when have we seen Sheppard angstin' for McKay?, in the Eye Sheppard went on a killing spree when he heard Weir had been killed, he knew McKay was still being held hostage, and that it would probably angry the genii, and get him killed. Or he probably was so blinded by his rage over Weir, that poor McKay never crossed his mind.

Despite that, one of my Sheyla objections, is the feeling that if Sheppard had to choose only one person out of his team to save, it'd be McKay, above Teyla and Ford in season one and Teyla and Ronon in season two. I think it is possibly because TPTB can write better male friendship dynamics than they can male/female ones (Sheppard/Weir seems to be a fortunate accident). Despite enjoying some aspects of Sam/Jack in SG-1, if I was totally honest, Jack/Daniel's relationship seemed more poignant to me and I didn't slash there either.

I've said this before, for tptb it would be easier to sell McKay/Sheppard than Shep/Teyla. And i agree i was more touched by Daniel/Jack than Sam/Jack (this ship i never saw it, i knew i was supposed to, but i didn't see anything there).

[Bama]

They just don't have as many leader to leader, friend to friend, heart to heart, conversations with each other like what John and Liz have. The only episodes that may show them discussing on a leader or friend level would be in Suspicion and that little bit in

Spoiler:

Allies

and what that shows is that S/T isn't very consistant or as consistant as S/W.

Right. And those real 'conversations' were like what? 1995? There's been a consistent build-up of personal intimacy between Sheppard and Weir since mid-season one that shows no signs of slowing down.

And honestly, it's not what you have in common superficially that matters. So what if John and Teyla are both military fighters? Teyla and Elizabeth are both women leaders of their people. Should they get it on? (Geh, don't answer that anyone) Everyone has commonlities and everyone has differences. Shep and Weir are both leaders. They both enjoy reading. It simply comes down realistically to *who* you feel the most connection with emotionally and who you are pulled towards constantly. I've said before that Elizabeth and John are two very differing segments of the leadership of the city. They don't have to work as closely as they do on decisions. But they *choose* to do so. Elizabeth could communicate with John on things he needed to know about a dozen different ways. She doesn't have to have him at her side like glue when he's in the city. She chooses to. The same goes for John. I'm sure he could find military things to occupy himself rather than becoming so involved in the PR operations of Atlantis yet he wants to be a part of Elizabeth's world and she wants to be a part of his. They are interested and vested in the success of the other. They care about the other's failures and want to help however they can with their strengths. It has simply morphed into a very powerful and important marriage of a sort that in time, will be all encompassing naturally when they're ready.

[Bama]

As disturbing as this OT line of posts is, I have a question.

Am I fundamentally misunderstanding the definition of UST, or has its usage broadened so that, to some people, any kind of snappy byplay between any two characters is somehow UST?

LOL! I think to have 'UST', you'd have to have SWT which is sexual 'want to'. Now I don't know for certain about Rodney, but it's pretty clear that John only has 'sexual want to' with one gender. LOL! And ol' Rod did kiss a couple of *women* if I remember right. Nope, don't buy the ust between the males unless they've shown that's where their 'want' lies. I have snappy reportee with my baby brother all the time but for goodness sakes, there's a bad name if that's UST!