Wraith Defenders Club

[naamiaiset]

Tyvm, but I was already shot.

Since I'm back today, it didn't work...

*gives you a wraith and points you in keller's direction* find woolsey and kavanagh also.

[MCH]

Ohhhh, interesting posts about Wraith/Human, morals. To me it just comes down to this:-

The Wraith rule by fear, they are as you say top dog since the Ancients left. The Wraith tap into the human "fear of the dark" or maybe the "fear of the unknown".

After a society has been culled, if they where a technologically advanced they'd go back into a more simple society, being able to feed and clothe themselves at least. Over time the survivers descendants will have stories of what happened. But like the game of Chinese Whisper the stories will get more details added abit more hazy. Adding to the Human fear and dread of the Wraith.
But the dread of the Wraith can drive Communities like in the episode of Condemned season 2 where originally criminals where sent to the prison island for the Wraith to feed on. But when Atlantis turned up they where send other people who'd not committed any really serious crimes. So the rest of the community particpated in a henious crime to save their own "skins" by send innocents to the island.

The rational would be they are just trying to survive as best they can like the Wraith, the humans see themselves as the victims here it was not murder against other community members. Their lives due to the "Wraith monsters" where on a knife's edge, with the whole community in a very fragile state, so the humans in Condemned would not see themselves as Todd said to Shep “you are a lot like wraith, more than you know”.

You do what you must do to survive, the Wraith need humans to feed to live, the society in Condemned sacrified at first criminals to save the rest of their community. But later on as they started to run out innocents where sent who had committed probadely no serious crime. So that brings us back to Wraith Cake question
[QUOTES]who says we're more like the wraith they or us?
[/QUOTES]
I think the humans in PG are more like the wraith than they would care to admit. That some will do what ever is necessary to survive even if that means sacrificing others to the Wraith. People are more than capable of squashing the inner moral voice that tells them this is wrong, we can always justify why we did what we did. It was for the greater good of society as a whole ect.

Finally on a not so serious note Toomuchcaf I love the Eye's siggy and Greg siggy with the names of his priestess. Thank you

MCH

[LiquidSky]

Now Liquid Thank you that you like my stuff. Yeah we are the HAMBURGER of the Wraith and the Atlantis Station is "Wraith McDonalds" Chicken McSheppard or BigMcKay or do you want a Teyla Salat?
As Dessert you got a Rononflury

LOL That's funny a Wraith MCDonlds. And Kavanaugh can be the Mc fries.

LS

[LiquidSky]

Good night all, will probably be back in another 6 hours when I have breakfast

(jumps up and down, I reached 400 posts!)

Congrats on your 400 Post toomuchcaf!

LS

[GoSpikey]

*gives you a wraith and points you in keller's direction* find woolsey and kavanagh also.

*Gladly takes Todd and goes to look for the whiners*




@ MCH: I know you have problems with your tags, but I hope this helps (if you put them in manually):

'spoilers' is plural
'quote' is singular

So one shouldn't write 'quotes', but 'quote' instead.

I'm curious if it works like that, cos we know you've got a computer that doesn't wish to cooperate.

@ Toomuchcaf: Grats on 400!

[LiquidSky]

Here I go again I seem to post one after another. Oh Well, that's the way is goes.

We talk about the Wraith and Wraith ego. What of the three egos do the Wraith follow the id, ego or, superego. I'm thinking right now in their evolution they are directed by the id. Saying that because the id is the survival ego it is the primitive ego. the need for food, reproduction. I can link the wiki page on the three egos if anyone would like to know more about it. I don't know if that would called 'hot-linking'. Does anyone have any thoughts about the Wraith ego? Let me know if you want the page.

LS

[toomuchcaf]

Keller....
I want to see some new aspects of the Wraith in Season 5. Like a mating ritual that involves being fed upon. I think Keller and one of the Wraith-hunters would make a pretty good couple to establish that aspect in the show...

Puts me in mind of the praying mantis

Ohhhh, interesting posts about Wraith/Human, morals. To me it just comes down to this:-

I think the humans in PG are more like the wraith than they would care to admit. That some will do what ever is necessary to survive even if that means sacrificing others to the Wraith. People are more than capable of squashing the inner moral voice that tells them this is wrong, we can always justify why we did what we did. It was for the greater good of society as a whole ect.

Finally on a not so serious note Toomuchcaf I love the Eye's siggy and Greg siggy with the names of his priestess. Thank you

MCH

Totally agree about the willingness to justify horrifying acts in order to survive. It is so much easier to rationalise your own actions into being morally right, then it is to look at others and their actions, see them as abhorrent, and admit that you are like them.

And thankyou.

Congrats on your 400 Post toomuchcaf!

LS

@ Toomuchcaf: Grats on 400!

Thanks! ....scuffs feet.....its because of that chevron thread.....and the voting threads.....they're addictive.....really need to cut back ..... I am completely under controll.....

[GoSpikey]

I made a .htm file on my compo, with most threads all nicely ordered...

It's easy to use like that, instead of going on the boards there.

[Wraith Cake]

Here I go again I seem to post one after another. Oh Well, that's the way is goes.

We talk about the Wraith and Wraith ego. What of the three egos do the Wraith follow the id, ego or, superego. I'm thinking right now in their evolution they are directed by the id. Saying that because the id is the survival ego it is the primitive ego. the need for food, reproduction. I can link the wiki page on the three egos if anyone would like to know more about it. I don't know if that would called 'hot-linking'. Does anyone have any thoughts about the Wraith ego? Let me know if you want the page.

LS

Freud and I believe it's structuralism?? Or structuralist theory. I think the wraith are much like us, or Rodney--remove them too much from their food and they get cranky

WK

[Wraith Cake]

Totally agree about the willingness to justify horrifying acts in order to survive. It is so much easier to rationalise your own actions into being morally right, then it is to look at others and their actions, see them as abhorrent, and admit that you are like them.

We have to live with ourselves right? Why not justify, it's a coping mechanism. I thought it was interesting in Allies part I that Michael leaves the operating theatre after his queen feeds on a de-wraithified human. It's too close to home perhaps. No wonder he broke and fell off the deep end.

WK

[LiquidSky]

With the few posts on Wraith's need to feed, hunt and survive and If the Wraith have conscious awareness The term the three egos came to my mind. the id: food, survival and the basic emotions and the ego: where there is conscious awareness. Which I believe the Wraith posses. I haven't read much on the three egos.. Just the term the id came to my mind. And, no not from the 1950's movie 'Forbidden Planet" hence the term 'monsters from the id" So I goolged the three egos and it sent me to the wiki page. So I perused the page and got some info on it. just another fun topic on the Wraith.

LS

[dasNdanger]

Hiya, still not in a Wraithy frame of mind (riding high after Wizard World, and spending mucho time on the comic creators forum, 'chatting' with all the guys I met this weekend).

But I will make a few comments.

I think the Wraith got out of hand for the show. That's just how I see it. They were not planned out very well in the beginning, and when their popularity caught on, the writers had to scramble. They literally seem to be making this stuff up as they go. And that's fine, to an extent. But there should have been a very definite template besides appearance and the 'eating' people part. In some ways, it's like the fans know more about the Wraith than the creators do...

So...let's just take what the show has given us:

1. Carson said the Wraith are closer to insect than human.

If that is the case, then we can't assign them the same moral code as humans. From their perspective, feeding on - and killing - a human is 'nature', it is how they survive - no need to question it (unless food runs low...but moral questionings? Nope). The Wraith have no more need to question what they do then a tick needs to question sucking on a dog.

2. The Wraith feel justified in their need to feed to satisfy their hunger.

Todd said as much in Common Ground. However, he also acknowledged Sheppard's suffering, so he is aware that feeding causes his food pain. Still...he must do it if he is to survive.

3. Feeding on humans gives the Wraith their regenerative powers.

Several episodes have established this...and I can understand the Wraith not wanting to give such a 'gift' up. They can heal - they can restore life - it's not something you'd lightly toss aside.

4. The Wraith have the capacity for the whole range of human emotion, but it's still not enough to stop them from feeding.

Ellia knew what she was, and hated it. And yet, she could not NOT feed. Her conscience had been developed to the point were she knew it was a horrible way to stay alive, but she loved life, perhaps more than she loved her human father. It's a hard call...but she still did feed on him...she COULD have run away....

5. Both Michael and Todd have shown their willingness to help humans.

Of course, they may have been seeking their own advantage - but I don't think so. Michael could have turned Sheppard over to the Queen and won her favor, but instead he chose to help Sheppard, with no guarantee it would be to any advantage.

Todd told Sheppard to go on without him...he gave Shep an out with no obvious benefit to himself (if I were Todd, I would have just sucked Sheppard dry and made my own escape). He also didn't take ALL of Sheppard's life, and then he gave it back - two things he did NOT have to do. I'm sure the PTB will try to explain it away as Todd foreseeing the future and Sheppard's usefulness...but no...that's not how the episode was written, nor was there any guarantee that Todd would ever return. I think we saw what we were supposed to see - a Wraith capable of doing good, without real benefit to himself.

Taking all of that into consideration - I see the Wraith as creatures without a true 'moral' code, but with a type of code of honor, one that only they truly understand. To do something for a human is seen by humans as a cunning ploy, but to the Wraith I believe HE believes he's truly doing something benevolent - for a Wraith.

Look at it this way - heard this famous chef guy on TV - he went to some tribe, and they fed him the BEST part of the animal - the anus. *shudder* Now - to the human, that's disgusting...gross...almost an insult! But to the members of that tribe, it was an HONOR to serve that prized part to their guest.

It's all about perspective. The Wraith see what they do 'for' humans as bestowing an honor, EVEN if they are trying to gain something in return. It's just their way, their nature...and despite being intelligent, they know no other way than what their insect instincts tell them.

At least, that's how I see it - and that's what I love about them.


das

[LiquidSky]

[quote=dasNdanger;8350296)


I think the Wraith got out of hand for the show. That's just how I see it. They were not planned out very well in the beginning, and when their popularity caught on, the writers had to scramble. They literally seem to be making this stuff up as they go. And that's fine, to an extent. But there should have been a very definite template besides appearance and the 'eating' people part. In some ways, it's like the fans know more about the Wraith than the creators do...

das[/quote]

No TPTB didn't really plan on the Wraith's popularity and now they can't figure out what to do about it. Just reading your post I remember reading in a UK magazine I think it was a UK mag about a year ago on how the Wraith were suppose to be secondary villains. The writers wanted to have the replicators as their main villain but, because SG1 had a replicator story going on. The writers didn't want to confuse the fans. I'm sorry I can't remember the name of the magazine. I think it was Cult Time or TV Zone. I don't remember word for word. They all ways wanted the Wraith to play secondary villains.

LS

[LiquidSky]

Ok I don't know what went wrong with post #9382 in response to das's post and I tried to fix it but it wouldn't go. Cooking and posting don't bode well something suffers like my post . LOL

LS

[Karhedron]

9384 posts..........
Just hope nobody thinks about a rule for joining the WDC.

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