Wraith Defenders Club

[WraithTech]

I think it would be a reasonable speculation that they venerate them in some way. After all, without the Iratus DNA they would be simply human. There may even have been, at one time in the dim past, some form of worship perhaps? It's only conjecture we can offer as nothing was written about the history or societal development of Wraith. I'm prolly one of the few who hold that Wraith didn't spring into existence after 10000 years as evolution just don't work that way. And all that tech they have takes millenia to develop - not least of which is FTL drive. They aren't Sims and can't pluck this stuff outta their asses.

I think Toddy would have been able to walk into a cave with no problem, but I have no idea if there would be a link of some kind. It would make sense if there was as he was pretty clear about saying the treatment was just as dangerous as the illness. It also highlights that at one stage in their development, Wraith were not as invulnerable as they are in canon, or the programme. It does raise a flippant question in my mind though, about Todd having to carry the equivalent of a match into a cave, water in this case, because they are a tad leech-like.

Maybe they had them as pets, before they realised what role they played in their evolution?

Thanks. There is also at least 1 fanfic out there with a queen who has a pet iratus bug.

[Bajka20]

Something for Eddie and Greg.

[ciannwn]

Something for Eddie and Greg.

They're both great but my favourite has to be the Greg and human friend one.

[Shanthaia]

I'm here, I'm here! *jumps up and down*
The next page is in the stage of being coloured and I hope to have it finished within this week.

I so can't wait! *loves all of DS wraith drawings*

[WraithTech]

Something for Eddie and Greg.

These are great for different reasons. The Greg one made me laugh. The Eddie one showed off the more serious side of him that gets overlooked because of his stunning stunner and glances at Neera. Very well done!

[ciannwn]

I think it would be a reasonable speculation that they venerate them in some way. After all, without the Iratus DNA they would be simply human. There may even have been, at one time in the dim past, some form of worship perhaps?

I like the idea of them worshipping Iratus bugs in the distant past.

It's only conjecture we can offer as nothing was written about the history or societal development of Wraith.

And what little we've been told about their evolution leaves a lot of questions.

1) Wraith evolved from Iratus bugs which passed human DNA into their eggs. (Michael explains the process in 'Vengeance')

2) Iratus bugs have super regeneration powers like Wraith. ('Thirty Eight Minutes')

3) In 'Enemy At The Gate' we're told that Wraith didn't always have super regeneration powers.

So, why did the evolving Wraith lose their super regeneration ability and how did they get it back? The only thing I can think of is that losing it was an undesirable side effect of acquiring human characteristics. When they became technologically advanced. Wraith geneticists did some manipulation with Iratus bug DNA.

I'm prolly one of the few who hold that Wraith didn't spring into existence after 10000 years as evolution just don't work that way. And all that tech they have takes millenia to develop - not least of which is FTL drive. They aren't Sims and can't pluck this stuff outta their asses.

The Ancients arrived in Pegasus several million years ago according to the opening scene in 'Rising Part 1" and this ties in with how long Ayiana had been in the ice in the SG-1 episode 'Frozen'. This isn't long for the Wraith to evolve in real world evolution but we're talking about the Stargate universe here. A retrovirus can turn a Wraith into a human or a human into a bug monster in a very short time - this is as realistic as a werewolf transformation but we saw it happen and the camera never lies. Several million years to get Wraith is more than enough according to this kind of time-scale.

[Shanthaia]

The Ancients arrived in Pegasus several million years ago according to the opening scene in 'Rising Part 1" and this ties in with how long Ayiana had been in the ice in the SG-1 episode 'Frozen'. This isn't long for the Wraith to evolve in real world evolution but we're talking about the Stargate universe here. A retrovirus can turn a Wraith into a human or a human into a bug monster in a very short time - this is as realistic as a werewolf transformation but we saw it happen and the camera never lies. Several million years to get Wraith is more than enough according to this kind of time-scale.

Less than 3000 years were enough for tibetean people to adapt to the great hight they live in - I think a few million years are enough for something like the wraith to develop

(info taken from the following source: http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...ct/329/5987/75)

[Isolde]

Less than 3000 years were enough for tibetean people to adapt to the great hight they live in - I think a few million years are enough for something like the wraith to develop

(info taken from the following source: http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...ct/329/5987/75)

Well, adapt is different to evolve and homo sapiens has taken around 6 million years to get to our current stage. That we're actually stuck in the mesolithic age as regards to our physicality (generally) accounts for all the modern issues of obesity etc we see. We're built for running, not at speed, but as joggers, because we have a lot of stamina and our body's are designed to accommodate that. There are other adaptations within different races, and prolly the most famous of these is sickle cell, which as you all know, is down to maleria.

@ ciannwn: *sigh* Yeah, Stargate universe and its shonky science, which makes me want to chew my own arm off. I keep forgetting about the damn camera, and all that 'magic'.

With regard to their regenerative powers, I agree with you. I think that they engineered it, the same as they engineered themselves to feed solely on humans. That way they got all of the yummy goodness and none of the problems. Not even indigestion.

[ciannwn]

Less than 3000 years were enough for tibetean people to adapt to the great hight they live in - I think a few million years are enough for something like the wraith to develop

It took the Tibetan people a lot longer than 3000 years to evolve from small mammals or even early primates, though. On the other hand, humans saved the Wraith's bug ancestors the bother of evolving bipedal motion, opposable thumbs and large brain capacity all by themselves - it was in the human DNA.

We know that the Ancients seeded the Milky Way and Pegasus with second generation humans but how does their development tie in with real world human evolution?

http://www.scienceclarified.com/He-I...Evolution.html

Homo sapiens . Between 250,000 and 400,000 years ago, Homo erectus evolved into Homo sapiens ("wise man"). These ancestors of modern man cooked their food, wore clothing, buried their dead, and constructed shelters, but did not have a modern-sized brain. Over time, the body and brain of Homo sapiens gradually became somewhat larger.

By about 40,000 years ago, Homo sapiens had evolved into modern human beings, Homo sapiens sapiens ("wise, wise man").

The Ancients reseeded the Milky Way galaxy with the Dakara device after a devastating plague. The surviving Ancients then set off for Pegasus leaving Ayiana behind because she was infected with the plague. Perhaps they built another Dakara device to seed humans in Pegasus and second generation humans in both galaxies evolved from nothing in several million years - this, of course, is much quicker than the 3 billion years it took us to get here from nothing in the real world.

Amazingly, the second generation humans in both galaxies evolved at exactly the same rate because the Atlantis expedition found people just like themselves when they arrived in Pegasus.

So, when did the first Iratus bugs feed on humans? If it was when lunch was at the homo sapiens stage the evolving Wraith could have enlarged their brains all by themselves. If it was when lunch was at the homo sapiens sapiens stage, large brains were ready made in the DNA. Either way, bug to Wraith occurred very quickly because the bugs fed on the super fast evolving second generation humans.

[Bajka20]

Thank you girls.

[ciannwn]

@ ciannwn:
With regard to their regenerative powers, I agree with you. I think that they engineered it, the same as they engineered themselves to feed solely on humans. That way they got all of the yummy goodness and none of the problems. Not even indigestion.

On the other hand, perhaps being part human caused them to evolve an over specialised diet. As humans don't breed as fast as sheep, pigs and cows etc. why would Wraith choose to genetically engineer themselves to feed solely on humans when it meant them having to spend most of their time hibernating?

[ciannwn]

Some thoughts about the evolution of life on Earth in Stargate

http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...d-are-h&page=2

The question is whether at some point before this date a last common ancestor for all forms of life, a "universal ancestor," existed. Over the past 30 years the underlying biochemical unity of all plants, animals and microbes has become increasingly apparent. All organisms share a similar genetic machinery and certain biochemical motifs related to metabolism. It is therefore very likely that there once existed a universal ancestor and, in this sense, all things alive are related to each other.

All things alive includes humans, of course.

Stargate humans are second generation and very closely related to the first generation humans - the Ancients. The Ancients evolved in another galaxy, though, which leaves us with two possibilities.

1) DNA evolved in identical ways on two different planets in different galaxies. The Ancients arrived on Earth and found they were genetically related to chimps, mice and everything else due to this miraculous parallel evolution.

2) Anubis was going to use the Dakara device to destroy all life in the Milky Way and recreate it to his own liking. If the Ancients recreated life to their own liking with it they could have used their own DNA as a model or something. This would account for second generation humans being related to chimps and mice etc. As first living things to humans happened in several million years, evolution whizzed along at breakneck speed until homo sapiens sapiens arrived on the scene. It then slowed down to our real life rate for no apparent reason, leaving second generation humans less evolved than the Ancients, Nox and Asgard.

The same slowing down of evolution happened to Pegasus homo sapiens sapiens too.

What does this have to do with Wraith? Well, they come from a universe which runs on technobabble so their evolution makes as much sense as everything else in that universe.

[Isolde]

On the other hand, perhaps being part human caused them to evolve an over specialised diet. As humans don't breed as fast as sheep, pigs and cows etc. why would Wraith choose to genetically engineer themselves to feed solely on humans when it meant them having to spend most of their time hibernating?

My thinking is this, that Wraith had to have a home world on which they evolved prior to developing space flight. That would mean the ready supply of humans would be limited, unless we suppose the Ancients meddled with their evolution (which I also have a theory about), and therefore they would have to be generalists. After they became semi-nomadic, with said FTL, and developed enough biotech, to discover they had an interesting combo of DNA - prolly after running across a human world or two - then they would be undertaking experiments. I reckon they found out humans offered better nutrition through the experiments, and then went for it. It does give them all the benefits of longevity etc after all.

Anyhoo, am I wrong, but hasn't JM indicated Wraith are capable of feeding from other sources?

[KyshaMalini]

My thinking is this, that Wraith had to have a home world on which they evolved prior to developing space flight. That would mean the ready supply of humans would be limited, unless we suppose the Ancients meddled with their evolution (which I also have a theory about), and therefore they would have to be generalists. After they became semi-nomadic, with said FTL, and developed enough biotech, to discover they had an interesting combo of DNA - prolly after running across a human world or two - then they would be undertaking experiments. I reckon they found out humans offered better nutrition through the experiments, and then went for it. It does give them all the benefits of longevity etc after all.

Anyhoo, am I wrong, but hasn't JM indicated Wraith are capable of feeding from other sources?

But didn't Shep say in one of the episodes that they tried to feed one of the captured wraith something else but there was only "one thing on the menu"

[Todd's Pet]

But didn't Shep say in one of the episodes that they tried to feed one of the captured wraith something else but there was only "one thing on the menu"

That was Steve though... that boy is too fussy for his own good!!! LOL

(Now THIS is the thread where I always thought the serious discussions took place - inbetween the gutter talk, that is! )