Deep Space 9 Superior

[Wolf Eire]

I'm well out of the loop here lads, but I really loved 'Past Tense' as a time travel episode. I think the episode had some good guest stars, a good plot (apart from the time travel explanation ) and had some strong messages.

[the Fifth Race]

I'm well out of the loop here lads, but I really loved 'Past Tense' as a time travel episode. I think the episode had some good guest stars, a good plot (apart from the time travel explanation ) and had some strong messages.

Hi ya brother Wolf, long time no see. Past Tense: parts I & II was an excellent time travel II part-er!, I had forgotten about that one from season III. Sisko goes back to San Francisco in 2024 right after WWIII and society is divided by a Iron curtain type wall along economical lines. If I remember right Bashir and Dax are with him and after Sisko is somewhat responsible for the death of a guy who started the revolution to change things for better so he steps in and takes his place. That was a very smartly written episode that gave us a glimpse of what post WWIII society was like, which we never really saw in any other episodes from any of the ST series.

[kmiller1610]

I'm not complaining, because if its entertaining and good, who cares if they copied it from the mighty Trek franchise.

Just a few corrections:

Trek itself copied from the Science Fiction writers of the previous 4 decades. Most of these ideas came from literature. Although specific plot ideas are found in TNG and SG-1 (Naked Time TOS, The Naked Now TNG is a prominent example).

The man who wrote the Babylon 5 script copied from Tolkein, Arthurian Myths and other Science Fiction writers. There's a whole analysis on Wykepedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylon_5_influences

So some credit to Heinlein, Clarke, Asimov, Le Guin and others. Here's a good anthology if you would like to read some source material.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/044...lance&n=283155

[Starbase]

Just a few corrections:
Trek itself copied from the Science Fiction writers of the previous 4 decades. Most of these ideas came from literature. Although specific plot ideas are found in TNG and SG-1 (Naked Time TOS, The Naked Now TNG is a prominent example).

Of course Trek and every other scifi show ever made copied something that TPTB read, heard, seen or viewed somewhere else. IMHO Star Trek in general lead the way with all the modern scifi TV shows. I am not sure if you watched Farscape or Babylon 5, two of my favorites along with a few other modern scifi TV shows, but I got the distinct feeling with quite a few episodes of each respected series that I had seen this same storyline done on one of ST series before.

The man who wrote the Babylon 5 script copied from Tolkein, Arthurian Myths and other Science Fiction writers.

I have read that before, he picked good authors to emulate the series after.

So some credit to Heinlein, Clarke, Asimov, Le Guin and others. Here's a good anthology if you would like to read some source material.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/044...lance&n=283155

Interesting stff Kmiller!, thanx for the link's it was an informative and great read!

[kmiller1610]

Farscape or Babylon 5, two of my favorites along with a few other modern scifi TV shows

Since I returned the B5 DVDs to my good friend Pat, I have been reading B5 novels and am seriously thinking of buying the DVDs. The thing that is really grabbing me is that the B5 philosophy as it regards religion and meaning is so close to my own that I feel I have found a kindred spirit in the author. One would think the man has a dual personality (an atheist who REALLY honors the power that religion can have in people's lives). And while I am a Christian, I think that all religions include the same search and that true believers have the same faults and hopes. This belongs in another thread ....... So, I'll stop.

I have not seen Farscape, but must finish DS-9 first (still have not seen seasons 6 and 7, but that will be resolved soon).

[Starbase]

Since I returned the B5 DVDs to my good friend Pat, I have been reading B5 novels and am seriously thinking of buying the DVDs. The thing that is really grabbing me is that the B5 philosophy as it regards religion and meaning is so close to my own that I feel I have found a kindred spirit in the author. One would think the man has a dual personality (an atheist who REALLY honors the power that religion can have in people's lives). And while I am a Christian, I think that all religions include the same search and that true believers have the same faults and hopes. This belongs in another thread ....... So, I'll stop.

I whole heartedly agree Kmiller!, the way religion pertains to B5 is fascinating and offers a lot of things that people can relate with.

[the Fifth Race]

I have not seen Farscape, but must finish DS-9 first (still have not seen seasons 6 and 7, but that will be resolved soon).

I got seasons 6 and 7 all packed up for you young lady. I will send them via UPS on monday.

I have all seasons of Farscape and B5 on DVD, when you finish with DS9 (seaons 6 and 7 are the best!), I will gladly loan you FS and B5.

[kmiller1610]

I got seasons 6 and 7 all packed up for you young lady. I will send them via UPS on monday.

I have all seasons of Farscape and B5 on DVD, when you finish with DS9 (seaons 6 and 7 are the best!), I will gladly loan you FS and B5.

This man is running for office or something. What a generous soul .....

[Starbase]

This man is running for office or something. What a generous soul .....

Brother Fifth Race is a very generous soul Kmiller, my wife and I have known David for many many years and the guy will do about anything for anyone, especially people he likes, like yourself. Plus he has the most impressive DVD collection I have ever seen!. Aren't those DS9 DVD box sets beautiful?, by far Star Trek does the best job of packaging them!.

He showed me that TNG script and the DS9 handbook you sent him as a gift Kmiller, he was totally floored by it. He loved it and was proudly showing it off to me. The Darmok script is amazing, that is by far one of mine and Fifth Races favorite episode from TNG, and the DS9 handbook is awesome, he made me copy of each You are quite the generous soul yourself

[kmiller1610]

The Darmok script is amazing, that is by far one of mine and Fifth Races favorite episode from TNG, and the DS9 handbook is awesome, he made me copy of each You are quite the generous soul yourself

Another generous soul gave them to me. Darmok is another of those amazing Trek episodes. There's an episode with Daniel in Sg-1 that is a close copy.

[the Fifth Race]

Another generous soul gave them to me. Darmok is another of those amazing Trek episodes. There's an episode with Daniel in Sg-1 that is a close copy.

Darmok is in my top 5 alltime TNG episodes, that is something I will treasure along with the DS9 Directors Handbook, you know how much I truly appreciated it Kim, Thank You.

That would be the Stargate episode The First Ones where Daniel is taken hostage by an Unas he calls Chaka, who also loves Power Bars . Great episode!, SG season IV was fantastic, I loved that episode.

[the Fifth Race]

I got this while surfing through Star Trek sites, It is a very interesting read, a lot of it I agree with some not so much. I would much appreciate any opinions, tell me what you think.

Star Trek Reality
by Evan Stair

September 18, 1998

It has been thirty years since the last Star Trek television program aired on the National Broadcasting Company. At the time it was considered a good idea but the show had become stale. Few remember this until they watch a late third season episode. Despite the dimished third season during its original run, Star Trek has become a monumental entity.

Societal Changes
No other television show has come close to changing society as Star Trek. How many astronauts, scientists, engineers, and even writers have been influenced by this incredible creation of Gene Roddenberry? His vision was to create a “wagon train to the stars.” Influences from Westerns, fairy tales, classic literature, current social and moral issues, politics, a good dose of comedy relief and a touch of cheese cake created a vibrant, rich, timeless, television show. Star Trek, unlike most science fiction stories, has worn well. Maybe this is because it is not pure lowest-common-denominator-science-fiction: “Oh by the way we need a story to show our special effects.”

As a Star Trek fan, I dislike the term “Trekkie.” I have taken the original series and examined it under critical standards that would be applied to actual scientific experimentation. For example, in the pilot episode the unemotional Mr. Spock smiles. In the first few episodes Mr. Spock, the science officer, is responsible for “warping” the ship out of orbit. As the series evolves, others such as Sulu and Chekov take on this responsibility. In other words, the original series evolved and viewers were left to try and make sense of the inaccuracies: Well, you can run the ship’s engines from the science station can’t you?

Spin No More!
I am not as kind to Star Trek spin-offs. The productions are too tight and the characters are unbelievable. It was considered a mistake to have persons other than those sitting in front of the ship’s captain to “warp out of orbit.” Detailed, strict, standards were applied to the spin-offs probably even before the pen went to the paper. This is why the techno-generation loves the new series and I don’t.

True, Star Trek: The Next Generation, Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, and Star Trek Voyager all employ and, in fact, continue to evolve state of the art science fiction special effects as the original did. Moral issues are still examined. There are still the battles Man versus Man, Man versus Machine, Man versus himself etc. The costumes are even as corny as the original tee shirts, cheap black slacks, and Beatles boots.

However there are major differences between the 1960’s Star Trek and the modern equivalents. The spin-offs are more cerebral and also more dependent upon their electronic gadgets than their bodies. Data would have destroyed the Doomsday Machine by devising a formula to find its weakest spot for a quick phaser blast. Kirk had to destroy a starship and lose a shuttle craft piloted by a valued friend who lost his life to save the galaxy from this beast.

The original characters were more three dimensional. For example, is McCoy a racist? No, but he has a singular streak of racism as demonstrated in the “Vulcan Half Breed” episode. If you were to write a biography of McCoy you could probably fill a book. Could you do the same with the two dimensional Beverly Crusher from The Next Generation? Hardly.

Both series are flawed but the flaws in the original series fade into the human drama. The technology is the canvas of the human drama. The flaws in the spin-offs are too numerous to name but they are all result of trying too hard to be topical, innovative and different from the original series. The spin-offs remind me of modern art: cold and callous. Technology solves all problems. The original series is more comfortable because it allows the viewer to believe that man, not technology, will ultimately save the human race.

The Wisdom of Genius
Roddenberry’s genius in the original series was to put believable twentieth century people in future roles showing that the slow rate of Man’s evolution doesn’t quite keep pace with technological evolution, but it does advance. Money is not an issue in the 23rd century but strangely the arms race is still the driving force behind many of Mankind’s madness.

So what is the reality of Star Trek? Lets not give it more credit than is due. Star Trek was a television series and arguably the best ever on network television. It is a wonderful flawed collection of weekly fables which entertain. It died a timely and natural death. This death was also necessary in order to generate a clamor for its return. This fueled its current success.

However, Star Trek's final legacy will probably be defined as the catalyst which drove many to envision the twenty-first century long before the twentieth century was complete. Some believe that Gene Roddenberry should get a portion of the credit for the following technological devices: The flip phone, the MRI, 3.5 inch floppy discs, and computer monitors.

The fact is, Gene Roddenberry was more of a techno-prophet and not an inventor. And as prophets go he didn’t see into the 23rd century, he only saw a couple of decades in the future. Well, lets see if the transporter replaces the Interstate soon. I don’t expect to see that one in my lifetime. I salute the late great Gene Roddenberry for many hours of entertaining television and for being an inspiration in my selection of a career as a mechanical enginner.

[Starbase]

That is an interesting read, like you brother Fifth some I agree with some I do not. I find it interesting the parallels between that guy who wrote it and yourself both being mechanical engineers. I guess it's true all engineers are huge scifi fans especially Star Trek fans

Rodenberry does deserve a lot of credit for shaping the scifi landscape on modern television and being a "Techno Prophet". I do not mind the term or even the being labeled a "Trekkie". It's funny when he decribes Starfleet uniforms as "corny Tee shirts, cheap black slacks, and beatles boot's" LOL....

[Anubis69]

That is an interesting read, like you brother Fifth some I agree with some I do not. I find it interesting the parallels between that guy who wrote it and yourself both being mechanical engineers. I guess it's true all engineers are huge scifi fans especially Star Trek fans

I wouldn't say all but there's a lot in my class that are sci-fi fans and a few that are Trek. Actually come to think of it, a lot of the folk i've talked to do watch at least some form of sci-fi...

Sorry, meant to say: Aero-Mechanical Engineer in training. Well, at least if i'm stuck on a particularly sticky problem i could always ask Brother Fifth for some advice...

[the Fifth Race]

I wouldn't say all but there's a lot in my class that are sci-fi fans and a few that are Trek. Actually come to think of it, a lot of the folk i've talked to do watch at least some form of sci-fi...

Sorry, meant to say: Aero-Mechanical Engineer in training. Well, at least if i'm stuck on a particularly sticky problem i could always ask Brother Fifth for some advice...

That's right, brother Anubis69 is studying to become an engineer himself . When I was in school (U.C. Berkeley) studying to become an engineer The Next Generation was airing and like I have said before on this thread we all (fellow engineering students) used to gather at one of our dorm rooms and watch each TNG episode with fascination and love. We all used to debate every little detail of each episode and then talk about engineering applications to what we saw, those were good times!.

Originally I wanted to be an electrical engineer but the math was killing me and the standards at UC Berkeley were very very high, so I switched to mechanical engineering after my first year and basically breezed through it. I went on to work for the US Navy in Tokyo Japan for 4 years after I graduated. I came home and was asked by my father to help him run our family seafood (wholesale and retail) business and our antique nautical shoppe. I gladly traded in my engineering skills to run the family business, I make a hell of a lot more money now! .

So what did you think of the Star Trek blog written by this guy brother Anubis69?.