Deep Space 9 Superior

[Trek_Girl42]

Elles explained it perfectly, that was Alexander's (Julians) baby that he was having with Nana (Kira). They were married at the time (which didn't last, they divorced shortly after the series ended). Orginally they wanted to write Kira out of the show for just one season, but her willingness to continue to work and the brilliant way TPTB wrote it into the story made a very interesting arc. It is very well played out!.

That is such a neat way to deal with it- Kira could have just as easily gotten pregnant by Shakkar (granted that would mean having the baby in the picture the rest of the series, which I presume they didn't want, so didn't go that angle), but this is far more interesting.

[Missster.Freeman]

Holy s***!!!

For the S4 finale

Spoiler:

Odo's human! And Gowron's a changling? (or been replaced anyway- I wonder if he's been a changling all along since the beginning of the season) This show that keeps getting better!!! Can't wait for Monday!

And Kira having O'Brian and Keiko's baby! (Wow.....that sounds like the description of some bad daytime soap. ) Neat twist!

LOL! It's great to see someone posting who's had a few *WOW* moments. I suspect I'll be having the same reactions when I finally catchup on BSG. It's always better when you haven't been spoiled. There's nothing like a few plot twists and a revelation or two to keep you guessing until the next season.

I'm just about to start season 4 myself. I think it would be best to use spoiler tags for anything from season 5 ownards for the benefit of TrekGirl42's further unspoiled enjoyment.

[mckaychick]

I need to watch season 4 too

[kmiller1610]

DS9, new BSG and B5 as shows that were light years ahead of everything else, not because of techno-babble or cool ships and weaponry, but because of the writing and portrayal of great characters.

Big ditto on that. I'm working on my side by side story arc comparison of B5 (seasons 2-4) to DS9 (season 6-7). Not sure I'm going to write any of it up, but they are both great arcs and I've got tons of observations.

But to just cross reference a bit... scenes I'd like to see.....

Londo at the Dabo table

G'Kar and Garak stuck in an elevator... That would be the one eyed, more philosophical G'Kar

Morden meets Martok and tries to corrupt him....

V'ir and Quark discussing sex

75 White Stars joing the Defiant in the final assualt on Cardassia ....

.....

[Missster.Freeman]

But to just cross reference a bit... scenes I'd like to see.....

Londo at the Dabo table

G'Kar and Garak stuck in an elevator... That would be the one eyed, more philosophical G'Kar

Now those two scenes I could really see working. I can just picture Londo looking up at the ceiling in defeat when the table shouts "DABO!" That scene would work better with the party-animal Londo of old, before his descent into darkness.

Can you imagine how long that scene between Garak and G'Kar would be? A whole episode could be made out of it. I bet they could've done it in just one take. It would've been terrific to see these two acting heavyweights verbally sparring on screen together.

[Elles]

Big ditto on that. I'm working on my side by side story arc comparison of B5 (seasons 2-4) to DS9 (season 6-7). Not sure I'm going to write any of it up, but they are both great arcs and I've got tons of observations.

But to just cross reference a bit... scenes I'd like to see.....

Londo at the Dabo table

G'Kar and Garak stuck in an elevator... That would be the one eyed, more philosophical G'Kar

Morden meets Martok and tries to corrupt him....

V'ir and Quark discussing sex

75 White Stars joing the Defiant in the final assualt on Cardassia ....

.....

Greenies for you!

I really would like to see Londo at the Dabo table.

[Descent]

Elles explained it perfectly, that was Alexander's (Julians) baby that he was having with Nana (Kira).

Did they name him Gaius Baltar?



I mean come on.

[Trek_Girl42]

Did they name him Gaius Baltar?



I mean come on.

LMAO.....It's amazing the number of people who think that they're the same actor, they really are so very similar, anyone who hasn't seen both shows extensivly, would.

Good choice of pics.

[Elles]

Did they name him Gaius Baltar?



I mean come on.

And here we reach a dilemma.

See... I love Julian.

I hate Baltar. At least once every episode of BSG I've shouted out "Baltar should be shot."

I want to laugh... but at the same time... I don't want Julian equated to him.

I'm not mad at anyone... I'm just saying.

If I didn't dislike Baltar so much... I would be laughing my head off.

[Trek_Girl42]

And here we reach a dilemma.

See... I love Julian.

I hate Baltar. At least once every episode of BSG I've shouted out "Baltar should be shot."

I want to laugh... but at the same time... I don't want Julian equated to him.

I'm not mad at anyone... I'm just saying.

If I didn't dislike Baltar so much... I would be laughing my head off.

Lol, I really like both characters (for very different reasons obviously), and I think it's hysterical.

Alexander Siddig and James Callis, long lost brothers? Anyone?

[Elles]

Lol, I really like both characters (for very different reasons obviously), and I think it's hysterical.

Alexander Siddig and James Callis, long lost brothers? Anyone?

I like the actor though.

They're not long lost brothers!!!

Spoiler:

They're seperated at birth!!!

[Starbase]

Big ditto on that. I'm working on my side by side story arc comparison of B5 (seasons 2-4) to DS9 (season 6-7). Not sure I'm going to write any of it up, but they are both great arcs and I've got tons of observations.

There have been more than few written summaries comparing DS9 to B5 and the similarites they both share. Here is one that you all might enjoy reading.....

Similarites between "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine" and "Babylon 5"

Background: Babylon 5 (B5) was created by Michael Straczynski (JMS), who concieved the show from the very beginning as having 5 seasons, built around an overarching storyline that was written in great detail from the very beginning. At the time that Paramount was considering creating a third Star Trek series, JMS pitched the series to Paramount. Paramount turned him down, partly because it was slightly similar to their early concepts for what eventually became Deep Space Nine (DS9). JMS eventually managed to sell the show to PTEN as a TV-Movie, which did well enough in the ratings for them to agree to produce the series. Together, Babylon 5 and Star Trek started the wave of successful Syndicated shows that later included Hercules, Xena, their many imitators, and even "Gene Roddenberry's Earth: Final Conflict", which are not connected with any one network. However, as UPN and the WB network started taking over many of the independent UHF stations that bought syndicated shows, Babylon 5 eventually was cancelled after only 4 seasons, until the cable network TNT picked up the show and agreed to produce the 5th season in exchange for EXCLUSIVE rights to the first 4 seasons. TNT also produced several more Babylon 5 TV Movies, as well as the follow-on series, "Crusade". However, a personality conflict between JMS (who was not enthusiastic about adding to a show that he felt was complete) and Ted Turner (Owner of TNT, who wanted to turn the show into Baywatch in Space and dumb down the plot lines) led to that show being cancelled after only a handful of episodes.

In the meantime, many of the DS9 writers had moved on to Star Trek: Voyager, and DS9's ratings were slipping. The new DS9 writers, seeing the large fan base that B5 had attracted, decided to take a page from B5 and convert from an episodic format (episodes rarely affecting what happens in later episodes) to a B5-like episodic format. This, and a few other similarities between the two series, have led to many claims by fans of each show that the other one "Stole" ideas. So, let's look at the Eerie Similarities between "Babylon 5" and "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine"....

B5: Babylon 5 is a space station beyond the edge of human-controlled space, designed after a devastating war to be a meeting place for diplomatic negotiations to avoid future wars.
DS9: Deep Space 9 is a space Station beyond the edge of Federation-controlled space, rechristened after a devastating military occupation to keep the peace and avoid future conflicts.

B5: Both Captain Sinclair and Captain Sheridan played key roles in the Earth-Minbari War 10 years before the show began.
DS9: Both Major Kira and Chief O'Brien fought in the Federation-Cardassian war several years before the show began.

B5: Strong-willed female first officer, Commander Susan Ivanova, who is a Russian Jew, and who is in charge of the "Voice of the Resistance" when Babylon 5 secedes from Earth.
DS9: Strong-willed female first officer, Major Kira Nerys, who is a Bajoran and a former terrorist freedom fighter.

B5: Minbari Leader Dukhat dies in the incident that starts the 10-year Earth-Minbari War.
DS9: Cardassian Gul Dukat is the former commander of DS9 under Cardassian rule, who plays a major role in the Dominion War.

B5: Centauri switch sides repeatedly during the Shadow War.
DS9: Cardassians and Breen switch sides repeatedly during the Dominion War.

B5: In the Shadow War, the leaders of Babylon 5 must forge an alliance among many competing races to save the whole Galaxy from conquest by the Shadows, a mysterious and ancient race who can turn themselves invisible.
DS9: In the Dominion War, the leaders of Deep Space 9 must forge an alliance among the Romulans, Klingons, and Federation to save the whole Alpha Quadrant from conquest by the Dominion, who are led by the Founders, a mysterious and ancient race who can shape-shift.

B5: Halfway through the series, the former Captain leaves and the Station gets a new Captain for plot purposes, this was planned fromt he outset.
DS9: Halfway through the series, Worf is added to the cast in a desperate attempt to boost ratings. The flimsiest of plot contrivances are used to explain this, as well as what the hell Worf is doing back on the Enterprise in the two movies released during that time.

B5: Late in the series, Ivanova leaves the series due to the actress wanting to persue a movie career. A new and very similar character is hastily created, but the plot is reworked to make this seem somewhat reasonable.
DS9: Late in the series, Jadzia Dax leaves the series due to the actress wanting to persue a movie career. A new actress is chosen to take over her role, and some flimsy plot contrivances are hastily assembled to explain this. .

B5: Halfway through the series, Captain Sheridan gets at his disposal the "White Star", a prototype ship that is small, fast, very maneuverable, heavily armed, and includes both Minbari and Vorlon technology. It is specifically designed to take on Shadow ships.
DS9: Halfway through the series, Captain Sisko gets at his disposal the "USS Defiant", a prototype ship that is small, fast, very maneuverable, heavily armed, and includes Romulan cloaking technology. It is specifically designed to take on Borg ships, and is used to fight the Dominion.

B5: Both captains (Jeffery Sinclair and John Sheridan) have the Initials "J.S.", just like Series Creator Joe Straczynski.
DS9: Captain Benjamin Sisko. Think about it. Okay, that was a bit of a stretch.

B5: The Vorlons appear as Angels to the Narn, Humans, Minbari, and other races, since they have been manipulating those races throughout their history and grooming them for the coming war with the Shadows. The whole Shadow War is really a fight between the Shadows and the Vorlons.
DS9: The Prophets set themselves up as Gods to the Bajorans, and the end of the Dominion War hinges on the Prophets' fight with the Pa' Wraiths.

B5: In the Episode "Into the Fire", the Vorlons and Shadows appear to Sheridan and Delenn as images of people they know, and argue the philosophy of free will with them.
DS9: In the Episode "The Emissary", the Prophets appear to Sisko as images of people he knows, and argue the philosophy of time with him.

B5: In the Shadow War, the Shadows and Vorlons both use allies and client races as puppets in their war against each other.
DS9: In the Dominion War, the Dominion uses the Cardassians and Breen as puppets, while the Federation seeks alliance with the Klingons and Romulans in their wars.

B5: Wry security chief Michael Garibaldi has a checkered past, and late in the series betrays his comrades and works with the Shadows, but later breaks his mind-control and becomes a good guy again.
DS9: Wry security chief Constable Odo used to work for the Cardassians, and late in the series betrays his comrades and works with the Dominion, but later helps the Federation defeat the Dominion.

B5: Centauri Ambassador Londo Molari starts off as Comic relief, becomes a villian, and ends up as a tragic hero.
DS9: Cardassian Gul Dukay starts off as a villian, becomes comic relief and is briefly a hero, then ends up as a villian again.

B5: Features regular guest appearances by Walter Koenig, who played "Chekov" on the original Star Trek series, a crew member of the USS Enterprise.
DS9: Both O'Brien and Worf were crewmen on the USS Enterprise, and TNG characters made guest appearances in more than one episode.

B5: The religions of the Minbari, Drazi, Centauri, Narn, and other alien races are a major factor in the plot.
DS9: The religions of the Bajorans, Klingons, and other alien races are a major factor in the plot.

B5: Captain Sheridan's wife is played by Melissa Gilbert, the real-life wife of Bruce Boxleitner, who plays Captain Sheridan. Their real-life wedding picture is seen in several episodes on Captain Sheridan's desk as his wedding picture. Also, Jerry Doyle, who plays Michael Garibaldi, is married to Andrea Thompson, who played Talia Winter for two seasons on the show.
DS9: When Nana Visitor, who plays Major Kira, got pregnant by Alexander Siddig, who plays Julian Bashir, her pregnancy was written into the plot, with the Baby being Miles and Keiko O'Brien's. Also, one of the producers is married to Patrick Stewart, who plays Captain Picard, who was a guest character on two episodes.

B5: The Vorlons have been interfering in the evolution of many races, breeding telepaths to be used as weapons against the Shadows.
DS9: The Founders have been breeding genetically-engineerd races like the Vorta and Jem Hadar to use as soldiers and diplomats in their wars of conquest.

B5: Three episodes were directed by Stephen Furst, who plays "Vir Cotto" in the series, and two episodes were directed by Adam Nimoy, son of Leonard "Spock" Nimoy.
DS9: Several episodes directed by various cast members, both of DS9 and TNG.

B5: After the Shadow War, both the Shadows and the Vorlons leave the galaxy to "pass beyond the rim", and in the last episode of the series, Captain Sheridan is taken to join them.
DS9: After the Dominion War, the Founders bugger off back to the Gamma Quadrant on the other side of the galaxy, and in the last episode of the series, Constable Odo leaves to join them.

[kmiller1610]

Terrific summary...... Thanks...

[Elles]

B5: Centauri switch sides repeatedly during the Shadow War.
DS9: Cardassians and Breen switch sides repeatedly during the Dominion War.

You're forgot about the Romulans.

[Missster.Freeman]

You're forgot about the Romulans.

/edit: Arf! Best not read this spoiler Elles if you haven't seen the 6th season of DS9.

Spoiler:

Technically, the Romulans were neutral in the early stages of the war. They even signed a non aggression treaty with the Dominion and only became involved after the events in "In the Pale Moonlight."