Sanctuary Discussion (Spoilers for the most recent episode)

[majorsal]

Spoiler:

Better than Count Chocula.

He's the guy on the chocolate edition of a children's sweet cereal that has chocolate flavored cereal and marshmallows. In the US.

i'm a cereal bimbo, so i know count chocula very well.

[Chelle DB]

Methinks Sally meant someone a tad more recent than the 1880's

Yes...and your point being? John is here now too you know!

She only said one of the Beatles...
We're just not sure how many John's she's had

She certainly has a thing for her Johns does she not!

oh, i definitely agree about helen and john! i might not be a shipper of them, but i'm not blind (or being anti shippery ) to not acknowledge their feelings for one another. i believe, like amanda said, that john is her one true love of her life time.
but about helen being the one night stand type of person... i kind of like the idea that helen's not completely... what, moral? i don't want her to be presented as straight up as sam. i want the human flaws and failures to be more out there to see.
i could see wil about to walk past helen's door, and this sleepy and hunky guy walking out of her room and just giving wil a smirk passing by. wil would stop, eye brows raised, and then helen walking out of the room and just smiling at him. i could see her simply saying good morning will, and walking off for breakfast. wil would say, 'oookay', and then go off for breakfast too. first stopping by henry's room to get the word up on how often this happens.
hey, there was my first snippet of a sanctuary fic.

The woman has standards...she doesn't even drink coffee!!! If her standards are that high I can't see her being the kind of person to have a one night stand!

I'm with you Sally
Chelle your view of Helen, to me, just doesn't gel with the way Amanda describes Helen.

Oh...how so?? What have I missed?

[Tittamiire]

I can see Helen as someone who has lovers to serve a need. I'd actually see her as someone who is wary of getting in too deep in an emotional sense, but really enjoys the physical side.

Maybe not one night stands...but...perhaps booty calls and dalliances. People she knows well enough that they both know what they want and no one is going to expect more, or get hurt in it. People she might ring up for a 'date' because she wants to go out for a meal or do something romantic, but without it being an actual date. Or people where there is some passion briefly, but then they and Helen move on in their lives and away from each other.

I see her as someone, now, who guards her heart too closely to allow anyone else to break it again, so no more falling in love, but that's no reason she can't still have fun.

[NZNeep]

Female booty calls?

[Chelle DB]

I can see Helen as someone who has lovers to serve a need. I'd actually see her as someone who is wary of getting in too deep in an emotional sense, but really enjoys the physical side.
Maybe not one night stands...but...perhaps booty calls and dalliances. People she knows well enough that they both know what they want and no one is going to expect more, or get hurt in it. People she might ring up for a 'date' because she wants to go out for a meal or do something romantic, but without it being an actual date. Or people where there is some passion briefly, but then they and Helen move on in their lives and away from each other.
I see her as someone, now, who guards her heart too closely to allow anyone else to break it again, so no more falling in love, but that's no reason she can't still have fun.

Well yeah. I can see her having lovers...that's canon but totally different from the idea of a one night stand.
I know it sounds stupid to some but I believe that her heart will always belong to Druitt and I think that she's allowed herself the luxury of falling in love with others but I just can not see her as being a woman who would do one night stands.

[Tittamiire]

Female booty calls?

Heck yeah

Well yeah. I can see her having lovers...that's canon but totally different from the idea of a one night stand.
I know it sounds stupid to some but I believe that her heart will always belong to Druitt and I think that she's allowed herself the luxury of falling in love with others but I just can not see her as being a woman who would do one night stands.

Hmm...I think I could see her enjoying the occasional one night stand. I don't think she makes a regular thing of it and I could see her doing it more when she's away from home and travelling than at the Sanctuary, or with people she already knows around her. I imagine it'd be if she's in town for one night only, somewhere where she's done all the sight seeing and fancies the challenge and fun of something relatively meaningless.

But that's just my mental image.

[SamJackShipLover]

I enjoy seeing the tension between Helen and John, their past is so intriguing (?).
What Titti describes ... can totally picture it. I don't need to see any of it on the show though.

[NZNeep]

Oooh, what about Batwoman? I remember the webisodes feeling a bit comic-like... wouldn't that be an awesome crossover?

[Celandine]

I'd have to disagree to the above about Helen's love life. Maybe my thinking is confined by the boundaries of the show, which isnt always a good thing, but personally I feel Helen holds herself off from any entanglements. Sure, she may fantasize about it, but she's much too intelligent to get herself in any predicament where a lover comes calling deciding that the one night stand or 'booty call' wasnt enough, especially in strange cities she was just visiting. How would she explain that to Ashley? Besides, with so much at stake, how could she let her guard down, even for a moment, and allow every secret, everything she has worked for her whole life to be jeopardized. The Sanctuary isn't just a place she alone calls home.

I'm not doubting the fact that Helen might still look for that certain 'other' in her life, but anyone she allows in she would have to get to know and allow that trust to build up before she gives her heart and body away.

[Tittamiire]

I enjoy seeing the tension between Helen and John, their past is so intriguing (?).
What Titti describes ... can totally picture it. I don't need to see any of it on the show though.

Helen and John do have a really fascinating dynamic and interactions...and it's so looooooooonnnnngggg, which just adds complications *g*

and oh no, don't need to see it on the show, but the inferences and hints that imaginations can run with are fun too.

I'd have to disagree to the above about Helen's love life. Maybe my thinking is confined by the boundaries of the show, which isnt always a good thing, but personally I feel Helen holds herself off from any entanglements. Sure, she may fantasize about it, but she's much too intelligent to get herself in any predicament where a lover comes calling deciding that the one night stand or 'booty call' wasnt enough, especially in strange cities she was just visiting. How would she explain that to Ashley? Besides, with so much at stake, how could she let her guard down, even for a moment, and allow every secret, everything she has worked for her whole life to be jeopardized. The Sanctuary isn't just a place she alone calls home.

I'm not doubting the fact that Helen might still look for that certain 'other' in her life, but anyone she allows in she would have to get to know and allow that trust to build up before she gives her heart and body away.

I agree that she wouldn't get herself into any predicaments. I think Helen has enough intelligence, insight and control to generally avoid most predicaments and she's certainly got the where withall to get out of any that do occur with minimum of fuss.

And how she'd explain to Ashley? Honestly perhaps? I don't mean graphic details, but Ashley's a big girl.

I also don't understand why it would jeopardise the Sanctuary?

[Celandine]

I still dont think she's shallow enough to stoop to one night stands. She's much better than that and she knows it. She deserves better and I still think she'd strive for a more normal relationship than one that solely serves to gratify her flesh.

You say Ashley is a big girl but I'd have to agree and disagree. In worldly matters of combat, taking care of herself and whatnot, yes. In terms of romantic relationships? No. Why do I say this? Well, my thought goes to Instinct and how giddy and girl-like Ashley acted when the camera-man showed an interest in her. She was a completely different person and, while it was fun to watch, showed me that Ashley really has no experience in dating or anything romantic.

In regard to the jeopardizing of the Sanctuary... What was Will's reaction when he first came into the place? Awe? Confusion? Fear? The Sanctuary guards a great secret that not many in the city know about nor would they understand or tolerate. The things they hide and do behind closed doors would frighten many. Helen has worked her whole life to protect those who were different and that includes her own family. There are always those out there I think to sabotage her efforts and if she was to allow herself one night of passion where she might not be thinking clearly, letting slip anything about what she does or those she's associated with might not be the best idea. Who can you trust when you guard something so precious. The Sanctuary is more than about her.

This is just my own opinion though and I know others might disagree and that's fine. It's what makes discussion fun.

[Skydiver]

i think, maybe in the 20's or 30's, helen would have lived large. I think she would have had lovers. Probably anyone that piqued her interest.

I think, when she first started, she was all work and little play, dedicated. after about 50 years or so, and likely 'tempted' by the boys, she would have played and dallied.

then i think, around world war 2, she realized that she was 'wasting' her life and i think she hyperdedicated herself to her duty and job

I think she drove herself and withdrew into her work. then 'got lonely' and had ashley and found a new lease on life through her child

and now i think she's in another turning point in her life

[Tittamiire]

Oooh, what about Batwoman? I remember the webisodes feeling a bit comic-like... wouldn't that be an awesome crossover?

I don't know enough about Batwoman *hangs head* but I think almost any comic superhero has the potential to be an awesome cross over. The webisodes were definitely graphic novelly.

I still dont think she's shallow enough to stoop to one night stands. She's much better than that and she knows it. She deserves better and I still think she'd strive for a more normal relationship than one that solely serves to gratify her flesh.

You say Ashley is a big girl but I'd have to agree and disagree. In worldly matters of combat, taking care of herself and whatnot, yes. In terms of romantic relationships? No. Why do I say this? Well, my thought goes to Instinct and how giddy and girl-like Ashley acted when the camera-man showed an interest in her. She was a completely different person and, while it was fun to watch, showed me that Ashley really has no experience in dating or anything romantic.

In regard to the jeopardizing of the Sanctuary... What was Will's reaction when he first came into the place? Awe? Confusion? Fear? The Sanctuary guards a great secret that not many in the city know about nor would they understand or tolerate. The things they hide and do behind closed doors would frighten many. Helen has worked her whole life to protect those who were different and that includes her own family. There are always those out there I think to sabotage her efforts and if she was to allow herself one night of passion where she might not be thinking clearly, letting slip anything about what she does or those she's associated with might not be the best idea. Who can you trust when you guard something so precious. The Sanctuary is more than about her.

This is just my own opinion though and I know others might disagree and that's fine. It's what makes discussion fun.

The way you've phrased things in this post has used negative words in relation to one night stands so I am not going to respond to that because I don't want to get into a debate about one night stands themselves.

There is a difference between a wealth of personal experience and knowing that a parent themselves has a social life of their own. I was just trying to say that I can see Helen, every so often, taking some time to let her hair down in her own way. Ashley goes out to nightclubs and parties. Helen does what she does (whatever anyone imagines it might be).

I don't think Helen is bringing people back to the Sanctuary at all, so she isn't endangering it that way and she's pretty good at keeping secrets. Helen has a lot of control. Besides, a booty call might well be somebody in the know anyway, or at least in the general area. It depends how Helen knows them.

[Celandine]

I have not spoken personally about one night stands in general, but only in regard to what I feel Helen might think toward them. Like I said, I believe she's much better and wiser imo then to allow herself to think in terms of gratifying the flesh for its sake alone. I just cant see Helen having a 'fling'. Nothing in the series has really even hinted at this either so I stand by my opinion on this matter.

And...I am done.

[Alan]

Just talking about Helen's long life...has Ashley inherited that trait? And if not...and age and natural causes took their toll on Ashley...could Helen keep going on?

Regarding Ashley - To me, she is one of the hardest things to watch in Sanctuary. I just cannot take to her at all. She just feels too reminiscent of another certain young, blonde-haired, wise-cracking, occasionally disobedient, angsty, butt-kicking, tough teenager from another show. Something needs to be done with her that will make me finally say..."Yes! She's original!". Now I know at the end of Season 1...

Spoiler:

...she seemed to be able to teleport

which might be a step in the right direction for making her different. However...things like this have a habit of disappearing early on just as they start to get interesting so I'm not holding my breath on...

Spoiler:

...Ashley's teleportation thing being a constant throughout Season 2.

So I need help here guys and gals. If someone out there knows anything at all about where Ashley's character goes in Season 2 that will get me to see her in a new light please post it. It doesn't matter to me if whatever info you have is spoiler-ific or not for Season 2...I'd very much like to see it. If it helps me find something new to invest my interest in the character of Ashley Magnus I definitely want to see it.

Thanks in advance for any help given everyone!