'Defiance' (Rockne S. O'Bannon/Syfy) -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

[escyos]

Though I do find the town of Defiance itself to be fascinating, I think we need to have other sets away from the town to widen the scope of the show. For example, we keep hearing about the nefarious activities of the Earth Republic and the Votanis Collective. Well, let's see these two organizations on their home turf. I want to see Indogenes really be Indogenes, and not trying to fit in with a human society. I want to see E-Rep in New York or wherever they call their home, and see their intrigues and politicking for myself, rather than hear about it second or third hand by the time it gets to Defiance.

The show is called Defiance, its set there and spends most of its time there. Don't expect many shots of New York or Sulos.

[min min light]

The show is called Defiance, its set there and spends most of its time there. Don't expect many shots of New York or Sulos.

Defiance can have several meanings, it doesn't have to be strictly about the town.

But I'd be happy if they'd just back off Kenya for awhile and let us see more of (and about) the aliens.

[escyos]

Defiance can have several meanings, it doesn't have to be strictly about the town.

But I'd be happy if they'd just back off Kenya for awhile and let us see more of (and about) the aliens.

True but Eureka wasn't about Area 51, Warehouse 13 is not about Warehouse 4 and Star Trek Voyager is not about the Enterprise.

I too would like to know more about the aliens, particularly the differences beyond physical appearance.

[min min light]

Yes, I'd be happy if they just concentrated more on the aliens. I wouldn't mind seeing some of the rest of the world, though.

[python490]

Hoping they expand on the world and a deeper understanding of the alien species. I can see how interest in the show can decline by season two.

[Starfist]

I've caught up...! I've watched all the episodes that I missed.

There was a scene in the last episode that made me laugh. They were talking about a certain franchise. And they all turned to Amanda for the answer...

[Stargate Atlantis Girl]

I've caught up...! I've watched all the episodes that I missed.

There was a scene in the last episode that made me laugh. They were talking about a certain franchise. And they all turned to Amanda for the answer...

That was hilarious!

[aretood2]

True but Eureka wasn't about Area 51, Warehouse 13 is not about Warehouse 4 and Star Trek Voyager is not about the Enterprise.

I too would like to know more about the aliens, particularly the differences beyond physical appearance.

Warehouse 13 takes place all over the world. Voyager takes place on 24th century Earth, spaceships, planets, and other dimensions. Eureka...well actually that one managed to work out well. The reason why Eureka worked so well was because the premise of the show was fully integrated into the stories. It was all about technologies being developed in a small town made up of geniuses.

The premise was a central theme of the series. The premise of Defiance is arguably about society rebuilding itself after such a cataclysmic event as the Votan War. However we see no rebuilding, just personal relationships caught in the middle of an ambiguous (at best) struggle between unseen powers somehow (possibly) related to a secret plot propagated by seemingly secondary if not tertiary characters.

If you go towards the immigrant story aspect of the premise, it barely touches the issue. Where that issue would be more apparent (Say New York or Sulos) is nothing more than an invisible offscreen locality that we may never see.

To be honest, at this point I think it's too late. We won't see much more than a possible big reveal at the end of the season. Perhaps the second season can rectify these issues with the show. I'm afraid that if it keeps going at its current pace, a third season might either be the last one or might not happen at all.

I've caught up...! I've watched all the episodes that I missed.

There was a scene in the last episode that made me laugh. They were talking about a certain franchise. And they all turned to Amanda for the answer...

That was hilarious!

I didn't catch that.

[Girlbot]

I made it half way thru the last episode. I tire of the alien hookum ceremonies.

[escyos]

They released a map which gives some more info on North America: http://www.defiance.com/en/series/wo...-2046/2046-map

also gives some info on the UK, France, Germany, Italy and Switzerland.

[Gatefan1976]

They released a map which gives some more info on North America: http://www.defiance.com/en/series/wo...-2046/2046-map

also gives some info on the UK, France, Germany, Italy and Switzerland.

The *problem* with it Escyos is that people don't want to have to search for this information, they want it integrated into the show. I could give you a laundry list of what is wrong with defiance, but they nearly *all* come back to the premise of not explaining things *in show*, or if they *are* explained in show, they seem like mere throwaway window dressing lines. The game, from what I gather is an action based game, and the show should reflect that. Instead, we get a show that wants to focus on the drama. Now, you could argue that it adds to the tapestry of the universe, and to an extent I could agree, but that will not help the show survive *in a viable fashion*. Quite frankly, Comcast could wipe the entire cost of the show as a marketing expense for the game, and I would buy that, but that simply does not make the show......... good.
I want to like defiance, I really do, but it will not do it if it keeps going the way it does.

[escyos]

The *problem* with it Escyos is that people don't want to have to search for this information, they want it integrated into the show. I could give you a laundry list of what is wrong with defiance, but they nearly *all* come back to the premise of not explaining things *in show*, or if they *are* explained in show, they seem like mere throwaway window dressing lines. The game, from what I gather is an action based game, and the show should reflect that. Instead, we get a show that wants to focus on the drama. Now, you could argue that it adds to the tapestry of the universe, and to an extent I could agree, but that will not help the show survive *in a viable fashion*. Quite frankly, Comcast could wipe the entire cost of the show as a marketing expense for the game, and I would buy that, but that simply does not make the show......... good.
I want to like defiance, I really do, but it will not do it if it keeps going the way it does.

My father often complains when he hears news stories about things like kids in schools using iPads to read books and you know what I tell him - "If they don't do that then the kids never read". Same applies here, we're becoming more digital everyday and refusing to embrace that is why lots of shows fail. People always want more from their shows, Defiance offers that and more.

We never learn about the fate of the rest (or most) of the world in Falling Skies or the Walking Dead yet they are good shows. Defiance is in that same category, yet people complain about the fact that more detailed information is available at the touch of a mouse.

It is a 40 minute show, the most you could get is a small mention, at least for now. Maybe in the future we will get episodes that take place in other towns and countries, but the show is called DEFIANCE and so it will remain in the town (for now at least).

EDIT: Its like someone saying "There is another piece of pie for you, 1 meter away" and you killing that person for not shoveling it into your mouth.

[Gatefan1976]

My father often complains when he hears news stories about things like kids in schools using iPads to read books and you know what I tell him - "If they don't do that then the kids never read". Same applies here, we're becoming more digital everyday and refusing to embrace that is why lots of shows fail. People always want more from their shows, Defiance offers that and more.

Ahh, but here we agree, this is a "transmedia venture" which is why I was discussing/defending the notion to "techs" in the "Is Defiance a flop" thread. The problem is, "Joe average" is so far behind the tech curve it's not funny. Fact is, there will be casualties along the way, and Defiance is setting itself up to be one of those casualties. Scifi is the "black sheep" of both TV and Movies at the moment *if it is not an action fest* What I don't get is why they don't accept that fact and then slip the drama in later once the show establishes itself?

We never learn about the fate of the rest (or most) of the world in Falling Skies or the Walking Dead yet they are good shows.

Subjective, I am not gonna argue that, I have done my run of arguing subjective value calls. Personally I think FS is "ok" and TWD is utter tripe. (and that is being nice to TWD)

Defiance is in that same category, yet people complain about the fact that more detailed information is available at the touch of a mouse.

That is not their problem Escyos, it is the SHOWS problem. The onus is not on the viewer to enjoy a show, it is on the maker to make one that the viewer enjoys. Is that a two way street? For sure. No one likes the offers, the makers think the genre is dead and stop making genre shows. I will watch the shows to support the genre, but there is no power that will stop me from ribbing a show if I think the offering is subjectively bad.

It is a 40 minute show, the most you could get is a small mention, at least for now. Maybe in the future we will get episodes that take place in other towns and countries, but the show is called DEFIANCE and so it will remain in the town (for now at least).

Sure, but is that 45 minute platform a problem itself?
Would they be better served by producing high quality 15 min webisodes every few days and letting the viewers/players have some limited input in where the story goes from there? It's hardly impossible, the WWE does it ALL the time by letting Twitter of all things determine what type of match is shown. THAT is transmedia, not 13 episodes "in the can" when the players cannot affect those 10 odd hours of show.

EDIT: Its like someone saying "There is another piece of pie for you, 1 meter away" and you killing that person for not shoveling it into your mouth.

No, it really isn't.

[Nolamom]

why, for decades, have other quality sci-fi shows been produced that did NOT require the viewer to search out the rest of the story? That's the dividing line for me here. I have gotten a very rich experience from Doctor Who, Stargate, all of the Treks, Babylon 5, heck, even BSG - without needing the crutch of additional information online. Defiance is missing the boat by not providing enough for the casual viewer to get them into the show in the first place.

[aretood2]

I made it half way thru the last episode. I tire of the alien hookum ceremonies.

I wanted them to get gassed. I honestly cannot sympathize with the Irathians at all. On the contrary, they seem like an atypical gang that is merely tolerated by Defiance out of some sort of guilt just because all the gang members happen to be one race. It's not even the best put together "spiritual" sci fi race to begin with.

why, for decades, have other quality sci-fi shows been produced that did NOT require the viewer to search out the rest of the story? That's the dividing line for me here. I have gotten a very rich experience from Doctor Who, Stargate, all of the Treks, Babylon 5, heck, even BSG - without needing the crutch of additional information online. Defiance is missing the boat by not providing enough for the casual viewer to get them into the show in the first place.

Babylon 5 had plenty of character drama. It was about one space station, yet the scope and scale of the show was huge ranging from Earth to Mimbar to edges of known space. It had a phenomenal background plot to it and a rich history. It managed to do that on screen, only on screen, with much much older technology than Defiance.

That's what Defiance should do. Then it could add extras, meaningful extras, after that. The viewers could live without the extras, and those who are into gaming and web surfing etc...could enjoy the show on a much higher level with the extras. The problem with Defiance is that it barely does anything like that. The extras online and in the game are actually the essential chunks of information that should be on the show, not extras that a viewer can go on with.

I applaud viewers that are satisfied with the setup...but at this point I am getting lost. It's now something for me to do on Monday nights when I don't feel like doing anything else...and that's bad. I really really hope it fixes these issues next season.